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Featured Why is God Destroying Our Cities?

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Steven Yeadon, Sep 1, 2017.

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  1. Steven Yeadon

    Steven Yeadon Well-Known Member
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    I know from Amos 3:6 that the Lord is responsible for all the disasters that befall a city. So, I ask what to me seems an obvious question: Why is God bringing so many terrible calamities upon U.S. cities with the weather, and dare I ask, terrorism?

    I wanted opinions form others while I ruminate more on my own answer.
     
    #1 Steven Yeadon, Sep 1, 2017
  2. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
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    I wasn't aware God is destroying cities. We have always had weather. Long before there were cities here the Indian's Teepees were blown away by such storms.

    But if God is directly responsible for the storms and terrorism (maybe the first but I doubt the latter except in the permissive sense) then His goal may be to show others how much we care by the help we provide for those in need. And to show us the blessings which accompany such help for the needy.

    Our church family sent several trucks north to the Houston area with supplies, and several shallow water boats to help rescue those who were stranded in the flooding. (One of our deacons owns a local boat company and he made his inventory available to be taken north for rescue work).

    Our church family has donated tons of food and trucks to haul it to those in need.

    What a blessing to see God's people putting their faith to work helping others. :)
     
    #2 TCassidy, Sep 1, 2017
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  3. Steven Yeadon

    Steven Yeadon Well-Known Member
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    That reminds me of Orlando in 2004 when we got hit by three hurricanes that year. It was the best outreach opportunity I believe we have ever had in my lifetime for the city. Evangelistic ministries were as easy to set up as getting someone with a chain saw and some helpers together and then drive around looking for people to help. It was that way for a few years.

    Going by the spirit of by Book of Amos, I would have to say that when God permits great evil from wicked people, He is using them for His purposes and casting them aside. They themselves could find themselves accursed on earth for their wickedness, or infinitely worse, die in their sins.

    I'll have to think more on this, but I guess my original question that burned inside I now see was: Are we being punished for our sins? What sins could those be? Why Houston? I'll have to think more on all of this as you reminded me of all the good that comes out of calamity when the Kingdom is around.

    Still it seems the calamity would not come if it were not for some reason for it. For instance, when we say God wanted to do evangelism by sending cat 4 hurricanes, we are in fact saying that the soil was so poor that He had to use a weather WMD to get any big attention at all on people's eternities, I now realize, wow.
     
    #3 Steven Yeadon, Sep 1, 2017
  4. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
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    Looking for the cause of God's judgment in the lives of others may be a serious error. What if the cause lies in your life? What if God allowed the hurricane to strike Houston because you did not pray hard enough for the people of Houston? Or maybe it was me. :)

    One of the things we have to understand about God is that He is smarter than we are. His ways are higher than our ways. The Mind of God is inscrutable. Don't try to unscrew the inscrutable. :)
     
    #4 TCassidy, Sep 1, 2017
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  5. Steven Yeadon

    Steven Yeadon Well-Known Member
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    I agree to the extent that this is a terrible thing to do for individuals accursed by God. Just look at Job's three friends to see how bad this can mislead us. Jesus also warns us against assuming great sin is the answer to why people suffer backing up Job (John 9:1-5 and Luke 13:1-5). However, I guess I have a reluctance to say that this is true for something as big as a city or nation, given the Lord governs the earth with justice and guides something as large as peoples and nations (Psalms 67:4.and Psalms 9:8).

    Wait a minute I just remembered my go to verses for this: Genesis 18:16-33 when combined with Amos 3:6 and the Book of Jonah, shows that calamity befalls cities, nations, and people groups what I'll call "multitudes" because of their evil. I know of more verses that support this claim though, but I forget them. I will have to search for them.

    Now the claim that I am trying to understand why God does what He does is true. I will have to think on this and search the bible more.
     
    #5 Steven Yeadon, Sep 1, 2017
  6. Katarina Von Bora

    Katarina Von Bora Active Member

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    Steven, the Bible teaches common grace:

    Matthew 5:45English Standard Version (ESV)

    45 so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven. For he makes his sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust.


    Remember the tidal wave that resulted from the earthquake in 2004? Far more people died. There is no evidence that God was mad at these people in particular.

    Here is wiki article that lists natural disasters around the world.

    List of natural disasters by death toll - Wikipedia

    Just a thought. God Bless.
     
    #6 Katarina Von Bora, Sep 1, 2017
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  7. Steven Yeadon

    Steven Yeadon Well-Known Member
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    Thank you for reminding me about Matthew 5:45. It gives me pause and makes me ponder.

    I am also cognizant of many verses I bring up in my post #5 that show God rules the nations with righteousness and justice. This seemingly competing sentiment is common in almost all of the books of the prophets.
     
    #7 Steven Yeadon, Sep 1, 2017
  8. Reformed

    Reformed Well-Known Member
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    You also need to be careful about taking language specifically meant for the nation of Israel (and its enemies) and making a one-for-one correlation under the New Covenant. Does God judge nations? Yes. But God also set up the physical universe and the laws of physics. We can say (with confidence) that God's judgment upon the earth is a direct result of the Fall of Man In Genesis. God cursed humanity and the planet. If there is any judgment attached to Harvey, it probably is an oblique judgment as opposed to any action taken by man. That does not mean God cannot levy specific judgment on a nation, but it may also be a result of the curse God brought upon our world because of Adam's disobedience.
     
    #8 Reformed, Sep 1, 2017
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  9. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    This is the age of grace.
    TODAY is the age of grace. That does not mean all natural calamity is cancelled.

    The wheat is being gathered into His barn.

    When this age ends then there will be Great Calamity.
    such as has never been seen.

    Matthew 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

    HankD
     
    #9 HankD, Sep 1, 2017
  10. Steven Yeadon

    Steven Yeadon Well-Known Member
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    I had just been thinking about that very problem because i was reading (Jeremiah 18:7-10). Clearly God has not pronounced a judgment on a nation in centuries it seems.

    I was given pause though, by the story of Sodom and Gomorrah and the Book of Jonah. As posts #5 and #7 show, I will be searching the bible for all the verses on His rule of the nations and how it works. This is a good thing to keep in mind though, that the holy people were given a covenant with blessings and curses based on how they lived it out. That the nations around them were enemies of Israel and special because of this is something else I will have to keep in mind.
     
    #10 Steven Yeadon, Sep 1, 2017
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  11. Sapper Woody

    Sapper Woody Well-Known Member

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    This thread reminds me of when the disciples asked Jesus who had sinned, the man or his parents, for his condition. Jesus answered the disciples by saying neither, but that the man was blind so that the work of God could be shown.

    Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk
     
    #11 Sapper Woody, Sep 2, 2017
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  12. Bro. James

    Bro. James Well-Known Member
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    "To God be the glory, great things He has done."

    Woe be to those who do not give God all the glory. Man has a tendancy to glorify himself and others. This is true even after salvation. Respect of persons and vain glory are rampant in Christendom. We live in a world of narcissists including our POTUS. There are many trying to be first--on a treadmill to oblivion.

    Even so, come, Lord Jesus.

    Bro. James
     
    #12 Bro. James, Sep 2, 2017
  13. Katarina Von Bora

    Katarina Von Bora Active Member

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    I appreciate the way you treat others. We might disagree, but I've never seen you engage in name calling or rancor. It's refreshing!
     
    #13 Katarina Von Bora, Sep 2, 2017
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  14. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Yes, it's true and I own that label - narcissism - not psychotic or neurotic but self serving in my daily life.

    I am thankful to the Spirit of God for pointing this out to me.

    HankD
     
    #14 HankD, Sep 2, 2017
  15. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    This nation is being judged for national sins, abortion,apostasy,greed,prejudice turning from the 10 commandments.
    God is angry with the wicked every day.
    It is only his mercy and long-suffering that the whole world is not destroyed right now.
    Without special revelation we don't know exactly why one area gets hit and another doesn't or what are the reasons.
    We do know that God is not just a mere spectator.
    In the Old Testament other nations were used to punish Israel because they had the word of God and turned from it.
    Isaiah chapter 10 is clear that the Assyrians were a rod in God's hand to punish Israel but there we have special Revelation that tells us exactly why what was happening was taken place.
    In the case of Job things took place but we were given a behind-the-scenes look at what was taking place between God and Satan.
    We do not have that special Revelation for the events of this hurricane.
     
    #15 Iconoclast, Sep 2, 2017
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  16. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Romans 8:19-23 For the anxious longing of the creation waits eagerly for the revealing of the sons of God. For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of Him who subjected it, in hope that the creation itself also will be set free from its slavery to corruption into the freedom of the glory of the children of God. For we know that the whole creation groans and suffers the pains of childbirth together until now. And not only this, but also we ourselves, having the first fruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting eagerly for our adoption as sons, the redemption of our body.
     
    #16 JonC, Sep 2, 2017
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  17. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    He is not. He did not tell people to go build massive cities at or below sea level. He did not tell them to destroy the barrier marshes and Islands He created. He put a parable in The Bible about what happens when you build a house using foolish preparation techniques. Weather does what it does. Live close to the coast, you might get hit by a hurricane.
     
    #17 Reynolds, Sep 2, 2017
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  18. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
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    I remind you of what Jesus said when asked "Whose fault is this?"

    John 9:2 And his disciples asked him, saying, Master, who did sin, this man, or his parents, that he was born blind?
    3 Jesus answered, Neither hath this man sinned, nor his parents: but that the works of God should be made manifest in him.
     
    #18 TCassidy, Sep 2, 2017
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  19. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Some of what is happening is based upon this being a fallen world, satan permitted to do some bad things by God, and also God Himself bring some things to pass as a judgement agianst our sins...
     
    #19 Yeshua1, Sep 2, 2017
  20. Sapper Woody

    Sapper Woody Well-Known Member

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    I've already made this point, TC. But it's going ignored.

    Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk
     
    #20 Sapper Woody, Sep 2, 2017
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