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Featured Calvinism started with John Calvin True or false?

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by evangelist6589, Mar 23, 2017.

  1. MennoSota

    MennoSota Well-Known Member
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    Luther gets an entire denomination. So does Menno Simons. Would you be upset to be called a Lutheran? Calvin is connected with helping point people back to the Bible and salvation by grace alone after the church at Rome had gone radically off the path. He and Luther deserve our respect.
    No one worships Calvin, but we do identify with his efforts to let the Scriptures speak for themselves and not be interpreted by tradition and presuppositions. That is a very admirable trait.
    Your being upset with Calvin seems odd. What he observed in the Bible is what you experienced in your conversion. You should be thankful that someone systematized what you experienced.
     
  2. JohnBaptistHenry

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    TULIP CALVINISM REFUTED BY SCRIPTURE
    Compiled by John Henry

    INTRODUCTION:

    Calvinism is a man made philosophy depending on fallible human logic which total ignores many clear Scriptures, perverts many, and misuses others. Long before John Calvin's time the teaching was presented by the Roman Catholic heretic Augustine. Here are some Scriptures soundly refute the errors of the Calvinist TULIP:

    T = TOTAL INABILITY (Called in Calvinism, Total Depravity, but actually taught as the Total Inability of man to choose Truth. The Calvinist plays many such word games. The Word of God teaches that God created man with the ability to reason, choose, and receive Truth.):

    Ephesians 2:8: "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God."

    Romans 10:17: "So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the Word of God."

    James 1:21: "Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and RECEIVE with meekness the engrafted Word, which is able to save your souls."

    Isaiah1:18: "Come now, and let us REASON together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool."

    Deuteronomy 30:19: "I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore CHOOSE LIFE, that both thou and thy seed may live."

    Joshua 24:15: "And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, CHOOSE you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD."

    Psalm 119:30, 111, 173: "I have CHOSEN The Way of Truth: Thy Judgments have I laid before me....Thy Testimonies have I taken as an heritage for ever: for They are the rejoicing of my heart....Let Thine hand help me; for I have chosen Thy Precepts."

    John 1:12: "But as many as RECEIVED him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name."

    2 Timothy 1:12: "...I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I have COMMITTED unto him against that day."

    U = UNCONDITIONAL ELECTION (Calvinism teaches that God selects those who are to be saved without any condition, but the Bible teaches that there is one condition to salvation: the turning in repentance from sin in faith to God.):

    1 Peter 1:2: "Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ..."

    2 Thessalonians 2:13: "...God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the Truth."

    Acts 20:21: "Testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ."

    Luke 7:50: "... Thy faith hath saved thee ..."

    Ephesians 2:8: "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God."

    L = LIMITED ATONEMENT (Calvinism teaches that Christ died only for the elect, but the Bible teaches that He died for all mankind. The reason not all are saved is because they failed to repent and receive the Saviour, not because He didn't provide for their salvation.):

    Isaiah 53:6: "All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us ALL."

    1 Timothy 4:10: "For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of ALL MEN, specially of those that believe."

    1 John 2:2: "And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of THE WHOLE WORLD."

    Hebrews 2:9: "But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that He by the grace of God should taste death for EVERY MAN."

    1 Timothy 2:4: "Who will have ALL MEN to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the Truth."

    I = IRRESISTIBLE GRACE (Calvinism teaches that God's grace for salvation cannot be resisted, but the Word of God says it can be resisted):

    Lamentations 3:35-36: "To turn aside the right of a man before the face of the most High, To subvert a man in his cause, the Lord approveth not."

    Matthew 23:37: "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and YE WOULD NOT!"

    John 5:39-40: "Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. And YE WILL NOT come to me, that ye might have life."

    Acts 7:51: "Ye stiff-necked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always RESIST the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye."

    Proverbs 1:24-26: "Because I have called, and YE REFUSED; I have stretched out my hand, and no man regarded; But ye have set at nought all my counsel, and would none of my reproof: I also will laugh at your calamity; I will mock when your fear cometh."

    Proverbs 29:1: "He, that being often reproved HARDENETH HIS NECK, shall suddenly be destroyed, and that without remedy."

    P = PERSEVERANCE (The Bible teaches preservation of the saints; not perseverance of the saints):

    Jude 1: "... to them that are sanctified by God the Father, and PRESERVED in Jesus Christ..."

    1 Thessalonians 5:23-24: "And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly: and I pray God your whole spirit and soul, and body be PRESERVED blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. Faithful is he that calleth you, who also will do it. "

    John 10:27-29: "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life: and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all, and no man is able to pluck them out of my Fathers hand."

    Colossians 3:3-4: "For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God. When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory."

    Hebrews 7:25: "Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them."

    CONCLUSION:

    Calvinism clearly errs from the teaching of the Word of God on all 5 points of it's TULIP. The logical conclusion of Calvinism is that God is an unfair respecter of persons who chooses people to salvation, not according to any standard that He established, but arbitrarily. This strikes at the love and justice of God, contradicts the fact that Christ gave his life for ALL, and rejects man's responsibility to choose and love his Creator.

    Proverbs 24:23: "... It is not good to have respect of persons in judgment."

    Acts 10:34-35: "... Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons: But in every nation he that feareth Him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with Him."

    John 6:28-29: "... What shall we do, that we might work the works of God? ... This is the work of God, that ye believe on Him whom He hath sent.

    Ephesians 2:8: "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God."
     
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  3. Saved-By-Grace

    Saved-By-Grace Well-Known Member

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    I have shown on my post on John 3:16, that John Calvin did not believe in or teach "limited atonement". This is a unbiblical "heresy"
     
  4. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
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    Wow. Just wow!

    1. T: Post denies the universal effect of the fall. There is some part of man that did not fall.

    2. U: Post teaches salvation by good works.

    3. L: Post teaches Universalism.

    4. I: Post teaches that God's Grace fails to accomplish that which God intended.

    5. P: Post denies eternal security.
     
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  5. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    Calvinism did start after Calvin. The doctrine that would become known as Calvinism greatly pre-dated Calvin.
     
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  6. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    I fully agree. One of my pastor friends who is by many standards a hyper Calvinist, says quite regularly "Calvin was not a Calvinist."
     
  7. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    Definitions are important. What are the beliefs of a hyper-Calvinist in your opinion?
     
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  8. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    In short, using strict Calvinism as an excuse to be lazy and not evangelize. Note, I did not say I believe Calvinism suggests laziness.
     
  9. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    Well, your definition is not what constitutes historic Hyper-Calvinism.

    Folks who hold to hyper-Calvinism deny duty faith. That is, they deny that one has to have faith to believe. Granted, the Calvinist (not the H-C) believes that only God can grant saving faith.

    H-Cs do not believe it is the responsibility of people to repent and believe.

    H-Cs do not believe in the free proclamation of the Gospel --indiscriminate preaching of the Word.

    The above items I believe are the main factors of Hyper-Calvinism.

    You don't have the right to make up stuff.
     
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  10. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    This concerns your closing clause. Yes, these were developed further, but four out of the five were clearly taught by Calvin. The fuzzy one concerns "L".
     
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  11. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    John Calvin was interested in Bible truth being expounded in all nations --- especially within Europe. Certainly he had an abiding interest in his home country of France. He was instrumental in Brazilian missions (although it proved to be a failure) too.

    Take a gander at his correspondence. He took a keen interest in Poland, Italy, England and many others. He prayed fervently for their citizens and Christian leaders. He dedicated many commentaries and sermons to leaders of these nations.

    To say he wasn't interested in English and Scottish reformations is patently wrong.
     
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  12. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I believe that Calvin may have been a 5 point Calvinist based on the doctrine he had already established. When he articulated his position of the atonement by placing Christ's redemptive work into the context of judicial justice (when he developed Penal Substitution Theory) what he developed was a context that leads naturally to a limited atonement. If our sins are paid by God punishing Jesus with the punishment set aside for us (Calvin associated this with Jesus descending into Hell) and this is on an individual basis (rather than for the human race) then the only logical conclusion I can see is an atonement limited at the cross

    My question is whether or not John Calvin viewed this atonement as Christ suffering our punishment on an individual basis rather than corporately (as representative of man). If the former then it seems he had to believe in limited atonement if pressed on the issue. If the latter, then perhaps not in the same way that Calvinism often presents the doctrine.

    I don't know where he stood on that point, but I think it is necessary to learn if we really want to look at the issue. Perhaps you may have more insight here.
     
  13. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    Regarding The Institutes Of The Christian Religion -- Herman J. Selderhuis has a chapter in the Calvin Handbook called Types --The Institutes.
    "The fact that that Calvin wrote in Latin and that no French edition of the 1536 volume is available -- although he indicated his intention to write a French edition (CO 10b, 63,64) --indicates that he was not thinking of believers in France only." (p.202)

    "However much the book grew in the course of Twenty years and became a full-fledged dogmatic textbook, it remained a book whose intent was to strengthen people in [ piety -Rip] and to help them understand the Scriptures better so that they might know Christ and his salvation better."
     
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