1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Featured Christ died for the dead in hell?

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Duzt, Dec 14, 2017.

  1. Duzt

    Duzt New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2017
    Messages:
    17
    Likes Received:
    3
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I encountered this fellow claiming that Jesus died for the sins of the elect, (which I refuted with Jn 3:16) and now wants to question the scope of His atonement with a question:

    "So, if you agree that Jesus died for everybody's sins, you have to agree that He also died for the sins of the souls in Hell, right?"

    I disagree because according to Mt 22:32, Jesus is the God of the living, and not of the dead.

    Any thoughts also you would like to emphasize, brethren?
     
  2. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
    Administrator

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2005
    Messages:
    20,080
    Likes Received:
    3,490
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Jesus died for all, but atoned only for elect believers.
     
  3. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Messages:
    21,242
    Likes Received:
    2,305
    Faith:
    Non Baptist Christian
    "Duzt,


    [I encountered this fellow claiming that Jesus died for the sins of the elect, ]

    He was correct....how else would you believe they are saved?

    [(which I refuted with Jn 3:16)]
    Maybe in your mind, but Jn3 does not refute truth, but adds to it.

    [ and now wants to question the scope of His atonement with a question:]

    That is okay...
    ["So, if you agree that Jesus died for everybody's sins, you have to agree that He also died for the sins of the souls in Hell, right?"]
    Good question...looks as if you cannot answer it...
    [I disagree because according to Mt 22:32, Jesus is the God of the living, and not of the dead.]

    This does not answer the question at all...in fact it is you avoiding the real question and misunderstanding the verse.
    [Any thoughts also you would like to emphasize, brethren?]


    Yes...try and answer his question again...
     
  4. thatbrian

    thatbrian Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2008
    Messages:
    2,686
    Likes Received:
    389
    Faith:
    Baptist
    If Jesus died for the sins of every person in the world, then there would be no Hell in the first place.

    Christ's atoning work was for His elect.
     
  5. Duzt

    Duzt New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2017
    Messages:
    17
    Likes Received:
    3
    Faith:
    Baptist
    It seems we can conclude then that Christ died for the sins of the world, and yet only the elect (who believes in Him) will be saved.

    But still the question stands... If Christ died for everybody, does it also mean that He died for those who are now being punished in Hell for their sins and denying Christ?
     
  6. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2010
    Messages:
    8,817
    Likes Received:
    2,106
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Christ died for the sins of the world, not in the sense of every single person who ever lived, but in the sense of Jew and Gentile, Pharisee and publican, rich and poor, everyone who believes in Him (John 3:16 ;)).
    Exactly. :) But He didn't do that. He laid down His life for the sheep (John 10:11).
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  7. SheepWhisperer

    SheepWhisperer Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2017
    Messages:
    590
    Likes Received:
    46
    Faith:
    Baptist
    God so loved "the world", the Bible says. God loved every single person who ever lived or ever will live. But after one dies, his "day of grace" is over. The rich man in Hell is one example.

    The Bible says that Jesus is the propitiation for the sins of the whole world. That means He satisfied God's requirement to atone for every sin that has ever been committed by every sinner. It goes by the same principle as outlined in Deuteronomy 30:19

    Deuteronomy 30:19 says "choose life".. Choose Jesus as Wonderful, Counselor and Prince of Peace now, or reject Him and experience Him as terrible, Mighty God later.

    For the LORD most high is terrible; he is a great King over all the earth.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Funny Funny x 1
  8. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Bingo, we have a winner here
     
  9. saved and sure

    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2007
    Messages:
    136
    Likes Received:
    4
    Faith:
    Baptist
    What scripture or scriptures support your statement?
     
  10. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
    Administrator

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2005
    Messages:
    20,080
    Likes Received:
    3,490
    Faith:
    Baptist
    All of them. :)
     
  11. thatbrian

    thatbrian Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2008
    Messages:
    2,686
    Likes Received:
    389
    Faith:
    Baptist
    "God so loved the world" is not the same thing as, "God loved every single person who ever lived or ever will live."

    Are you a Universalist?
     
  12. SheepWhisperer

    SheepWhisperer Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2017
    Messages:
    590
    Likes Received:
    46
    Faith:
    Baptist
    No. Many will go to Hell because they chose to reject Jesus. Correct me if I' wrong but, ''universalists'' believe God just saves everyone.
     
  13. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    52,013
    Likes Received:
    3,649
    Faith:
    Baptist
    God's atoning work is for the elect. We become elect when we believe. John 1:12
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  14. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
    Administrator

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2005
    Messages:
    20,080
    Likes Received:
    3,490
    Faith:
    Baptist
    That is not what it means, and that is not what it says. It says He is the propitiation (satisfaction) for the sins of the whole world (sufficient for all) but He does not atone for any sins except those who believe.

    To suggest a person whose sins have been atonement for still goes to hell makes the cross to be of none effect.

    How in the world does a person who has no sin (all atoned - paid for) end up in hell? What nonsense!
     
  15. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
    Administrator

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2005
    Messages:
    20,080
    Likes Received:
    3,490
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I have a lot more respect for that position than for SheepWhisperer's nonsense.

    The only difference I would have with you would be that I believe we are elect (chosen) in Him before the foundation of the world. (Eph. 1:4.)
     
  16. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    God has a special love towards those of us that He is in a Covenant relationship now with!
     
  17. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    52,013
    Likes Received:
    3,649
    Faith:
    Baptist
    We were. Before the foundation of the world God decided that those who believe will be elect. John 1:12
     
    #17 Revmitchell, Dec 16, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 16, 2017
    • Funny Funny x 1
  18. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    We were. Before the foundation of the world God decided that those who believe will be elect. John 1:12[/QUOTE]
    Those who believe were his elect chosen by Him.
     
  19. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    52,013
    Likes Received:
    3,649
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Those who believe were his elect chosen by Him.[/QUOTE]

    It does not say that.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  20. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    It does not say that.[/QUOTE]
    Regeneration then faith
     
Loading...