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Featured Daniel & The Revelation [KJB] - structural Foundation - Ps. 77:13 KJB

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by One Baptism, Jun 16, 2017.

  1. One Baptism

    One Baptism Active Member

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    Daniel & The Revelation [KJB] - structural Foundation - Psalms 77:13 KJB

    Psalms 77:13 KJB - Thy way, O God, [is] in the sanctuary: who [is so] great a God as [our] God?
    For the Main file for Download, please use the following link, otherwise you will have to wait for the full material to be edited [for posting] and posted - Daniel & The Revelation [KJB] .odt [Open Office] document- structural Foundation - Psalms 77:13 KJB

    Michael the Archangel Study [XX] Appendix 6 – Daniel & the Revelation compared

    The First Book Of Daniel

    Daniel 4:1-37; Daniel 3:1-30; Daniel 2:1-49; Daniel 1:1-21; Daniel 7:1-28; Daniel 6:1-28; Daniel 5:1-31

    In order:

    Daniel 4:1-37 -- King, Everlasting Gospel, Saved

    Daniel 3:1-30 -- Law, Test, Worship, 1st Amendment

    Daniel 2:1-49 -- Vision, Kingdoms Of Earth To Heaven

    Daniel 1:1-21 -- Captivity To Release

    Daniel 7:1-28 -- Vision, Kingdoms Of Earth To Heaven

    Daniel 6:1-28 -- Law, Test, Worship, 1st Amendment

    Daniel 5:1-31-- King, Everlasting Gospel, Lost

    [​IMG]

    The Second Book Of Daniel, are the Chapters 8:1-12:13; Sanctuary; defiled to cleansed.

    Psalms 77:13 KJB - Thy way, O God, [is] in the sanctuary: who [is so] great a God as [our] God?

    The Book of Daniel itself is really not merely one prophetic book, but two portions related one to the other, even with a special portion of it “sealed” until “the time of the end” [Daniel 12:4,9], which we, will discover in this study was a very specific date.

    This Book of Daniel may be basically subdivided into Chapters 1-7 and Chapters 8-12, respectively, though Chapter 1 is really a basis and connection for both major portions.

    This is seen not only in the text itself for Daniel Chapter 1:1-2:4[a], which is the introductory portion of the Book of Daniel, is given in Hebrew.

    Daniel Chapter 2:4[.b]-7:28 is given in Syriac [Chaldee].

    It is when we get to Daniel Chapter 8:1-12:13, that again the Book of Daniel is given primarily in Hebrew language once more.

    Qumran; Daniel:

    [Scroll] 1 Q Dan A (1Q71) - [Range] Dan 1:10–17; 2:2–6. These confirm the langauge shift from Hebrew to Syriac [Chaldee], but omits the phrase ‘Syriac [Chaldee]’ at 2:4.1

    [Scroll] 1 Q Dan B (1Q72) - [Range] Dan 3:22–30; Four fragments on vellum in Syriac [Chaldee]; and confirms the absence of the apocryphal "Prayer of Azariah and Song of the Three Men."

    [Scroll] 4 Q Dan A (4Q112) - [Range] Dan 1:16–2:33; 4:29–30; 5:5–7; 7:25–8:5; 10:16–20; 11:13–16. Some portions of these verses are incomplete.

    [Scroll] 4 Q Dan B (4Q113) - [Range] Dan 5:10–12, 14–16, 19–22; 6:8–22, 27–29; 7:1–6, 26–28; 8:1–8, 13–16. These confirm the language shift from Syriac [Chaldee] to Hebrew.

    [Scroll] 4 Q Dan C (4Q114) - [Range] Dan 10:5–9, 11–16, 21; 11:1–2, 13–17, 25–29. These, the oldest known text of Daniel.

    [Scroll] 4 Q Dan D (4Q115) - [Range] Dan 3:23–25; 4:5?–9; 4:12–14. The largest of these fragments contain five partial lines in severe decay.

    [Scroll] 4 Q Dan E (4Q116) - [Range] Dan. 9:12–14?, 15–16?, 17?… There are five small fragments of chapter nine.

    [Scroll] 6 Q Dan A (6Q7) [aka pap 6 Q Dan] - [Range] Dan 8:16, 17, 20, 21; 10:8–16, 11:33–36, 38. The cave in which these were found contained papyrus manuscripts rather than leather parchment.​

    This is not the only way in which to tell that these two portions are so delineated. For we can tell by the very structure of the Book of Daniel in its Chiastic nature, as Daniel Chapters 1-7 are given Chiastically [Chiasm, “v”, “^” or “x” in shape structurally; ie, abccba, 123321, or more complicated, etc] in the shape of the 7 Branch Candlestick, for instance:

    Daniel 1 is the center candlestick.

    Daniel 2 and Daniel 7 are the first corresponding branches.

    Daniel 3 and Daniel 6 are the next corresponding branches.

    Daniel 4 and Daniel 5 are the latter corresponding branches.

    Daniel 1 is the center candlestick. from Captivity Of Sin / Disobedience - Babylon to Release - Cyrus, the type of Christ, Redemption, Saved From Sin Daniel 2 and Daniel 7 are the first corresponding branches. Visions of the Kingdoms of the Earth ending in the Heavenly Kingdom of Christ on Earth. Daniel 3 and Daniel 6 are the next corresponding branches. God's Love, The Trials Of God's Peoples, the Testing of obedience to God's Law, especially in the first Table, worship to God. Daniel 4 and Daniel 5 are the latter corresponding branches. Two Paths of the Everlasting Gospel, Two Kings, One Saved from His sins and delivered, and One Lost in his sins, his probation closed forever.

    Thus, imagine the tips of the candles forming on the candelabra: 4 3 2 1 7 6 5

    The Central Pillar, The Great Controversy & The Plan Of Redemption in Daniel 1:1-21; Short Notes

    Two Arch-Rulers Overall

    Jesus, “the Lord … God ...”

    Satan, “... his god... ”​

    Two Kings

    Jehoiakim king

    Nebuchadnezzar king​

    Two Kinds Of Servants

    Of God

    Of Satan/Men​

    Two Cities

    Jerusalem

    Babylon​

    Two Temples / Sanctuaries

    House of God

    House of his god​

    Two Peoples

    Israel / Judah

    Babylonians / Chaldeans​

    Two Lands / Kingdoms

    Canaan / Israel / Judea

    Babylon / Land of Shinar / Chaldea​

    Two Religions

    Worship of the True God, Vessels

    Worship of false gods, magicians, astrologers​

    Two Tongues / Languages

    Canaan, symbolic of Heaven's order

    Babylon / Chaldean, symbolic of hell's confusion​

    Two Wisdoms

    God's Wisdom

    Wisdom of men / serpent / occult / esoteric​

    Two Names

    God glorifying names

    Daniel, Hananiah, Mishael, Azariah

    Satanic glorifying names

    Belteshazzar, Shadrach, Meshach, Abednego​

    Two Ways

    God's Commandments, Righteousness By Faith, Liberty, Fear of God

    Rebellion of Satan, Transgression, Sin By Doubt, Captivity, Fear of men​

    Two Daily's: Diets / Lifestyles

    God's Daily, Reliance Upon Every Word, Water / Pulse, Clean, Pure, Healthy

    Counterfeit Daily, reliance upon satan, men, one's own wisdom and strength – alcohol, unclean meat, unhealthy​

    Two Conditions

    Purity, Undefiled, Holy, Sacred, Faithful

    Defiled, Impure, Unholy, Profane, Unfaithful​

    Two Times

    Period of Probation, Testing, Trial, Proving

    Probation, Testing, Proving Closed; Passed / Failed​

    Two Ends

    Eternal Life, Continuing

    Eternal Death, Ending, Cease To Be
    *******
    The Revelation of Jesus Christ, is given in the same manner:

    [​IMG]

    The Revelation Of Jesus Christ

    Rev. 1:1-5:14; Rev. 6:1-8:1; Rev. 8:2-11:19; Rev. 12:1-14:20; Rev. 15:1-19:21; Rev. 20:1-15; Rev. 21:1-22:21

    Revelation 1:1-5:14 -- The 7 Churches


    Revelation 6:1-8:1 -- The 7 Seals

    Revelation 8:2-11:19 -- The 7 Trumpets

    Revelation 12:1-14:20 -- The Great Controversy

    Revelation 15:1-8:21 -- The 7 Last Plagues

    Revelation 20:1-15 -- The 1,000 Years

    Revelation 21:1-22:21 -- The New Jerusalem


    The texts of the King James Bible are to be given in evidence...
     
    #1 One Baptism, Jun 16, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2017
  2. One Baptism

    One Baptism Active Member

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    The typical Feasts of the LORD, found in Leviticus 23:1-44 KJB, which show in type that which Christ Jesus would do in His anti-typical (real) ministration, are also given in the manner of the 7 branch candlestick.

    [​IMG]

    1 - 1 - 1 - 3 - 7 - 7 - 7

    The Passover
    (1st Month (Abib), 14th day, at even) - Leviticus 23:4-5 KJB

    Unleavened Bread (1st Month (Abib), 15th day unto 21st day (7 days), a yearly feastal sabbath) - Leviticus 23:6-8 KJB​

    Firstfruits/Wavesheaf (1st Month (Abib), 16th day, on the morrow after the sabbath) - Leviticus 23:9-14 KJB​

    Pentecost/Feast of Weeks (3rd Month (Sivan), 50 days (7 complete Sabbath's (7*7=49) and unto the morrow after the 7th Sabbath (49+1=50)) - Leviticus 23:15-22 KJB​

    Trumpets (7 Month (Ethanim), 1st day) - Leviticus 23:23-25 KJB​

    Atonement (7th Month (Ethanim), 10th day, yearly festal sabbath, in the 9th day, even unto even) - Leviticus 23:26-32 KJB​

    Booths/Tabernacles/Ingathering (7th Month (Ethanim), 15th day unto 21st day (7 days), and an 8th day (the 1st and 8th being a yearly festal sabbath)) - Leviticus 23:33-44 KJB

    God, even Jesus, is the God of order (1 Corinthians 14:40 KJB), not of confusion (1 Corinthians 14:33 KJB), but rather of perfect timing (Ecclesiastes 3:1,17 KJB). He leads from beginning (alpha/first/author/seed/foundation) unto the ending (omega/last/finisher/tree/completion-perfection). Jesus, Himself gave the "times" and "seasons" of the religious feasts in Leviticus 23, all directly connected to His Sanctuary (Psalms 77:13 KJB).

    Jesus must fulfill these in their perfect order, timing and seasons.

    The Lamb (John 1:29,36 KJB) was procured 3 1/2 days before the Passover, in the 10th day of the 1st Month (Abib).

    Passover, Christ Jesus Crucified and died - 1st Month (Abib), 14th at even he was slain, from the time of the morning offering (3rd hour, Mark 15:25 KJB unto the 9th hour, the time of the evening offering, Mark 15:34 KJB (6 hours, approx. 9 am to 3 pm)) - 1 Corinthians 5:7 KJB

    Unleavened, lived without sin, was buried in the tomb (15th day of the 1st Month) - 1 Corinthians 5:7-8 KJB

    First fruit/Wavesheaf - Jesus resurrected (16th day of the 1st Month) - 1 Corinthians 15:20,23 KJB

    Pentecost, Jesus had ascended to Heaven, and at the 50th day (3rd Month), The Holy Ghost was poured out - Revelation 5:6; Psalms 133:1-3; Acts 2:1, etc.

    Thus was to come, after a long summer period, the final anti-types of Jesus ministry, Trumpets, Atonement, Tabernacles, all of which did not take place at the Cross (impossible in timing and season, etc), nor His ascension, but after that He was to do in the Heavenly Sanctuary (Hebrews; Daniel 8:13-14,26; Revelation, etc )

    Trumpets would come in 1833/34 AD, five (anti-typical) months from Pentecost (3rd Month), in the 7th month (3, 4, 5, 6, 7 = 5 months inclusive), see Revelation 9:5,6,10; Luke 1:24 (context); Genesis 7:24, 8:3 (context), at the announcement of coming judgment.

    Atonement, began in October 22, 1844 (and continues so long as the Everlasting Gospel is preached, and mercy available, but soon the mystery of God will be FINISHED), 10 day/years from Trumpets, seen in Revelation 9:13-15 KJB, in the hour (Revelation 14:6-7 KJB, the hour of His Judgment is come), day (Leviticus 16 & 23:27 KJB; 10th day, day of atonement), month (Ethanim, 7th Month; 1 Kings 8:2 KJB), year (1844, end of the 2,300 days/years (457 BC to AD 1844) in Daniel 8:14 KJB, and end of the 1,335 days/years (AD 508 - AD 1844) in Daniel 12:12 KJB), so we are now in the time of the Judgment, which begins with the dead professed, and soon, come to the cases of the professed living (Hebrews 9:27 KJB), 1 Peter 4:17 KJB etc. Jesus is cleansing the Sanctuary, Leviticus 16 KJB.

    Tabernacles to soon come, see Revelation 14:14-20; Leviticus 23:33-44 KJB
     
    #2 One Baptism, Jun 18, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2017
  3. One Baptism

    One Baptism Active Member

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    The Central Pillar, The Great Controversy & The Plan Of Redemption in Daniel 1:1-21; Long Notes

    Arch Ruler
    Jesus

    Dan. 1:2,9,17 [Arch-Ruler]

    “... the Lord … God ...”, “... God ...”, “... God ...”​

    Satan

    Dan 1:2,7 [Arch-Ruler]

    “... his god … his god ...”, “... Belteshazzar ...”
    King

    Dan. 1:1,2,3 [a king of Judah and Jerusalem], later also Cyrus [type of Christ Jesus], Dan. 1:21​

    “... Jehoiakim king of Judah ...”, “... Jehoiakim king of Judah ...”, “... the king's ...”, “... Cyrus ...”​

    Dan. 1:1,2,3,4,5,8,10,13,15,18,19,20 [a king of Babylon]

    “... Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon ...”, “... he … his … he … his ...”, “... the king … his ...”, “... the king's ...”, “... the king … the king's … he … the king.”, “... the king's … he ...”, “... lord the king … who … he … the king.”, “... the king's …”, “... the king's …”, “... the king … he ...Nebuchadnezzar.”, “... the king ...the king.”, “... the king … he … his ...”
    Servants

    Dan. 1:3,4,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14,15,16,17,18,19,20,21 [servants of God]

    “... certain of the children of Israel, and of the king's seed, and of the princes ...”, “Children ...”, “Now among these were of the children of Judah, Daniel, Hananiah, Mishael, and Azariah:”, “... Daniel the name of Belteshazzar; and to Hananiah, of Shadrach; and to Mishael, of Meshach; and to Azariah, of Abednego.”, “Daniel … his … he … himself … he … he … himself ...”, “... Daniel ...”, “... Daniel … your faces … than the children which are of your sort … ye ...”, “... Daniel … Daniel, Hananiah, Mishael, and Azariah, ...”, “... servants, I … us ...”, “... our countenances … of the children … servants.”, “... them … them ...”, “... their countenances … the children ...”, “... their … they … them ...”, “... these four children … them … Daniel ...”, “... them … them ...”, “... them … among them all … Daniel, Hananiah, Mishael, and Azariah … they ...”, “... them … them ...”, “... Daniel … Cyrus ...”​

    Dan. 1:3,4,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14,16,18,20 [servants of men]

    “... Ashpenaz the master of his eunuchs ...”, “... the Chaldeans ...”, “... the prince of the eunuchs ...”, “... the prince of the eunuchs ...”, “... the prince of the eunuchs ...”, “... the prince of the eunuchs … me endanger my head ...”, “... Melzar, whom the prince of the eunuchs ...”, “... thy … thee ... ”, “... thee … thou … thy ...”, “So he consented ...”, “Thus Melzar ...”, “... he ... the prince of the eunuchs ...”, “... all the magicians and astrologers ...”​

    City


    Dan. 1:1 [City]

    “... Jerusalem … it.”​

    Dan. 1:1 [City]

    “... Babylon ...”
    Temple/Sanctuary

    Dan. 1:2 [Temple / Sanctuary]

    “... the house of God ...”​

    Dan. 1:2 [Temple / Sanctuary]

    “... the house of his god … the treasure house of his god.”
    Peoples

    Dan. 1:3 [Peoples, children of God]

    “... of Israel ...”​

    Dan. 1:4 [Peoples, children of Babylon]

    “... the Chaldeans.”
    Lands

    Dan. 1:1,2,6 [Land / Kingdom]

    “... Judah ...”, “... Judah ...”, “... of Judah ...”​

    Dan. 1:2 [Land / Kingdom]

    “... the land of Shinar ...”​

    Worship

    Dan. 1:2,4,8,17 [True worship]

    “... part of the vessels of the house of God … the vessels ...”, “Children in whom was no blemish, but well favoured, and skilful in all wisdom, and cunning in knowledge, and understanding science, and such as had ability in them to stand in the king's palace ...”, “... purposed in his heart that he would not defile himself ...”, “As for these four children, God gave them knowledge and skill in all learning and wisdom: and Daniel had understanding in all visions and dreams.”​

    Dan. 1:2,4 [False worship]

    “... all the magicians and astrologers that were in all his realm. ...”, “... the Chaldeans.”
    Langauge

    Dan. 1:3 [Language of Canaan, type of Heaven.]

    “... the children of Israel ...”​

    Dan. 1:4 [Babylonian language, confusion]

    “... the tongue of the Chaldeans."
    Wisdoms

    Dan. 1:4,17,19,20 [God's wisdom]

    “Children in whom was no blemish, but well favoured, and skilful in all wisdom, and cunning in knowledge, and understanding science, and such as had ability in them to stand in the king's palace, and whom they might teach the learning and the tongue of the Chaldeans.”, “As for these four children, God gave them knowledge and skill in all learning and wisdom: and Daniel had understanding in all visions and dreams.”, “And the king communed with them; and among them all was found none like Daniel, Hananiah, Mishael, and Azariah: therefore stood they before the king.”, “And in all matters of wisdom and understanding, that the king enquired of them, he found them ten times better than all ...”​

    Dan. 1:4,20 [men's wisdom]

    “... the learning and the tongue of the Chaldeans.”, “... all the magicians and astrologers that were in all his realm.”
    Names

    Dan. 1:6,8,9,10,11,17,19,21 [True Name which glorifies God, Name of Victory, Salvation and Redemption]

    “... Daniel, Hananiah, Mishael, and Azariah:”, “... Daniel ...”, “... Daniel ...”, “... Daniel ...”, “... Daniel ...”, “... Daniel ...”, “... Daniel, Hananiah, Mishael, and Azariah ...”, “... Daniel ...”​

    Dan. 1:7 [False Name which glorifies Satan, of Sin, Idolatry]

    “Daniel the name of Belteshazzar; and to Hananiah, of Shadrach; and to Mishael, of Meshach; and to Azariah, of Abednego.”
    Daniel Chapter 1 to be continued ...
     
  4. One Baptism

    One Baptism Active Member

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    Daniel Chapter 1 continued ...

    Ways


    Dan. 1:4,8,9,21 [God's Way / Right Fear Of God / Pure / Righteousness / Faithfulness / Grace / Commandment Keeping / Love to God and man / Freedom [release by Cyrus, the type of Christ]

    “Children in whom was no blemish ...”, “... Daniel purposed in his heart that he would not defile himself ...”, “Now God had brought Daniel into favour and tender love with the prince of the eunuchs.”, “And Daniel continued even unto the first year of king Cyrus.”​

    Dan. 1:1,2,10 [Fear of men / Unrighteousness / Sin / Disobedience / Slavery / Bondage / Captivity]

    “... besieged ...”, “And the Lord gave Jehoiakim king of Judah into his hand, with part of the vessels of the house of God: which he carried into the land of Shinar to the house of his god; and he brought the vessels into the treasure house of his god.” , “And the prince of the eunuchs said unto Daniel, I fear my lord the king, who hath appointed your meat and your drink: for why should he see your faces worse liking than the children which are of your sort? then shall ye make me endanger my head to the king.”
    Daily - Lifestyle/"Conversation [KJB]"


    Dan. 1:8,12,14,15,16 [The True Daily: food, drink, learning, reliance, worship, etc; both in the physical and spiritual]; “Pulse” is that which is 'of the seed', even Jesus Christ; Genesis 3:15; Galatians 3:16; Revelation 12:17, etc. “Water” is not only of the Holy Spirit, John 3:5, but also of Faith; John 6:35, and the word of God, Ephesians 5:26. Thus to live of every word that proceedeth from the mouth of God, Faith [and Love] and Obedience.

    “But Daniel purposed in his heart that he would not defile himself with the portion of the king's meat, nor with the wine which he drank: therefore he requested of the prince of the eunuchs that he might not defile himself.”, “Prove thy servants, I beseech thee, ten days; and let them give us pulse to eat, and water to drink.”, “So he consented to them in this matter, and proved them ten days.”, “And at the end of ten days their countenances appeared fairer and fatter in flesh than all the children which did eat the portion of the king's meat.”, “Thus Melzar took away the portion of their meat, and the wine that they should drink; and gave them pulse.”​

    Dan. 1:4,5,8,10,13,15,16 [a Counterfeit Daily: food, drink, learning, reliance, worship, etc; both in the physical and spiritual]

    “... the learning and the tongue of the Chaldeans.”, “And the king appointed them a daily provision of the king's meat, and of the wine which he drank: so nourishing them three years, that at the end thereof they might stand before the king.”, “... defile himself with the portion of the king's meat, nor with the wine which he drank: … defile himself.”, “... my lord the king, who hath appointed your meat and your drink ...”, “... eat of the portion of the king's meat ...”, “... eat the portion of the king's meat.”, “... the portion of their meat, and the wine that they should drink ...”
    Condition


    Dan. 1:8 [Condition / Choice: Purity / Undefiled / Holy / Sacred / Faithful]; after

    “... not defile … not defile ...”​

    Dan. 1:8 [Condition / Choice: Defilement / Impure / Unholy / Profane / Unfaithful]

    “... defile … defile ...”
    Time


    Dan. 1:12,13,14 [Time: Probation, Time Of Trial, Testing And Proving]

    “Prove thy servants, I beseech thee, ten days ...”, “Then let our countenances be looked upon before thee, and the countenance of the children that eat of the portion of the king's meat: and as thou seest, deal with thy servants.”, “So he consented to them in this matter, and proved them ten days.”​

    Dan. 1:15,16 [Time: Temptation Does Not Allure To Sin, Thus It Is Taken Away, After Victory, Even As Those Who Have Victory Over Sin In Their Trial]

    “And at the end of ten days their countenances appeared fairer and fatter in flesh than all the children which did eat the portion of the king's meat.”, “Thus Melzar took away the portion of their meat, and the wine that they should drink; and gave them pulse.”
    The Ends


    Dan. 1:20 [The End, Victory, Eternal Life]

    “And Daniel continued even unto the first year of king Cyrus.” [Daniel continued into the next Kingdom ...]

    Dan. 1:10,20 [The End, Loss, Endangered, Eternal Death]

    “... then shall ye make me endanger my head to the king. ...” [This Babylon came to its end ...]

    “And Daniel continued even unto the first year of king Cyrus.”​
     
  5. One Baptism

    One Baptism Active Member

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    Daniel Chapter 2 & 7

    The Visions Of The Kingdoms Of Earth Ending In The Kingdom Of Heaven On Earth;

    Daniel 2:1-49 and Daniel 7:1-28

    Dan. 2:1

    “And in the second year ...”

    Dan. 7:1

    “In the first year of ...”
    Dan. 2:1

    “... the reign of Nebuchadnezzar ...”

    Dan. 7:1

    “... Belshazzar king of Babylon ...”
    Dan. 2:1,19

    “... Nebuchadnezzar dreamed dreams ...”, “... the secret revealed unto Da
    niel in a night vision. ...”

    Dan. 7:1

    “... Daniel had a dream and visions ...”
    Dan. 2:1,28

    “... his spirit was troubled, and his sleep brake from him.”, “But there is a God in heaven that revealeth secrets, and maketh known to the king Nebuchadnezzar what shall be in the latter days. Thy dream, and the visions of thy head upon thy bed, are these;”

    Dan. 7:1,15

    “... of his head upon his bed: then he wrote the dream, and told the sum of the matters.”, “I Daniel was grieved in my spirit in the midst of my body, and the visions of my head troubled me.”
    Dan. 2:29

    “... thy thoughts came into thy mind upon thy bed ...”

    Dan. 7:2

    “... I saw in my vision by night ...”
    The Vision Itself

    Dan. 2:31

    “... behold a great image. This great image, whose brightness was excellent, stood before thee; and the form thereof was terrible.”

    Dan. 7:2

    “... I saw in my vision by night, and, behold, the four winds of the heaven strove upon the great sea.”
    Dan. 2:32

    “This image's head was of fine gold ...”

    Dan. 7:4

    “The first was like a lion, and had eagle's wings: I beheld till the wings thereof were plucked, and it was lifted up from the earth, and made stand upon the feet as a man, and a man's heart was given to it.”
    Dan. 2:32

    “... his breast and his arms of silver, ...”

    Dan. 7:5

    “And behold another beast, a second, like to a bear, and it raised up itself on one side, and it had three ribs in the mouth of it between the teeth of it: and they said thus unto it, Arise, devour much flesh.”
    Dan. 2:32

    “... his belly and his thighs of brass,”

    Dan. 7:6

    “After this I beheld, and lo another, like a leopard, which had upon the back of it four wings of a fowl; the beast had also four heads; and dominion was given to it.”
    Dan. 2:33

    “His legs of iron, ...”

    Dan. 7:7

    “ After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it ...”
    Dan. 2:33,34

    “... his feet part of iron and part of clay.”, “... the image upon his feet that were of iron and clay ...”

    Dan. 7:7

    [an historical Type, Old World];

    Rev. 17:3,7,12,13,14,16,17, 18:3,9,10, 19:19
    [End-Time Greater Anti-type, Whole World]

    “... and it had ten horns.”; [These, in Daniel 7, become 7, after 3 are uprooted by the 11th which becomes the 8th, and thus the 7 become finally incorporated into the final world-wide “ten” [whole; Ecclesiastes 12:13-14, etc]]

    “... and ten horns.”, “... and ten horns.”, “And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.”, “These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.”, “These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.”, “And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.”, “For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.”, “For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.”, “And the kings of the earth, who have committed fornication and lived deliciously with her, shall bewail her, and lament for her, when they shall see the smoke of her burning,”, “Standing afar off for the fear of her torment, saying, Alas, alas, that great city Babylon, that mighty city! for in one hour is thy judgment come.”, “And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.”
    Dan. 2:34,35

    “Thou sawest till that a stone was cut out without hands, which smote the image upon his feet that were of iron and clay, and brake them to pieces.”

    “Then was the iron, the clay, the brass, the silver, and the gold, broken to pieces together, and became like the chaff of the summer threshingfloors; and the wind carried them away, that no place was found for them: and the stone that smote the image became a great mountain, and filled the whole earth.”

    Dan. 7:14

    “And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.”
    The Vision's Interpretation

    Dan. 2:36

    “... the dream ...”

    Dan. 7:15

    “... the visions of my head ...”
    Dan. 2:36,45

    “... we will tell the interpretation thereof ...”, “... the dream is certain, and the interpretation thereof sure.”

    Dan. 7:16

    “I came near unto one of them that stood by, and asked him the truth of all this. So he told me, and made me know the interpretation of the things.”
    Dan. 2:37

    “... kings ...”

    Dan. 7:17,24

    “... kings ...”, “... kings … kings ...”
    Dan. 2:37,39,40,41,42,55

    “... kingdom ...”, “... kingdom ...”, “... kingdom ...”, “... kingdom ...”, “... kingdom ...”, “... kingdom ...”, “... kingdom ...”, “... kingdom ...”, “... kingdoms ...”

    Dan. 7:18,22,23,24,26,27

    “... kingdom ...”, “... kingdom ...”, “... kingdoms ...”, “... kingdom ...”, “... dominion … it ...”, “... the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom … kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions ...”
    Dan. 2:37,38,44,45

    “... the God of heaven ...”, “... he ...”, “... the God of heaven ...”, “... the great God ...”

    Dan. 7:18,22,25,27

    “... the most High ...”, “... the Ancient of days … of the most High ...”, “... the most High … the most High ...”, “... the most High … him.”
    Dan. 2:38

    “... beasts … fowls of the heaven ...”

    Dan. 7:17,19,23

    “... great beasts ...”, “... fourth beast, which was diverse from all the others ...”, “... The fourth beast ...”
    Dan. 2:44

    “... for ever.”

    Dan. 7:18,27

    “... for ever, even for ever and ever.”, “... everlasting ...”
    Dan. 2:37,38,39,40

    “Thou, O king, art a king of kings: for the God of heaven hath given thee a kingdom, power, and strength, and glory.”, “And wheresoever the children of men dwell, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the heaven hath he given into thine hand, and hath made thee ruler over them all. Thou art this head of gold.”, “And after thee shall arise another kingdom inferior to thee, and another third kingdom of brass, which shall bear rule over all the earth.”, “And the fourth kingdom shall be strong as iron: forasmuch as iron breaketh in pieces and subdueth all things: and as iron that breaketh all these, shall it break in pieces and bruise.”

    Dan. 7:17,19,23

    “These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth.”, “Then I would know the truth of the fourth beast, which was diverse from all the others, exceeding dreadful, whose teeth were of iron, and his nails of brass; which devoured, brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with his feet;”, “Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces.”
    The End Of The Matter

    Dan. 2:46,47,48,49

    “... Daniel ...”, “... Daniel ...”, “... Daniel ...”, “... Daniel … Daniel ...”

    Dan. 7:28

    “... Daniel ...”​
     
  6. One Baptism

    One Baptism Active Member

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    The Language Of The 7 Trumpets Parallel That Of The 7 Last Plagues; short chart

    The 7 Trumpets
    The 7 Last Plagues

    Rev. 8:1-5, encompassing verses, Rev. 8:6 introduces the 7 Trumpets, these are judgments of God that have been mingled with mercy ; “one third”; see GC1911 628.2

    Rev. 15:1-16:1 introduces the 7 Last Plagues, these are the judgments of God that are without mercy; unmingled wrath, see GC1911 627.3, 628.2

    1st Trumpet
    Rev. 8:7
    “the earth”

    1st Plague
    Rev. 16:2
    “the earth”

    2nd Trumpet
    Rev. 8:8-9
    “the sea”

    2nd Plague
    Rev. 16:3
    “the sea”

    3rd Trumpet
    Rev. 8:10-11
    “the rivers”, “the fountains of waters”

    3rd Plague
    Rev. 16:4-7
    “the rivers”, “the fountains of waters”

    4th Trumpet
    Rev. 8:12
    “Sun”, “Moon”, “Stars”

    4th Plague
    Rev. 16:8-9
    “Sun”

    The 5th, 6th, & 7th Trumpets are called the 3 Woes, Rev. 8:13, 9:12, 11:14

    The 1st, 2nd, 3rd, & 4th Last Plagues are not universal, see GC1911 627.3-628.2

    5th Trumpet
    1st Woe
    Rev. 9:1-11,12
    “darkened”

    5th Plague
    Rev. 16:10-11
    “darkness”

    6th Trumpet
    2nd Woe
    Rev. 9:12, 13-21, 11:1-14; also closing off the 5th, entering into the 6th is Rev. 10:1-11
    “the great river Euphrates”

    6th Plague
    Rev. 16:12-16
    “the great river Euphrates”

    7th Trumpet
    3rd Woe
    Rev. 9:12, 10:7, 11:14,15-19;
    1 Thess. 4:15-17
    “kingdoms”

    7th Plague
    Rev. 16:17-19:21
    “kingdom”, “kings of the earth”
     
  7. One Baptism

    One Baptism Active Member

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    [07] Revelation 12, An Unbreakable Chiastic Structure

    There is inherently within the very texts of Revelation 12 a very specific structure, a chiastic structure/pattern [1,2,3,3,2,1, or A,B,C,C,B,A, or A,B,C,A,B,C, etc] which cannot be broken [John 10:35 KJB].

    The Revelation 12 Texts:

    Revelation 12:1 KJB - And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:

    Revelation 12:2 KJB - And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.

    Revelation 12:3 KJB - And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.

    Revelation 12:4 KJB - And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.

    Revelation 12:5 KJB - And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

    Revelation 12:6 KJB - And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

    Revelation 12:7 KJB - And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

    Revelation 12:8 KJB - And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.

    Revelation 12:9 KJB - And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

    Revelation 12:10 KJB - And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

    Revelation 12:11 KJB - And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

    Revelation 12:12 KJB - Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

    Revelation 12:13 KJB - And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.

    Revelation 12:14 KJB - And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

    Revelation 12:15 KJB - And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.

    Revelation 12:16 KJB - And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.

    Revelation 12:17 KJB - And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.​

    Notice the chiastic structure.

    [A1] Revelation 12:1-5 KJB = Woman, Child and Dragon

    [B1] Revelation 12:6 KJB = Woman in Wilderness for 1,260 days [years]

    [C1] Revelation 12:7-9 KJB = War between Michael and Satan in Heaven

    [D1] Revelation 12:10 KJB = Cross, Power of Christ, His Victory

    [D2] Revelation 12:11 KJB = Lamb, Blood of Christ, Their [overcoming saints] Victory in Him​

    [C2]
    Revelation 12:12 KJB = Dragon permanently cast down to Earth fights against Jesus' body​

    [B2]
    Revelation 12:13-16 KJB = Woman in Wilderness, for a time, and times, and half a time [aka, 3 1/2 times or 1,260 days [years]]​

    [A2] Revelation 12:17 KJB = Woman, her Seed and Dragon​

    An example of another parallelism within the greater:

    Revelation 12:7 KJB - And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

    [A1] Michael – Leader

    [B1] his angels – Followers​

    [A2]
    Dragon – Leader

    [B2] his angels - Followers​

    Looking at these two combatants, compare the surrounding context, this time starting with “the Dragon”, followed with “Michael”:

    [1] “the Dragon” and his several titles in Revelation 12:

    “Dragon” - Revelation 12:3,4,7,9,13,16,17 KJB

    “serpent” - Revelation 12:9,14,15 KJB

    “Devil” - Revelation 12:9,12 KJB

    “Satan” - Revelation 12:9 KJB

    “accuser of our brethren” - Revelation 12:10 KJB

    “his” [angels] - Revelation 12:7,9 KJB

    Compare also:

    “neither was their place found any more in heaven” - Revelation 12:8 KJB

    “was cast out … cast out into the earth” - Revelation 12:9 KJB

    “is cast down” - Revelation 12:10 KJB​

    [2] “Michael” and his several titles in Revelation 12:

    “Michael” - Revelation 12:7 KJB

    “Lamb” - Revelation 12:11 KJB

    “child” - Revelation 12:2,4,5 KJB

    “man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron” - Revelation 12:5,13 KJB

    “seed” - Revelation 12:17 KJB

    “it” - Revelation 12:4 KJB

    “Jesus” [even the “testimony” of] - Revelation 12:17 KJB

    “Christ” - Revelation 12:10,17

    “his” [angels] – Revelation 12:7 KJB

    Compare also:

    “caught up unto God, and to his throne.” - Revelation 12:5 KJB

    “rule all” - Revelation 12:5 KJB​

    After considering these things, let some questions be asked, and fill them in by the texts of the King James Bible themselves:

    Who is the “Dragon” of Revelation 12:3,4,7,9,13,16,17 KJB?

    Who is the “serpent” of Revelation 12:9,14,15 KJB?

    Who is the “devil” of Revelation 12:9,12 KJB?

    Who is the “Satan” of Revelation 12:9 KJB?

    Who is the “accuser of the brethren” of Revelation 12:10 KJB?

    Who was “cast out” of Revelation 12:9 KJB?

    Who was “cast down” of Revelation 12:10 KJB?

    Who is the one which “cast out of his mouth water as a flood” of Revelation 12:15,16 KJB?

    Are there any “angels” which belong, “his”, to the singular person in the verses cited, KJB?

    Does the fallen arch-rebel have many designations, KJB?

    According to the text of Revelation 12:7 KJB, what is the arch-rebel's designation in “heaven” in this verse?

    Who opposes the “Dragon”?

    Who opposes the “serpent”?

    Who opposes the “devil”?

    Who opposes the “Satan”?

    Who opposes the “accuser of the brethren”?

    Whose “angels” oppose the “angels” of that "Dragon"?

    Revelation 12 KJB:

    Is there a “woman” and a “child” and a “Dragon” in Revelation 12:1-6 KJB?

    Is there a “woman” entering into a “wilderness” for “a thousand two hundred and threescore days” [1,260 days; aka “1 time + 2 times [dual; plural of time] and half/dividing of time”; aka “42 months”] in Revelation 12:6 KJB?

    Is there a “war” in “Heaven” between “Michael” [and “his angels”] and “the Dragon” [and “his angels”], wherein “the Dragon and his angels” were “cast out” and “neither was their place found any more in heaven” in Revelation 12:7-9 KJB?

    Did the “power of his [the Father's] Christ” on earth gain the “victory” and “salvation” over and from the “accuser of our brethren” in Revelation 12:10 KJB?

    Did “they” on earth also “overcome” “him” [the accuser] by the “blood of the lamb” and by “the word of their testimony” in Revelation 12:11 KJB?

    Is there “rejoic[ing]” in the “Heavens” for them “that dwell in them”, but yet “woe” to the “inhabiters of the earth and of the sea” for the “Dragon” being cast out of “Heaven” is now “come down” unto them and was full of “wrath” and “persecuted” the Church in Revelation 12:12-13 KJB?

    Is there a “woman” entering into a “wilderness” for “a time, and times, and half a time ” [1 time + 2 times [dual; plural of time] and half/dividing of time' aka 1,260 days [“a thousand two hundred and threescore days”]; aka “42 months”] in Revelation 12:14 KJB?

    Is there a “woman” and the “remnant” of “her seed” [aka “child”] and a “Dragon” in Revelation 12:15-17 KJB?

    Revelation 12 KJB

    Whose “angels” oppose the “angels” of that Michael"?

    Who opposes the one which has the True “testimony"?

    Who opposes the “Christ”, even "Jesus Christ"?

    Who opposes the “child", even the "man child" and "it"?

    Who opposes the “lamb”?

    Who opposes “Michael”?

    According to the text of Revelation 12:7 KJB, what is the arch-defender's designation in “heaven” in this verse?

    Does the Son of God have many designations?

    Are there any “angels” which belong, “his”, to the singular person in the verses cited, KJB?

    Who is the one who has a “testimony” of Revelation 12:17 KJB?

    Who is the one to “who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron” of Revelation 12:5 KJB?

    Who is the one “caught up” of Revelation 12:5 KJB?

    Who is the “seed” of Revelation 12:17 KJB?

    Who is the “child” and “man child” and “it” of Revelation 12:2,4,5,13 KJB?

    Who is the “Christ” and “Jesus Christ” of Revelation 12:10,17 KJB?

    Who is the “lamb” of Revelation 12:11 KJB?

    Who is “Michael” of Revelation 12:7 KJB?

    If the structure is truly Chiastic in its nature, then can the identification of the beings therein ever be broken [even according to John 10:35 KJB]?

    If the Church is the Woman on the earth, and she the Body in Revelation 12:11-13 KJB and the Dragon fought against her, who then is the Heavenly Head in Revelation 12:7-9 KJB, who the Dragon warred against there?
     
  8. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
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  9. tyndale1946

    tyndale1946 Well-Known Member
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    As we scroll down skipping this dissertation on the way to a thesis... We come to Brother Martin, who will tell us in one sentence what this post is really about... Brother Glen:)

    Oops I made a mistake!... After further consulting with my wife who is a Professor and has her Masters in Education... She said it is a thesis on the way to a dissertation... I listen to her because I only hold a Phd!... (post hole digger)... Brother Glen:Biggrin
     
    #9 tyndale1946, Jul 20, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2017
  10. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    That is actually all future, yet to happen!
     
  11. One Baptism

    One Baptism Active Member

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    A shorter response:

    Revelation 12:1 KJB - And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:
    Revelation 12:2 KJB - And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.
    Revelation 12:3 KJB - And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.
    Revelation 12:4 KJB - And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.
    Revelation 12:5 KJB - And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and [to] his throne.
    Revelation 12:6 KJB - And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred [and] threescore days.​

    Symbol: “a woman” = [scriptural interpretation KJB] God’s people, whomsoever does the will [Psalms 40:8; Exodus 20:1-17 KJB] of God, being His Body, His Flock, His Church, His City:

    Matthew 12:50 KJB - For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

    Mark 3:35 KJB - For whosoever shall do the will of God, the same is my brother, and my sister, and mother.​

    In Revelation 12:1-5 KJB, the "woman" is the OT Church/peoples, God's people from Adam/Eve, unto the peoples Judah/Israel that lived just before Jesus was born, it would also include the Apostles and disciples during His time on earth in the NT, and it would include all those persons in Christ Jesus, unto the end:

    Acts 7:38 KJB - This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina, and [with] our fathers: who received the lively oracles to give unto us:

    Galatians 4:26 KJB - But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.
    She wears upon her head the 12 stars, symbolic of the 12 tribes of Israel for the OT [who had long awaited the coming Redeemer], and 12 Apostles for the NT, since the "crown" is both rulership and victory over sin.

    The "woman" after Christ Jesus ascended fled to the wilderness and was persecuted. This is not simply the 'messianc line', of which there would be no use, after the birth of Christ Jesus, to continue to identify such.

    There are many references in the OT, and NT for these things. One example [but consider the Song of Solomon itself on the whole]:

    OT:

    Jeremiah 6:2 KJB - I have likened the daughter of Zion to a comely and delicate [woman].​

    She, the "woman", is the bone of His bones, and the Flesh of His flesh, as the first Adam, so the Second Adam.

    Yet, beyond this, there is powerful material in regards what it means for the 'birth' process in Revelation 12, since not only does it depict the physical birth of Jesus Christ, but moreso, the New Birth of the whole body, that each individual must go through. We must all give birth to the character of Christ Jesus, for the second coming is even likened unto a birth process, and Jesus' people must fully reflect Him, even as He is the express image of the Father. The "woman" is "delivered" through this Birth. The Seed must be received into the Heart of the Woman, and a Birth process must come to Fruition, a harvest ... too much to go into here, more on the basic identification of the symbols of Revelation 12 later.
     
  12. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
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    Was it really that complicated? :( It wasn't meant to be.
    Very briefly, Rev. 13 is largely (from v.6) about the time between the Lord Jesus' first coming and His second, and the most important point is that Jesus wins and we are more than conquerors in Him.
     
  13. tyndale1946

    tyndale1946 Well-Known Member
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    I wasn't talking about you Brother Martin... You are the only one that makes sense... I was talking about Professor dissertation... Feel better now?... Brother Glen:)
     
  14. One Baptism

    One Baptism Active Member

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    Jesus is the "first born" of this "Woman", for there was to be many brethren [Hebrews 2 KJB,etc] [also written for our JW friends]:

    Colossians 1:15 KJB - Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:​

    “Firstborn” can literally mean the one 'who was first to be born', as in Genesis 10:15, 19:31,33,34,37, 22:21, 25:13, 27:19,32, 29:26, 35:23, 36:15, 38:6,7, 41:51, 43:33, 46:8, 48:14,18, 49:3; Exodus 4:23, 6:14, 11:5, 12:12,29, 13:2,13,15, 22:29, 34:20; Numbers 3:2,12,13,40,41,42,43,45,46,50, 8:16,17, 18:15, 33:4; Deuteronomy 21:15,16,17, 25:6; Joshua 6:26, 17:1; Judges 8:20; 1 Samuel 8:2, 14:49, 17:13; 2 Samuel 3:2; 1 Kings 16:34; 1 Chronicles 1:13,29, 2:3,13,25,27,42,50, 3:1,15, 4:4, 5:1,3, 6:28, 8:1,30,39, 9:5,31,36, 26:2,4; 2 Chronicles 21:3; Nehemiah 10:36; Psalms 78:51, 105:36, 135:8, 136:10; Micah 6:7; Matthew 1:25; Luke 2:7; Hebrews 11:28 KJB.

    However, “first born” also carries another definition, in that it also means “the chief”, “set before” [placed ahead of, or instead of], “might”, and “beginning of strength”, “excellency of dignity”, “excellency of power”, “be greater”, “higher than the kings of the earth”, “the preeminence”:

    Genesis 48:16 KJB - The Angel which redeemed me from all evil, bless the lads; and let my name be named on them, and the name of my fathers Abraham and Isaac; and let them grow into a multitude in the midst of the earth.

    Genesis 48:17 KJB - And when Joseph saw that his father laid his right hand upon the head of Ephraim, it displeased him: and he held up his father's hand, to remove it from Ephraim's head unto Manasseh's head.

    Genesis 48:18 KJB - And Joseph said unto his father, Not so, my father: for this is the firstborn; put thy right hand upon his head.

    Genesis 48:19 KJB - And his father refused, and said, I know it, my son, I know it: he also shall become a people, and he also shall be great: but truly his younger brother shall be greater than he, and his seed shall become a multitude of nations.

    Genesis 48:20 KJB - And he blessed them that day, saying, In thee shall Israel bless, saying, God make thee as Ephraim and as Manasseh: and he set Ephraim before Manasseh.​

    Manasseh was literally the “firstborn”, the preeminence went unto the younger, Ephraim, and so he was “set … before ...” Manasseh, and Ephraim would be the “greater”.

    Genesis 49:3 KJB - Reuben, thou art my firstborn, my might, and the beginning of my strength, the excellency of dignity, and the excellency of power:

    1 Chronicles 5:1 KJB - Now the sons of Reuben the firstborn of Israel, (for he was the firstborn; but, forasmuch as he defiled his father's bed, his birthright was given unto the sons of Joseph the son of Israel: and the genealogy is not to be reckoned after the birthright.​

    Reuben was literally the first to be born of Jacob/Israel, we see the words connected with “firstborn” in these texts is more than simply being first to be born, for though Reuben was this, he was still “Unstable as water ...” and would “... not excel” because of what he had done, and therefore that which would have been his by birthright, was “given unto” another, and was no longer “to be reckoned after the birthright”. Therefore the word “firstborn” was to mean more than simply first to be born, but was to carry with it all these, “... might, and the beginning of my strength, the excellency of dignity, and the excellency of power” and Reuben failed at this because of his actions.

    Exodus 4:22 KJB - And thou shalt say unto Pharaoh, Thus saith the LORD, Israel is my son, even my firstborn:​

    Israel is called “firstborn”, yet we can know by scripture that Esau, and not Jacob [Israel], was the literal firstborn [Genesis 25:25-26 KJB], but in this instance we are dealing with the spiritual matter, since Jacob was the one that overcame with God, and prevailed, and so given a new name. We can also know by scripture that Jesus is the True Israel [Hosea 11:1 and Matthew 2:15 KJB].

    Numbers 3:41 KJB - And thou shalt take the Levites for me (I am the LORD) instead of all the firstborn among the children of Israel; and the cattle of the Levites instead of all the firstlings among the cattle of the children of Israel.

    Numbers 3:42 KJB - And Moses numbered, as the LORD commanded him, all the firstborn among the children of Israel.

    Numbers 3:43 KJB - And all the firstborn males by the number of names, from a month old and upward, of those that were numbered of them, were twenty and two thousand two hundred and threescore and thirteen.

    Numbers 3:44 KJB - And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,

    Numbers 3:45 KJB - Take the Levites instead of all the firstborn among the children of Israel, and the cattle of the Levites instead of their cattle; and the Levites shall be mine: I am the LORD.

    Numbers 8:14 KJB - Thus shalt thou separate the Levites from among the children of Israel: and the Levites shall be mine.

    Numbers 8:15 KJB - And after that shall the Levites go in to do the service of the tabernacle of the congregation: and thou shalt cleanse them, and offer them for an offering.

    Numbers 8:16 KJB - For they are wholly given unto me from among the children of Israel; instead of such as open every womb, even instead of the firstborn of all the children of Israel, have I taken them unto me.

    Numbers 8:17 KJB - For all the firstborn of the children of Israel are mine, both man and beast: on the day that I smote every firstborn in the land of Egypt I sanctified them for myself.

    Numbers 8:18 KJB - And I have taken the Levites for all the firstborn of the children of Israel.​

    The children of Israel rebelled, they forfeited their right as the 'firstborn', and so God took [“taken ... for”] the Levites “instead of” them.

    Psalms 89:27 KJB - Also I will make him my firstborn, higher than the kings of the earth.​

    David [Psalms 89:20 KJB] is called “firstborn”, yet we can know by scripture that David is actually the youngest son of Jesse [1 Samuel 16:10-11 KJB]. We can also see by the use in Psalms 89:27 KJB that “firstborn” is related to pre-eminence, in other words: “higher than the kings of the earth”. David was a type pointing to Christ [Luke 24:27; John 5:39 KJB]. The term “firstborn” in this instance does not actually mean first to be born, but rather “pre-eminent, first over all, special, chosen, headship, of blessing, chief” and it was God which would “make” it this way.

    Jeremiah 31:9 KJB - They shall come with weeping, and with supplications will I lead them: I will cause them to walk by the rivers of waters in a straight way, wherein they shall not stumble: for I am a father to Israel, and Ephraim is my firstborn.​

    ... to be continued ...
     
  15. One Baptism

    One Baptism Active Member

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    ... continued ...

    Ephraim is called “firstborn”, yet we can know by scripture that Manasseh was the literal “firstborn” of Joseph [Genesis 41:50-52 KJB], and yet God also called Israel his “firstborn”:

    Exodus 4:22 KJB - And thou shalt say unto Pharaoh, Thus saith the LORD, Israel is my son, even my firstborn:

    Hosea 11:1 KJB - When Israel was a child, then I loved him, and called my son out of Egypt.

    Matthew 2:15 KJB - And was there until the death of Herod: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying, Out of Egypt have I called my son.​

    The reference to “Israel”, being the “firstborn”, in Hosea and Matthew 2:15 KJB is actually a reference to Jesus Christ.

    1 Chronicles 26:10 KJB - Also Hosah, of the children of Merari, had sons; Simri the chief, (for though he was not the firstborn, yet his father made him the chief;)

    Persons can be “made” “firstborn”, in otherwords “the chief” [the pre-eminent], without actually being the literally “firstborn”.

    Even in Job 18:12-13 [“firstborn of death”] and in Isaiah 14:30 [“firstborn of the poor”], the term “firstborn” in these instances is also being used in a figurative sense. Like “disease and decay” or “chiefest of the poor”, the most poorest of them.

    So, in considering the word “Firstborn”, what does this mean when it refers to Jesus in Colossians 1:15? Context tells us.

    The actual Greek word for “first created” is “protoktioti”, but Paul [a Jew, raised a Pharisee] chooses carefully instead, by aide of the Holy Spirit Himself [2 Timothy 3:16; 2 Peter 1:21 KJB], the Greek word for the “chosen” headship connotation: “prototokos” [“Firstborn”, see also Hebrews 1:6 KJB “first begotten into the world”; Revelation 1:5 “first begotten of the dead”]. For we are to inherit all things through Jesus Christ, for notice:

    2 Corinthians 1:20 KJB - For all the promises of God in him are yea, and in him Amen, unto the glory of God by us.​

    So when we consider again the usage in Colossians 1:15 KJB, let us look at the immediate context to see if Paul meant “firstborn” in the sense of “headship and pre-eminence of promise” or “first created”.

    We go to Colossians 1:18 KJB:

    Colossians 1:18 KJB - And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

    Paul solves the issue for us, line upon line: “... head of the body … who is the beginning … have the preeminence.”

    Now, consider the greater context of the whole of scripture, for Christ Jesus can be said to fulfill both meanings, in that not only is:

    [1] Jesus is the “firstborn”, being the preeminent one:

    Romans 9:5 KJB - Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.

    Colossians 1:16 KJB - For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

    Colossians 2:10 KJB - And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

    Ephesians 1:21 KJB - Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come:

    Ephesians 1:22 KJB - And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,

    Ephesians 1:23 KJB - Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all.

    Ephesians 3:9 KJB - And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

    Ephesians 4:15 KJB - But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:

    Hebrews 7:26 KJB - For such an high priest became us, who is holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners, and made higher than the heavens;

    John 1:3 KJB - All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.​

    [2] Jesus is also the “firstborn” of the Woman/Church:

    Isaiah 9:6 KJB - For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

    Luke 2:11 KJB - For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

    Hebrews 2:10 KJB - For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.

    Revelation 12:1 KJB - And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:

    Revelation 12:2 KJB - And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.

    Revelation 12:3 KJB - And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.

    Revelation 12:4 KJB - And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.

    Revelation 12:5 KJB - And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

    Revelation 12:13 KJB - And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.
     
  16. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
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    I really wouldn't bother. Oops! Too late. :rolleyes:
     
  17. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
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    :)
     
  18. One Baptism

    One Baptism Active Member

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    Those 'protestants' that have taken up the words, doctrines and practices of the whorish woman of Revelation 17, are to be pitied, for they have taken up that which will destroy them and their reason for existing - Jesuit Preterism and Jesuit Futurism, Jesuit Amillennialism and Jesuit Mysticism [Mystic]:

    These poor persons, to be patient with and cared for, and loved, do not even understand their own history, nor the cause to effect;

    etc
     
  19. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    The passages that you quoted are yet to happen!
     
  20. One Baptism

    One Baptism Active Member

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    Easily shown that it isn't, but perhaps you may want to do some thorough research first?

    I would recommend to you several great [large, hundreds of pages, documenting Historical material, etc] books on these things:

    The Two Republics [just read the First and Last four Chapters and the Appendix, if it seem too long, I have read this whole book, and have it on my shelf] -

    https://www.whitehorsemedia.com/docs/the_two_republics.pdf

    The Prophetic Faith Of Our Fathers Volume 1 -

    http://documents.adventistarchives.org/Books/PFOF1950-V01.pdf

    The Prophetic Faith Of Our Fathers Volume 2 -

    http://documents.adventistarchives.org/Books/PFOF1948-V02.pdf

    The Prophetic Faith Of Our Fathers Volume 3 -

    http://documents.adventistarchives.org/Books/PFOF1946-V03.pdf

    The Prophetic Faith Of Our Fathers Volume 4 -

    http://documents.adventistarchives.org/Books/PFOF1954-V04.pdf
     
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