decrees that are absolutely unchangable

Is God not allowed to grieve at that which He knows will be. Yes, what He knew was to be at the end from the beginning was pleasing to Him but that does not remove the heart of God from His creation during events within time. God is not without feeling, for though He is soveriegn, Holy and Just, He is also Loving, Merciful, Kind, Compassionate, full of Grace. God also decreed that Christ would die and take upon Himself our sin, thus becoming sin Himself and we know from scripture that it pleased God that this would be. Yet we find at His death, a great earthquake tore the land, Darkness came at noon day - all were signs of Gods grief concerning the death of His Son whom He knew was slain from the foundation of the World.

He did not repent after the manner of man do to anyone or thing, for He is God and is not submitted nor to be submitted to anyone or thing that He would repent thus and turn for their pleasure that He might obtain a right relationship with them.

I believe that God used a word that we could grasp and that our experiences could conceptualize, so as to get a glimpse of Gods love and anger toward His creation. In Gen we see God repented He made man and was to bring judgment

But we also see in Exd that God repented of judgment He intened to bring:

It reveals God is moved, and not some distant uncaring God. For Both His Judgement and His mercy were due to His Love for His creation. He loved his creation and would not allow them to continue in a life of rebellion, but also He loved them that He would withhold His intended and Righteous Judgement that they may be spared.

Adam and Eve in the Garden is not the beginning of Gods decrees. They were known and set forth, which is what brought creation, time, and space into existence. Remember that All things were to Him because it was and was to be exactly as He knew - and it was good.

Maybe I'm not following you as you hoped. Try it in smaller pieces and lets see what we come up with

Agreed :wavey:

 

Not everyone has faith ( 2 Thess.3:2 )

Allan , I had already discussed this verse earlier . You seem intent on making it say something which is the very reverse of the force of the verse . And your #10 post did not help your case a bit .

You had said there : " ...we do not find in scripture God 'giving' faith to anyone in the sense they never had it . Why -- because it is something already present within man to use."

Well , Allan , your contention is not only not found in Scripture -- Scripture itself testifies against your man-made philosophy .

Acts 18:28c ... to those who by grace had believed .

2 Cor. 4:6 For God ... made his light shine in our hearts to give us the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Christ .

Phil. 1:29 For it has been granted to you ... to believe on him...

2 Peter 1:1 To those who ... received a faith as precious as ours .

Your view is purely philosophical , not biblical . God indeed gives ( or grants ) us faith . We did not have it before -- in any measure . Your view is similiar to those who insist that everyone has some good in them-- even a sliver . Of course we know from the Word of God that that is patent nonsense .

The Lord gives faith to us which we did not have before just as much as He gives repentance to us . Now I suppose you are going to say that everyone has a measure of repentance in them too ?!

Spurgeon said something to the effect that he was more willing to belive that the Lord gives everyone a measuse of grease than to think that He gives a measure of grace to everyone .

 

Until you seek reconciliation through repentence Rippon, our dialog is and has been at an end. But I will state this (for the benifit of others), not one of your verses gives gredence to God giving man something he never had, but the opportunity through grace to use it toward that which he never could.

 

I think it is quite apparent that my verses demonstrated that God gives people something they never had . He gave them something from nothing -- much like the creation of the world .

And the Bible makes it very clear that the natural person can't accept the things that come from the Spirit of God . There is no glimmer of faith in humans . The Lord alone gives believing faith to the elect -- they do not have a speck of it themselves . That's very humanistic thinking on your part BTW .

 

I will continue to pray for you Rippon, that God will grant you repentence. That is all.

 

Allan - there are plenty on this Board who agree with your beliefs, and plenty who believe as Rippon does. All of us need to be granted repentance for the many times each day we go against God in thought, word and deed. (I know I do). I am puzzled as to why you should openly and publicly single out Rippon as being in particular need of repentance. Is it just because he disagrees with you on some things? I am sure you didn't mean it like this, but that could come over as meaning, "I know I am right. Rippon is wrong, and his wrongness is sinful." (I say again for emphasis that I am sure you didn't mean it like this.)

 

The issue has nothing to do with this thread.

Rippon and I have been going rounds for almost a year now and it got fairly bad.
So I asked if we could talk about it and be reconciled to one another. I appolgized for any previous things I may have stated that would have offended him, upset, whatever. I offered to have him PM me so we could talk. But he didn't want that.

The sad part about it is, that another person who wasn't even involved appologized for a simple misunderstanding about something I wrote. But Rippon will not.

You can read it here (it is only the last two pages but more specifically the last one:
http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?t=36954

 

I apologise if I have raised an off-topic matter. It was just that I had seen twice on this thread your statement about praying that God would grant Rippon repentance that I wrongly assumed it must be thread-related. Sorry.

 

No appology needed. And I can understand your concern and appreciate your delicateness in addressing it.

I just have never met a believer who will not seek to be reconciled to another who is genuinely seeking it. But there are always firsts, you just would hope this wouldn't be something named amoung the brethren.

Thank you though for seeking peace amoung troubles

 

Allan , if "The issue has nothing to do with this thread" --- then why bring up an irrelevancy ? Your professed piety is galling .

 

No, that is adding to what I stated because I did not speak of God's grief being one of continuence. Scripture does speak of God being grieved (repentent) on differing occassions in the OT, but it was always in conjunction on a large scale. Like God repented that He created man (mankind) and also like the other example I gave of the LORD repented of the evil which he thought to do unto his people. We only see this at different points within the scripture. Gods grief and repenting are not to be understood in a humanistic sense but it is given so that we might have something to grasp and give some comprehension to it. His creation when He was done was pleasing to Him and good, but later after the fall man had become so corrupt and the world so twisted from its orginal state it would no doubt be a grief to God even knowing the fulness of all things.

Another example is the Holy Spirit (who is God) is grieved when we act in sin as well. One is in the larger scheme of things (like mankind and the Nation of Israel) where we see God being grieved and the other is more personal in our day to day lives for the believer who is united in Christ unto God.

I don't understand where you got this. ??
God did not cry out in anquish or disbelief. He was grieved.

Partly, but also to Love Him who is Love because we were created to also fellowship with God.

I think you trying to break it down TO much. God never specifies specifically the 'why' certain things cause Him grief or to repent, we just know that there are times according to God Himself He does.

The only place that specifies when and why God is grieved, is in the NT regarding God the Holy Spirit being grieved when a believers walks in sin.

The same place scripture states He decrees began - Before the foundation of the World. Was not Christ slain BEFORE the foundation (creation) of the World? Are we not written in the Lambs book of Life - BEFORE the foundation (creation) of the World? All things began when God knew all that will be and spoke them forth into existence.

I appreciate that. May God bless you richly in wisdom and grace.

 

There is nothing wrong with endevoring to seek out more of God, so long as we do not go beyond what scripture states to that which we assume it implies - agreed. (this of course is specific to the nature and emotions of the Eternal God)

I have enjoyed them as well.

I think to did misunderstand me some what. When God repents, grief is there, but just because God is grieved does not mean He repents. I was mearly showing the scriptures relating to Gods repentence was in regard to a much larger people group (or world) than individuals. God has grief towards His children in the NT when we sin (though He does not repent of us) but in the OT God repents (implying grief) regarding a group (Israle when He repented of what He was going to do to them for disobedience) or the World (when God repented He made man and then sent the flood).

It is true that God has not revealed everything about Himself or His ways in scripture. Does not the scriptures state: His ways are higher than our ways, and His thoughts than ours. That God is beyond finding out - In other words - No matter how much could ever learn about Him, He is beyond our imagination and comprehension. So even our greatest understanding of Him is nothing more than a mere shadow of who and what He truly is. That is why I stated above "There is nothing wrong with endevoring to seek out more of God, so long as we do not go beyond what scripture states to that which we assume it implies"

That should be said of all. And of a truth it should be all our endevering. However, please remember that knowledge without firm understanding isn't wisdom but folly. It is the fear of the Lord which is both Knowledge and Wisodom, but unless one understands the truth and not just knows about it (even to if fullest detail) it is all vainity just as faith without works is a dead faith. We must not only strive to know but we must (and doublely so) seek to live out ALL that we know. That is why it is called our spiritual growth. If you stuff yourself with to much knowledge without excersizing that which you have gorged yourself on, you will become spiritually fat. But if you seek to always do things without seeking the knowledge which gives it meaning and value, you will always be malnurised and at deaths door. All that we learn we must also learn to practice that we might grown in knowledge and grace of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Very true. I've almost drowned myself a time or two. :laugh:

Nothing wrong with that brother. Just pace yourself, and as the LORD reveals then you enjoy.

I'm not exactly sure what you are wanting here. Why don't you tell me your view of Mat 12:43-45 and I see if I follow or differ since I'm not sure what you are looking for. IF that is alright?

 

Sorry I haven't responded in a while. I will get to it, I have just been busy. :saint: