death penalty?

[canadyjd]

The issue is not about governments, it is about the attitudes Christians should have toward those who have committed the worst of sins. Jesus Christ commands us to follow His example of "perfect patience" with such people. Seeking the death of someone is the opposite of "perfect patience".

peace to youraying:

 

[Servent]

death penalty

Had it not been for the death penalty Christ whould not have been crucified.
No death no salvation.

 

[Blammo]

Paul's attitude toward the death penalty:

Acts 25:11 For if I be an offender, or have committed any thing worthy of death, I refuse not to die: but if there be none of these things whereof these accuse me, no man may deliver me unto them. I appeal unto Caesar.

 

[Revmitchell]

The issue is not about governments, it is about the attitudes Christians should have toward those who have committed the worst of sins. Jesus Christ commands us to follow His example of "perfect patience" with such people. Seeking the death of someone is the opposite of "perfect patience".

peace to youraying:

Please provide scripture that is in the context and application of the death penalty.

 

[tinytim]

The issue is not about governments, it is about the attitudes Christians should have toward those who have committed the worst of sins. Jesus Christ commands us to follow His example of "perfect patience" with such people. Seeking the death of someone is the opposite of "perfect patience".

peace to youraying:

Oh, but the issue is about government.. the governments are the only ones that have the right to put anyone to death.... if individuals were to do this, it would be murder.

God gave government the right.

 

[canadyjd]

Paul's attitude toward the death penalty:

Acts 25:11 For if I be an offender, or have committed any thing worthy of death, I refuse not to die: but if there be none of these things whereof these accuse me, no man may deliver me unto them. I appeal unto Caesar.

Paul is not talking about seeking the death of someone else, is he? Seems to me this is Paul's attitude toward the charges that had been made against him by Jewish leaders who were trying to kill him. No where does Paul say Christians should seek or support the death of anyone.

Paul said in I Tim 16: "And yet for this reason I found mercy, in order that in me as the foremost (sinner), Jesus Christ might demonstrate His perfect patience as an example for those who would believe in Him for eternal life."

Paul was a murderer, a persecutor of the church. Earlier in I Tim. Paul gives a long list of sinners and includes murderers, and even those who kill their mothers and fathers. After that long list, he says he is the worst sinner of all. Jesus demonstrated perfect patience with Paul the murderer specifically to be an example to future believers. This is obviously an example we are expected to apply to our own attitudes toward sinners.

If we would follow Christ, we must follow His command to have perfect patience toward sinners, even the worst of sinners. Seeking or supporting the death of someone is the opposite of "perfect patience".

peace to youraying:

 

[canadyjd]

Oh, but the issue is about government.. the governments are the only ones that have the right to put anyone to death.... if individuals were to do this, it would be murder.

God gave government the right.

Christians are in no way obligated to support something that is contrary to what God has taught us in His Word.

peace to youraying:

 

[Blammo]

Paul is not talking about seeking the death of someone else, is he? Seems to me this is Paul's attitude toward the charges that had been made against him by Jewish leaders who were trying to kill him. No where does Paul say Christians should seek or support the death of anyone.

He said: If I am guilty, I refuse not to die. Pretty plain, don't ya think?

 

[Bro Tony]

God doesn't seem to have a problem with the death penalty. He also did not have a problem with His people executing the punishment. You don't have to read very far in the Scripture to find this out. Paul in the Book of Romans chapter 13 tells us that governments are ordained by God to carry out punishment for those who break the law. In the Book of Revelation it seems once again God will be distributing the death penalty and not just on His own, but the two prophets also.

Bro Tony

 

[David Michael Harris]

He said: If I am guilty, I refuse not to die. Pretty plain, don't ya think?

Thats a good point, but it was what he expected from non Christian rule. It does not mean that a Christians view point should lead to that.

Should we not have a greater attitude of forgiveness? Knowing what we know!

 

[canadyjd]

He said: If I am guilty, I refuse not to die. Pretty plain, don't ya think?

I see no command for Christians to seek or support the death of anyone.

peace to youraying:

 

[Blammo]

I see no command for Christians to seek or support the death of anyone.

peace to youraying:

Good thing I don't seek or support the death of anyone. Just like I don't seek or support war. I also did not seek or support my hernia operation.

 

[canadyjd]

God doesn't seem to have a problem with the death penalty. He also did not have a problem with His people executing the punishment. You don't have to read very far in the Scripture to find this out. Paul in the Book of Romans chapter 13 tells us that governments are ordained by God to carry out punishment for those who break the law. In the Book of Revelation it seems once again God will be distributing the death penalty and not just on His own, but the two prophets also.

Bro Tony

And God is the only one with the Divine wisdom and Divine righteousness to carry out the death penalty.

Romans 13 is a warning to Christians not to rebel against the government. Again, we have no obligation to support something contrary to the teachings of Christ just because the government does it.

I am not one of the prophets and God does not need my help to kill anyone. Therefore, I will follow His example of "perfect patience" and leave the administration of the death penalty to God.

peace to youraying:

 

[canadyjd]

Good thing I don't seek or support the death of anyone./quote]

In this country, Christians have the opportunity to help decide whether the death penalty is allowed. Not to mention potential jury selection in which the death penalty is an option.

peace to youraying:

 

[av1611jim]

We as Christians should seek to lead sinners to a saving knowledge of Jesus Christ. That is why there are so many good Jail and Prison Ministries in this country. We (I am a Jail and Prison minister) go as Jesus commanded us in Matthew 28.

God on the other hand has ordained Government for the purpose of maintaining peaceful societies. Other Governments may and do fail miserably at this task but ours does a pretty good job of it. Should we refuse to meet out justice, ours would be a society of anarchy. Remember this, and burn it into your brain...: "Be not DECEIVED God is NOT mocked. For whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap." This is a law which no man, saved or lost, can deny. Ya' plant corn, ya' gunna git corn, buddy!

Paul and Peter both have commanded us to be obedient to our Governments. See Romans 13 and 1 Peter 2. In BOTH passages these APOSTLES of Our Lord and Saviour and God explain the purpose of Government. It is to punish evildoers.

God, who is the same yesterday, today and forever, commanded the death penalty waaaaaaay back in Genesis for he who sheds another man's blood. This same God who said it in Genesis 9, is the same one who died for your and my sins.

Therefore: it is ludicrous to claim that Jesus never taught the death penalty. "I and my Father are one !!!!!

And finally, we Christians, do NOT seek the death of anyone. It is God who COMMANDED it.

 

[Magnetic Poles]

Funny how many "pro-life" people are all for the death penalty. Where's the sanctity of life in that?

 

[av1611jim]

Funny how many "pro-life" people are all for the death penalty. Where's the sanctity of life in that?

Where is the "sanctity of life" for the EVILDOERS' victims whom you refuse justice for???

 

[canadyjd]

Paul and Peter both have commanded us to be obedient to our Governments. See Romans 13 and 1 Peter 2. In BOTH passages these APOSTLES of Our Lord and Saviour and God explain the purpose of Government. It is to punish evildoers.

They also said "We must obey God rather than men." (Acts 5:29)

The warning of Romans 13 is to Christians not to rebel. It in no way implies or specifically states we should seek the death of anyone. In fact, Romans 12 teaches against such an attitude. The Christian's attitude should be different from the world's attitude.

Romans 12:17 "Never pay back evil for evil to anyone..." (v.19) Never take your own revenge, beloved, but leave room for the wrath of God, for it is written, 'Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,' says the Lord." (v.21) Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good."

God alone despenses justice. Just because God uses evil human beings to punish and kill other evil human beings does not mean Christians should be joining hands with the ones doing the killing. We should be praying for such people, entreating God to show mercy.

God, who is the same yesterday, today and forever, commanded the death penalty waaaaaaay back in Genesis for he who sheds another man's blood. This same God who said it in Genesis 9, is the same one who died for your and my sins.

Genesis 9 does not command the death penalty. In context, it comes in the midst of God explaining the difference between animals and human beings. It is not an absolute statement (If you kill someone you will be killed yourself, without fail), but a general statement demonstrating the importance of human beings in the eyes of God.

There were no governments at the time, therefore the "death penalty" is not being mentioned. It is most likely a reference to the ancient Near East practice of the "blood avenger".

We do not live under the Old Testament Laws which command the death penalty for certain offenses. Jesus repealed any authority that human beings had been given to administer the death penalty in John 8.

When Jesus tells the crowd ( John 8 v.7) "He who is without sin among you, let him be the first to throw a stone at her.", He isn't just trying to shame them. He is referring to the Old Testament Law where a person could be put to death on the testimony of two witnesses (Deut. 17:5-7).

Jesus has changed the standard for administering the death penalty. No longer do two or three witnesses begin the stoning (thus putting the blood of the person killed on their own heads). The only person who can adminster the death penalty is "He who is without sin". That narrows the field to God alone.

As far as God being the same yesterday, today, and forever; God showed mercy to the murderer Cain (prior to Gen. 9). God showed mercy to the murderer Moses (prior to the Law). God showed mercy to the murderer David (after the giving of the Law). God showed mercy to the murderer Paul (after the resurrection of Jesus Christ). God is constantly showing mercy and compassion to the worst of sinners. So should we.

Jesus has shown mercy and has commanded us to follow His example. It is unChristlike to seek or support the death of anyone.

peace to youraying:

 

[Magnetic Poles]

Where is the "sanctity of life" for the EVILDOERS' victims whom you refuse justice for???

Who said I refuse justice? I would think life in prison would be worse than being quietly "put to sleep". I just don't have a "lust for blood" like you do.

 

[canadyjd]

Where is the "sanctity of life" for the EVILDOERS' victims whom you refuse justice for???

When did Jesus give Christians the responsibility to punish sinners or administer secular justice?

peace to youraying: