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Featured Covenant Theology

Discussion in 'Fundamental Baptist Forum' started by Van, Aug 25, 2012.

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  1. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    I've never read the WCF. My covenant theology is from the Bible itself. That's my authority.
     
    #21 TCGreek, Aug 27, 2012
  2. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    What is that middle position?
     
    #22 TCGreek, Aug 27, 2012
  3. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    They both see both jews/gentiles saved same way, by the Grace of the new Covenant, and they still do disagree on the truth of national isreal still having a aprt in the plan of God coming future, but many in both seem to also be heading to hisoptical pre mil position! the rapture seeming to be under attack in progressive Dispy...
     
    #23 Yeshua1, Aug 27, 2012
  4. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Would instead say that Election from /by God the concept involved here, and that God had ordianed that there would be a redeemer to come for His people...

    Debate would be IF God either ordained the fall, or ordained the Cross as knowing the fall would happen!
     
    #24 Yeshua1, Aug 27, 2012
  5. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Thanks Thomas15, for discussing the topic. How refreshing!!

    Jesus is spoken of as the "Chosen One." So when do you say He was chosen? See for example Luke 9:35, 23:35, and 1 Peter 2:6. Jesus was chosen before He was born, at least in that several prophecies written before the Word became flesh, said He was choice and precious in the eyes of God.

    I do not think to say that the Second Person of the Trinity was chosen to become the Lamb of God calls into question His divinity? Note that many translations put those words in "Caps" to make clear the Chosen One is the Second Person of the Trinity.

    But I do not disagree with questioning what we should call God's plan of Redemption. In Acts 2:23 we see that Christ was delivered up by a "predetermined plan." I think it is logical to think since Jesus was known as the Lamb of God before the foundation of the world (1 Peter 1:19-20), He was chosen for that task before the foundation of the world. Where did I go wrong?
     
    #25 Van, Aug 27, 2012
  6. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Still waiting for someone to address the question. :)
     
    #26 Van, Aug 27, 2012
  7. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    Yes, but a difference regarding Israel, the Millennium, and the Rapture.
     
    #27 TCGreek, Aug 27, 2012
  8. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Hi Yeshua1, yes we can agree when the Father chose the Son, making Him the Chosen One, that was His "election." Thanks for sharing.

    Next we can agree God predestined that the Chosen One would become flesh and die on the Christ, having been delivered up by predetermined plan and foreknowledge of God. Thanks for sharing

    Mr. Pink says God did not predestine the Fall, but God arranged it, i.e. put the tree in the garden, allowed Satan to interact with Eve, and so forth. You cannot, with integrity claim Christ was chosen before creation to be the Lamb, without accepting God's plan anticipated the Fall.

    And yes, God predestined the cross, according to His predetermined plan.
     
    #28 Van, Aug 27, 2012
  9. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    The plan to redeem man via the Cross of christ was eternal plan of the father, so Jesus was NOT chosen in the sense that God picked him for that role, as he always had that Role...

    it was NOT jesus picked as messiah, nor the plan that was chosen, but individual sinners were chosen and delecte dout beforehand by the father to receive jesus thru the Holy Sprit and possess eternal life in Christ!
     
    #29 Yeshua1, Aug 27, 2012
  10. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Aren't there some pre mils in new covenat theology? I am referring to Historical view....
     
    #30 Yeshua1, Aug 27, 2012
  11. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    Ah, yes. I believe Spurgeon was such.
     
    #31 TCGreek, Aug 27, 2012
  12. thomas15

    thomas15 Well-Known Member

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    There is a difference between what seems logical and what is actually taught in The Bible. The Bible does not speak of a Covenant of Redemption between the Father and the Son. Therefore, as much as we might like it to be so, we have no authority to make the claim.
     
    #32 thomas15, Aug 28, 2012
  13. thomas15

    thomas15 Well-Known Member

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    You get the covenants of grace, works and redemption from your Bible?
     
    #33 thomas15, Aug 28, 2012
  14. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    I am not making a claim about a "covenant" - I am making a claim that the Word was chosen as the Redeemer before creation, and therefore God's plan of Redemption was formulated before creation.
     
    #34 Van, Aug 28, 2012
  15. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Yeshua1 denies Christ is the Chosen One. Go figure. Calvinism denies every verse that demonstrates Calvinism is bogus. Lets add them to the list.
     
    #35 Van, Aug 28, 2012
  16. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Still waiting for an answer rather than an evasion.
     
    #36 Van, Aug 28, 2012
  17. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    Do you believe in the Trinity? If so, did you get it from your Bible?
     
    #37 TCGreek, Aug 28, 2012
  18. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Jesus is the Christ, Annoited One of God, Son of God....

    the father had determined before the fall even happened that he would come to die as an atonement for Sin, but there was no "Covenant" between father and Son, for the Cross was always to be the way to save sinners!
     
    #38 Yeshua1, Aug 28, 2012
  19. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    yes, for it is implicitly taught in it!
     
    #39 Yeshua1, Aug 28, 2012
  20. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    No, accept that Jesus was chosen by the father to be the messiah, but he also agreed to do it... Just saying that it was jesus and the Cross ordained, not the plan that was elected, and sinners are chosen on an individual basis for salvation too!
     
    #40 Yeshua1, Aug 28, 2012
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