Church of Christ Debate

A couple of associated thoughts....

Assuming baptism is a command and to be obeyed (which it seems to be), why do we tell people to wait until the next time there is a special "baptism" service to be baptized? Seems odd that we tell them to delay obedience. If you can't immediately submit to something relatively simple like baptism, how would one expect to be obedient to the more difficult things?

A couple of years ago, a young lady came forward having been saved during the service. She wanted to be baptized at the end of the service. Wouldn't take no for an answer. She said, "There's water. Why can't we do it now?" This really threw people out of kilter. Uh....we have never done it that way before....:laugh:


The Ethiopian eunuch and Phillipian jailer took immediate action. Why shouldn't everyone?

 

Did YOU?.....

 

Yep. On a week night. As did both of my daughters when they were saved.

 

Shotgun,

Ask your MIL to find where Jesus got off the cross and baptized the thief next to Him.



(I grew up church of Christ )

 

Even animals are "born of water" if you're saying that phrase means physical birth, but animals are not born again in the spiritual sense.

Also, if being "born of water" is a requirement for salvation, what happens to babies that aren't born?

 

Being "born of water" i believe is being regenerated through the Word,

"That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word." (Eph 5:25)

"Wherewithal shall a young man cleanse his way? by taking heed thereto according to thy word." Psalms 119:9

"Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost." Titus 3:5

"Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever." 1 Peter 1:23

The Word & the Spirit working together as the means of God's grace produce new life in the believing sinner.

 

Being born again has nothing to do with water baptism. You might say it has to do with baptism of the Holy Spirit.

 

I have a lot of sincere discussions with Church of Christ members and they to like to throw out there Jesus statement to Nicodemus but it is simply a case of quoting their denomination's interpretation and not studying for themselves. Christ is obviously describing the two births of a believer. 1. Water: the womb 2. Spirit: salvation. Otherwise Nicodemus would not have responded in disbelief that a man must be born twice. Christ is addressing a very educated man and takes salvation down to the lowest factor. We are born of our mother's womb and to have eternal life we must also be born of the Spirit.

 

Why is water a reference to his mother's womb?

What does being born of a woman has to do with entering the Kingdom?

As you said, "Nicodemus was a very educated man."

 

I believe Christ refers back to natural birth in Verse 6 to eliminate any confusionhe has shown a comparison that physical birth provides life but to see the Kingdom of heaven man must also be born of the spirit. Otherwise why does he speak of birth of the flesh in V.6

 

What happens when a woman is about to give birth? Her water breaks.

 

Now I can understand "flesh" as a reference to physical birth, but water?

Do you have scripture reference that "water" ever refers to physical birth?

 

Simplicity

We can find ourselves sometimes buried in over interpretation, Man has a propensity to seek new revelation. Christ taught in many ways, sermons, stories, quoting scripture but He consistantly explained what He taught in the simplist manner possible. Do we need to go further than His cry from the cross "It is finished" to understand that the acts of man (baptism) can never inhance His death and resurection. We accept salvation by our dependence on Christ we then obey through baptism.

 

Every one of Christ's figurative expressions always had a biblical precedent.

All I'm asking you for is a Scripture to support your view that "water" refers to physical birth.

What's so difficult about that?

 

MP, we need to avoid anachronism, reading back our understanding today into the biblical text.

I believe we need to ground our positions in Scripture.

 

Water always referred to "cleansing" in the Jewish faith. There was much ritual washing which was a picture (for lack of a better word) of the washing away of sin. To be clean meant to be without sin.

Born of water means to be washed clean of sin.

 

Now Amy that's biblical precedent. That's what we have, but not "water" referring to physical birth.

We need Scripture for that interpretation.