"Devotion" to Mary...

Frankly, I think the truth is that the RC Church gives undue attention to Mary, and protestants don't pay enough respect to Mary, as the mother of Jesus.

Cheers,

Jim

 

I think in the end I pray that if God calls on me to do a task that I am just as obedient, despite the cost, as Mary was. She is a shining example of how we are to respond to God unlike Zechariah at the announcement of the coming birth of John the Baptist.

 

When it comes to doctrines of the church -- I have to say that is very sound advice -- "sola scriptura".

In Christ,

Bob

 

Well done ,someone who has the guts to say what they think , the RCC is nothing short of a cult , may the lord of hosts draw them and lead them to salvation.

 

Yup....the head of the cult is of course Our Redeemer so I am okay with that definition....I am a cult member

 

Devotion to Mary reminds me of the Pharisees devotion to Moses. John 5:45
Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust. I can imagine the same Mary whom they claim to worship is accusing them too.

 

And so (full circle!), where does that leave us with regard to eg: Calvinism -v- Arminianism? Whose interpretation on that issue should I go with, and why?

 

And just where do you think the term "venerate" came from AiC? Is it just a made up word?

My young Padawan learner, much to learn you have...

The Jews understood the difference between "veneration" and "worship", my Padawan learner...A pious Jew kisses the Mezuza on his door post...he kisses his prayer shawl before putting it on...he kisses the tallenin before he binds them to his forehead and arm...he kisses the Torah be he reads it....No doubt Jesus Christ being a Jew himself and active in the Synagogues teaching would have did likewise reading the Scriptures.

Myself being the pious Amercian I am, served in the US Navy for four years...I venerated the US Flag numerous times on a daily basis with a saulte.

Oh, and I must admit my Padawan learner...I also, ummm, venerated my sweet girlfriends picture ever day with a kiss...

In XC
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I can testify to that as well. Messianic Jews (those that practice Judaism but believe Jesus is the Messiah) practice veneration of the Mezuza, prayer shawl, etc.

In fact, when I visit the home of a Messianic Jew, I likewise venerate the Mezuza, out of respect the the household of which I am about to enter.

 

It is an English word. Need I remind you that Paul and the other writers of the Scriptures did not use the KJV. The word is found neither in the KJV, nor the Hebrew, nor the Greek.

 

Actually it is, in a manner of speaking: 'venerate' is indeed an English word but one heavily rooted in Latin, where the equivalent word is veneratio. The equivalent in Greek is doulia; its Hebrew equivalent, שׁחה is used in the OT (often (mis)translated 'prostrate' or 'worship' in its context) eg: Gen 23:7; 27:29; 33:3; 1 Samuel 25:41; 1 Kings 1:23; 2 Kings 2:15.

 

Regardless, the Jews venerated and worshipped and they understood the differences, as I pointed out...Unless you want to claim pious Jews never did such...

In XC
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I was aware that venerate came from Latin. One cannot make the leap from Latin to Hebrew and Greek by using synonyms. It doesn't work that way. You tried to do that when you said: "the equivalent in Greek is.." But it is not the equivalent for it is not the same word. The truth still stands. The word is not found: not in the KJV, not in the Greek, and not in the Hebrew Scriptures. No use in skirting around the issue.

 

Well, its use in Greek and Hebrew is synonymous: the Greek Orthodox use the word doulia to describe the honour paid by them to saints (they use the word hyperdoulia to refer to what they render to Mary), and Catholic theologians likewise use this Greek word interchangeably with veneratio. And I've given OT examples of the Hebrew, so people can draw their own conclusions as to the extent to which they are interchangeable.

 

Venerate means worship. If you venerate an object you worship it.
Different cultures have different customs, some of which you fail to understand in your quest to keep on worshiping idols in the RCC and Orthodox churches.

For example I have seen believers in eastern nations kiss the Bible also--out of respect, not worship. Here are some other things they also do.
They will never lay their Bible on the floor (though they themselves sit on the floor in their simple churches).
When sitting on the floor they will not allow one's feet to be pointed toward the Bible, for that is a mark of disrespect.
When the Bible is carried to class or church, or anywhere it is carried on top of all things--not in the middle or under a stack of books.
To repeat: always put your Bible in your lap, or on your chair--never near your feet.

Thus you can easily see that the mere kiss of a Bible is a simple mark of respect, along with all the rest of the cultural customs. When put all together one can see how great importance they place on the Word of God, far more than the average American.

 

But there is no difference, and you have not given any viable OT differences. To try and draw a dichotomy between these words, when they actually both mean worship is simply a facade, an excuse so that the RCC can say we are not committing idolatry when they really are. Worship belongs to God alone.

 

Which words? Neither veneratio or doulia mean 'worship', which is of course due only to God.

 

Venerate means worship. There is no way around that.
If I am correct about doulia, it also has the same connotation.

 

Why DHK? Why make stuff up?

The American dictionary, Merriam-Webster, does NOT define "Venerate" as an act of worshiping! So why force upon the word something it's NOT, just to push your agenda?

And THAT'S what we DO DHK, every single Sunday! We venerate the Bible with a kiss! We also venerate an ICON of Mary with a kiss! Out of reverential respect.

I did the EXACT same thing in the Navy in regard to my salutes to the Flag and also the Officer of the Deck...was I worshipping the Officer of the Deck or any Officer I saluted?

In XC
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