One cannot see those false teachers as ever being saved, due to the truth that they retuned back to the vomit so to speak, would say them as in same category as those in hebrews 6 who merely professed Jesus was Lord, but shown to be fakes!
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2 Peter 2:1 shows Jesus died for the non-elect
- Thread starter ICHTHUS
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Those mentioned by people were never saved, correct?
John agrees, as he stated that salvation is due to not will of man, but to the Will of God!
according to the Greek grammar of this verse, it is "salvation" that is the "gift" from God and not "faith". Granted that no person can have saving faith apart from the working of the Holy Spirit in their hearts. The Bible says that the Holy Spirit convicts the world of sin, because of their unbelief in Jesus as their Saviour (John 16). The Bible also says that sinners have "closed their eyes" (Acts 28) so that they refuse to see the Truth of the Gospel and be saved.
Please explain. thanks
That is NOT my point here. I am NOT saying that these false teaches are heretics were ever saved, but that the Lord Jesus Christ PAID the price for the sins in their lives, by His death on the cross, which they rejected as they denied this great Truth. Something that is contrary to Calvinism.
Jesus death paid for the sin debt of the whole world, but only the Elect will have that applied towards them!
Only when a sinner confesses their sins, and fully accepts that salvation provided by the Lord Jesus Christ, can they be saved and have the blood of Jesus Christ cancel their sin-debt. By purchasing the sins of the entire world on the cross, does NOT mean that the entire world will automatically be saved, whether they repent or not, as some falsely teach, "repent and believe the Gospel" is what Jesus taught.
And only those sinners that God enables to be able to respond to that message shall!
Depends what you mean by this? As it sounds like God only enables SOME to be able to respond to the Gospel? The Gospel is the Power of God to salvation, to them that believe. As we see from the preaching of Jonah, the Ninevites repented at his preaching and were spared from the Judgement of God. God sent Jonah to them to forewarn them of pending judgement on the entire city, they responded by pleading for mercy from a Gracious God, who responded by saving them all.
That was totally a miracle from , as the Gospel itself does not save apart gromthe the Holy spirit enabling a sinner to be able to receive it!
The Gospel Message is powerful to save the worst sinner, as it is the POWER of God the Holy Spirit working in the hearts of the hearers. But the majority close their ears to the Gospel
They do not have the ears to hear, until/unless the Holy Spirit enables them to do that!
Of course the false prophets were not saved. That is exactly why "bought" in 2 Pe. 2.1 cannot be referring to eternal redemption. Again, ICHTHUS has redeemed men in hell. God forbid!
For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. -Mt. 24.24
By claiming that "bought" in 2 Pe. 2.1 means that the false prophets were redeemed by the precious blood of Christ is to say exactly that. Christ obtained eternal redemption for us by his own blood, but no man, elect or otherwise, was redeemed by his death in and of itself. It is not until a man is born again that he experiences redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins. Therefore, "bought" in 2 Pe. 2.1 cannot mean what you claim.
What does Romans 3 say. Hint...not what you are saying.
Romans 3:10-27
[10]As the Scriptures say, “No one is righteous— not even one.
[11]No one is truly wise; no one is seeking God.
[12]All have turned away; all have become useless. No one does good, not a single one.”
[13]“Their talk is foul, like the stench from an open grave. Their tongues are filled with lies.” “Snake venom drips from their lips.”
[14]“Their mouths are full of cursing and bitterness.”
[15]“They rush to commit murder.
[16]Destruction and misery always follow them.
[17]They don’t know where to find peace.”
[18]“They have no fear of God at all.”
[19]Obviously, the law applies to those to whom it was given, for its purpose is to keep people from having excuses, and to show that the entire world is guilty before God.
[20]For no one can ever be made right with God by doing what the law commands. The law simply shows us how sinful we are.
[21]But now God has shown us a way to be made right with him without keeping the requirements of the law, as was promised in the writings of Moses and the prophets long ago.
[22]We are made right with God by placing our faith in Jesus Christ. And this is true for everyone who believes, no matter who we are.
[23]For everyone has sinned; we all fall short of God’s glorious standard.
[24]Yet God freely and graciously declares that we are righteous. He did this through Christ Jesus when he freed us from the penalty for our sins.
[25]For God presented Jesus as the sacrifice for sin. People are made right with God when they believe that Jesus sacrificed his life, shedding his blood. This sacrifice shows that God was being fair when he held back and did not punish those who sinned in times past,
[26]for he was looking ahead and including them in what he would do in this present time. God did this to demonstrate his righteousness, for he himself is fair and just, and he declares sinners to be right in his sight when they believe in Jesus.
[27]Can we boast, then, that we have done anything to be accepted by God? No, because our acquittal is not based on obeying the law. It is based on faith.
In ICHTHUS' view, the death, burial, and resurrection never saved one soul. It only makes ppl savable.
It's only after the God hater does his/her part that God can save them. Yeah, riiiiiight...
FYI, the dead can NOT hear.
tell me this. It is admitted by all the Calvinists that I have read, that Mark 16:15, to the preach the Gospel to EVERY CREATURE, is that that, EVERYONE that ever shall live from the time of Adam, till Christ's Return. The question is, WHY preach to those who CANNOT HEAR the Gospel? Surely, God being God, and Almighty in Power, is able to have the Gospel Message preached to only those who are the chosen, rather than randomly to EVERYONE?
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