10 reasons why free-willers fear accepting Calvinism

[HanSola2000]

What a joke. We understand Calvinism very well, some of us graduated high school and CAN read! Calvinism is a warpedhellish blasphemy. It is the ultimate doctrine of devils. And the only reasons Arminians don't want to become Calvinists is becasue WE KNOW it is unbiblical AND we fear blaspheming our merciful Creator, who loves all His creation.

 

[FWBPastor]

As a Free Will Baptist Pastor ( bet you couldn't tell, huh ? ), I must say that I really appreciated reading both sides of the free will argument presented by all of the learned individuals here ( I expected nothing less ! ) However, I remain firm in MY conviction of free will vs. predestination. And just to add some background, I was raised Presbyterian, graduated from a Baptist college, and a non denominational seminary. Free will is what I feel God has given us in order to honor Him. And, as the old hymn says - " I shall not be moved " AMEN

 

[whetstone]

Originally posted by FWBPastor:
As a Free Will Baptist Pastor ( bet you couldn't tell, huh ? ), I must say that I really appreciated reading both sides of the free will argument presented by all of the learned individuals here ( I expected nothing less ! ) However, I remain firm in MY conviction of free will vs. predestination. And just to add some background, I was raised Presbyterian, graduated from a Baptist college, and a non denominational seminary. Free will is what I feel God has given us in order to honor Him. And, as the old hymn says - " I shall not be moved " AMEN

Welcome brother pastor. Quick question: If you believe something that is 'vs. predestination' (no matter what it is) what do you say to the congregation regarding the verses that have the word 'predestination' in them? God bless.

Daniel Allen
www.spurgeon.us

 

[Brother James]

Originally posted by webdog:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr /> The story of Cornelius is an interesting one- and it shows that man made in the image of God has a desire to fill his empty soul with God- but cannot do it of his own accord.

Explain why God would create man with a "desire to fill his empty soul with God", but then deliberately exlude those same men from salvation? This is the tyranical, monster of calvinism. </font>[/QUOTE]Read Romans chapter 9.

 

[JohnB]

Originally posted by 2BHizown:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by webdog:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr /> The story of Cornelius is an interesting one- and it shows that man made in the image of God has a desire to fill his empty soul with God- but cannot do it of his own accord.

Explain why God would create man with a "desire to fill his empty soul with God", but then deliberately exlude those same men from salvation? This is the tyranical, monster of calvinism. </font>[/QUOTE]Before your next post I suggest you study the meaning of calvinism, which is only a true, biblical interpretaion of God's Word! You could never make such a statement as above if you understood calvinism and the doctrines of grace!!</font>[/QUOTE]2BHizown,
I constantly hear or read Calvinists say what you say. But it does not answer Webdogs completely accurate assessment.

The concept of a "god shaped hole in our heart" which some speak of , is not held by the vast majority of serious Calvinists. If such were true, a non-elect man would be at the bottom of a well, aware of his lostness, desiring rescue, but God would be dangling the rope just out of reach.

This is why consistent Calvinists believe in total inability, that lost men do not desire God, nor are they aware of their lostness. Regeneration must precede faith, because men are corpses, the reprobate have no longing for God.

Even more consistent Calvinists reject even the idea that God sincerely offers salvation to the non-elect, how could He? Even though I disagree with them vehemently, see www.pristinegrace.org, if you want to see rock-ribbed, solid, consistent Calvinism.

 

[TexasSky]

I don't "fear accepting Calvinism."

I just flat out believe it is bunk.
I think it is a Calvinists "excuse" for everything. A cop out.

"It isn't my fault I sinned! God caused it!"

 

[timothy27]

I find it amusing how non-calvinists, want to say our beliefs are not even ours and that they stem from Augustine, and that we do not even know our own history yada, yada, yada...but they think theirs is something biblical and true and all their own. When the truth is that their beliefs stem back to Joseph Arminius, which stems back to Pelagius etc. etc. Pull the splinter out of your own eyes people!

 

[TexasSky]

Timothy,

My belief doesn't stem from Joseph Arminius.

I grew up studying God's word, and praying over God's word, and I didn't even care about the name Calvin or not.

However, eventually someone stuck a name to the belief system that IS Calvinism. The more I studied God's word, the more I saw contradictions between what John Calvin teaches and in what God's word says.

I was probably a Christian for over 35 years before I found out there was a group label for people who recognize that Calvinism pushes the blame for man's sin off onto God.

 

[Brother James]

Originally posted by TexasSky:
I don't "fear accepting Calvinism."

I just flat out believe it is bunk.
I think it is a Calvinists "excuse" for everything. A cop out.

"It isn't my fault I sinned! God caused it!"

This is what Calvinists believe. This is taken from the Westminster confession:

God, from all eternity, did, by the most wise and holy counsel of his own will, freely, and unchangeably ordain whatsoever comes to passa) yet so, as thereby neither is God the author of sin,(b) nor is violence offered to the will of the creatures; nor is the liberty or contingency of second causes taken away, but rather established.(c) (a) Eph. 1:11; Rom. 11:33; Heb. 6:17; Rom. 9:15,18 (b) Jas. 1:13,17; 1Jn. 1:5 (c) Acts 2:23; Mt. 17:12; Acts 4:27,28; John 19:11; Prov. 16:33.

 

[timothy27]

Texas Sky, well now you know where your belief stems from. I have a similar story yet the opposite direction. I used to believe in the tenets known as Arminianism...free-will according to salvation, universal atonement, etc. When I started truly reading the word I came to a reformed belief. I did not know Calvin was the "founder of this belief until 6 years later.

 

[TexasSky]

Timothy,

What is your definition of universal atonement?

Because if it is what I think you mean, that doesn't fit into my beliefs either.

 

[TexasSky]

PS Timothy,

Why do you call yourself "Calvinist" is you don't embrace the whole of John Calvin's teachings?

 

[timothy27]

What makes you think I do not embrace his teachings?

 

[timothy27]

I believe in limited atonement,ie the pwer and design of Christ's death is sufficient for all, but effective only for the elect. By universal I mean everyone is saved.

 

[TexasSky]

Timothy,

That is what I thought you meant. Which is why I object to people assuming that if I reject John Calvin, I embrace someone who I view as equally wrong.

See, I believe that Christ OFFERS forgiveness to ALL men, but that Christ requires we accept that royal pardon.

Most Calvinists, from what I've read about Calvin's teachings, and from what I've heard from Calvinist on this board, believe that it doesn't matter whether you accept or reject Christ in the end because before the dawn of time God marked some of you saved and some of you damned, and the rest of Christianity is just a grand chess game where the winners and losers were already selected in advance.

That isn't what the bible teaches me. The bible teaches me that even though God offers love to all, only a few receive the gift of salvation because only a few accept the freely offered grace God gives.

 

[timothy27]

That isn't what Calvinists believe, you have been misinformed. I believe that God calls the sinner, does his regenerate work in Him to make the sinner see his need for God, after seeing this need and accepting the fact that he is a sinner, accepts that Christ is the only way to salvation, and that only through Christ can he be made holy. Once God calls you, you are unable to resist. Life is not a grand chess game, we do not know who is and who is not called therefore we must proclaim the gospel to everyone.

 

[TexasSky]

Timothy,

I think you need to go do some reading on John Calvin. True Calvinism teaches that you cannot accept Christ unless Christ pre-selected you to do so.

 

[gb93433]

Originally posted by whatever:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by gb93433:
Didn't Calvin baptize infants?

So do many Baptists every year during or shortly after VBS. </font>[/QUOTE]Do you really know of Baptist churches which baptize infants who could not possibly articulate a belief in Christ?

 

[timothy27]

Texas Sky I think you need to speak about what you know. I did not disagree with you I believe there are elect and un-elect, since only God knows who these people are we have to preach the gospel because we do not know who is and is not elect.

 

[Kiffen]

I have met many, many Calvinists who are not sure if they are the elect and are going to heaven. That is heresy.

I have met many Arminians who feel the same way.