Cain's motivation to run....

[exscentric]

From Crosswalk's enews this morning.

"Cain on Presidential Run: 'God's Been in This From the Beginning'
[FONT=&quot]
"Republican presidential candidate Herman Cain says he didn't want to run for president, but God wanted him to, OneNewsNow.com reports. That's why, Cain says, he believes "God's been in this from the beginning." He said when he felt God calling him to run for president, he resisted like Moses did after being called by God to lead the Hebrews out of Egypt. Like Moses, Cain said he told God: "You've got the wrong person. You can't be talking about me." He said it then took many "conversations with God" to overcome his reluctance to run. A poll released Tuesday shows Cain and Mitt Romney tied for first place -- each favored by 21 percent of Republicans surveyed -- while former frontrunner Rick Perry has dropped to 11 percent."[/FONT]

 

[Ruiz]

From Crosswalk's enews this morning.

"Cain on Presidential Run: 'God's Been in This From the Beginning'
[FONT=&quot]
"Republican presidential candidate Herman Cain says he didn't want to run for president, but God wanted him to, OneNewsNow.com reports. That's why, Cain says, he believes "God's been in this from the beginning." He said when he felt God calling him to run for president, he resisted like Moses did after being called by God to lead the Hebrews out of Egypt. Like Moses, Cain said he told God: "You've got the wrong person. You can't be talking about me." He said it then took many "conversations with God" to overcome his reluctance to run. A poll released Tuesday shows Cain and Mitt Romney tied for first place -- each favored by 21 percent of Republicans surveyed -- while former frontrunner Rick Perry has dropped to 11 percent."[/FONT]

God has been wrongfully blamed for too many horrible decisions in life. I think someone needs to defend God from people who say "God called me to run" mentality. Don't blame God.

 

[sag38]

Just because God has never spoken to you doesn't mean that He hasn't spoken to others.

 

[Ruiz]

Just because God has never spoken to you doesn't mean that He hasn't spoken to others.

Sag,

So, do you believe in modern divine revelation today? Do you believe we should add to the Bible today?

 

[sag38]

So, I guess God doesn't lead anyone anymore. I just made my own mind up to go into the pastorate. God didn't lead me. I'm glad you are here to set us all straight on such matters.

 

[Robert Snow]

I imagine Cain thinks this to be true, and perhaps it is, who knows.

The problem is if Cain isn't able to actually win the White House, it makes God look like a loser, if indeed He did call Cain to run. To use his Moses analogy, God told Moses to go to Pharaoh, and let me add, God saw to it that Moses did just that.

 

[sag38]

I don't think running is equivalent with winning. Cain didn't say that he was going to win the nomination. He is just convinced that it is in God's will for him to run for office.

 

[Ruiz]

So, I guess God doesn't lead anyone anymore. I just made my own mind up to go into the pastorate. God didn't lead me. I'm glad you are here to set us all straight on such matters.

Here is his problem with his statement, is deems of certainty. Can Providential events be used to conclude it is the best direction? Yes! However, to say "God told me" is wrought with theological problems.

I don't have a problem with someone saying that things providentially seemed in place and I felt I could bring glory to God in my run for President. However, when you say, "God told me" I think you uplift yourself to receiving divine revelation or that you are absolutely certain it was from God. I am not convinced.

As for you being a Pastor, the Puritans understood Providence in this issue as well. They said that there are three criteria for a Pastor on whether he is called.

1. Qualifications- if you are not qualified, you are not called.
2. Gifting- If you have no Pastorly gift, you are not called.
3. Called and appointed by a Church and other Pastors- if you are not called by a church, you may later be called, but you are not now.

We look for a mystical call, but the calling to the pastorate is not based upon hearing God's voice, but Biblical Standards.

 

[exscentric]

"As for you being a Pastor, the Puritans understood Providence in this issue as well. They said that there are three criteria for a Pastor on whether he is called.

1. Qualifications- if you are not qualified, you are not called.
2. Gifting- If you have no Pastorly gift, you are not called.
3. Called and appointed by a Church and other Pastors- if you are not called by a church, you may later be called, but you are not now."

Ah, the Puritans are our standard now it would seem. The Bible mentions the Holy Spirit's activity in the believers life, sorry the Puritans failed to see that.

So, under their thinking you would have to finish all your education before God could call you.

If you are not called till fully qualified you would not know if you were gifted until a similar point.

There is only one call, that of the local church --- humm they sure left God out a lot.

I think the term "conversations" could use some explaining as well by the candidate.

 

[Ruiz]

"As for you being a Pastor, the Puritans understood Providence in this issue as well. They said that there are three criteria for a Pastor on whether he is called.

1. Qualifications- if you are not qualified, you are not called.
2. Gifting- If you have no Pastorly gift, you are not called.
3. Called and appointed by a Church and other Pastors- if you are not called by a church, you may later be called, but you are not now."

Ah, the Puritans are our standard now it would seem. The Bible mentions the Holy Spirit's activity in the believers life, sorry the Puritans failed to see that.

So, under their thinking you would have to finish all your education before God could call you.

If you are not called till fully qualified you would not know if you were gifted until a similar point.

There is only one call, that of the local church --- humm they sure left God out a lot.

I think the term "conversations" could use some explaining as well by the candidate.

You stereotype their view. There is nothing about finishing your education before going into ministry. Rather, you must be qualified. They did not use any qualifications, but I Timothy 3 as their qualifications.

If you do not have the Spiritual gifts, you cannot be a Pastor. Do you want a Pastor who is unable to communicate? Do you want a Pastor who does not know how to study? Within I Timothy 3 there is intrinsic in the qualifications giftings, that you can rule your household well. If you don't have the proper giftings you can't be a pastor.

Besides your misconceptions, what is it about this that you don't agree? Do you want someone who does not meet the qualifications, have no giftings, and is not called to be a Pastor?

You are making an argument from the silence of Scripture. The Puritans made it from what the Bible said. They said that you are not called into the ministry if you fail to meet the qualifications, giftings, or called by a church. You seem to hold that some mystical aspect must be involved, something that is not seen in I Timothy 3. When Titus was told to appoint Elders, he was given a list of giftings and qualifications to decide who was to be appointed. He was not told, "Find someone 'called' to be a Pastor."

 

[Robert Snow]

I don't think running is equivalent with winning. Cain didn't say that he was going to win the nomination. He is just convinced that it is in God's will for him to run for office.

You are correct. But, months or years from now, how will this be remembered.

BTW, I like a lot of what Cain says, he doesn't talk like a politician. But, like I said, his 9-9-9 plan causes me some concern.

 

[SBCPreacher]

I don't think running is equivalent with winning. Cain didn't say that he was going to win the nomination. He is just convinced that it is in God's will for him to run for office.

Agreed :applause:

 

[exscentric]

"You stereotype their view. There is nothing about finishing your education before going into ministry. Rather, you must be qualified. They did not use any qualifications, but I Timothy 3 as their qualifications."

No, I responded to what was posted. Seemed rather simplistic and without a lot of info to go on.

I Tim. 3 qualifications is info not given, that helps one understand your post.

"Do you want a Pastor who is unable to communicate? Do you want a Pastor who does not know how to study?"

Ya, sure I do, what a silly response.

"Within I Timothy 3 there is intrinsic in the qualifications giftings, that you can rule your household well. If you don't have the proper giftings you can't be a pastor."

Gift of pastor teacher does not gurante ruling household well - two different things - one is gift one is qualification.

"Do you want someone who does not meet the qualifications, have no giftings, and is not called to be a Pastor?"

Again, ya sure, how silly.

Qualification does not imply gift, many can be qualified and not called. One can be called and not qualified, but become qualified over time.

Noticed you did not mention the one call by the church nor the leaving out of the Spirit in the call. Not that I think the Puritans believed either, if they did some footnotes would be great.