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Featured Free Will

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by ryarn, Mar 11, 2019.

  1. ryarn

    ryarn Member
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    Is the only time we have Free Will is after we are saved because then we are capable of really making the right decisions through guidance of the Holy Spirit ?
     
  2. Dave Gilbert

    Dave Gilbert Active Member

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    To me it's kind of complicated.

    Some consider "free will" the ability to choose to follow Christ, without any "interference" from God.
    Some consider "free will" to be freedom of choice, which makes man a responsible, thinking and reasoning creature.
    Some see "free will" as being bound by the nature...so born-again, regenerate believers have the will "freed" from sin,to do what God commands... while natural, dead-in-sins unbelievers have the "free will" to ignore God's commands in favor of anything but God and His ways.

    Biblically, I believe the last two.
     
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  3. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist Well-Known Member
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    I believe that the only human beings that had free will were Adam and Eve. After the fall, I believe every human being has free agency or freedom to express themselves within the boundaries of their fallen nature.
     
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  4. calledbyHisgrace

    calledbyHisgrace New Member

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    Do a google search on "natural ability and moral ability". You'll find some good information on this topic.
     
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  5. Pastor_Bob

    Pastor_Bob Well-Known Member

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    Free will has been present since the creation of man.

    Everyone in the antediluvian period had the freedom of choice to respond to Noah's preaching (II Peter 2:5) and get on the ark. Only Noah and 7 others exercised their free will to do so; the rest of the world exercised their free will and refused to get on the ark. The ark is a definite picture and type of salvation. As such, men have the freedom of will either to get in the ark of salvation or to refuse.
     
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  6. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    Was Adam and Eve's Spiritual Nature alive?
     
  7. ryarn

    ryarn Member
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  8. ryarn

    ryarn Member
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    If man is fallen how can he even comprehend or make a choice to chose Christ, wouldn't his fallen nature make him chose non belief ?
     
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  9. Dave Gilbert

    Dave Gilbert Active Member

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    I think it's more like choosing hatred of Christ and love of sin ( Romans 1:28-32, John 3:19-20 ).
    Non-belief is probably too tame a word, IMO.

    Unbelievers hate Jesus Christ and those who love Him ( Matthew 10:22, Matthew 24:9, John 7:7, John 15:18 ) ...just ask them why they use His name as a curse word.
    They think nothing of it, it comes so natural to some of them.:(

    The Bible describes those who are not born-again with these words:

    " having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:
    19 who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanness with greediness."
    ( Ephesians 4:19-20 )

    Someone who is blind, cannot choose to believe in Someone that has not been revealed to them.
     
    #9 Dave Gilbert, Mar 12, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2019
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  10. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    People choose what seems best to themselves at the moment they choose. There are a multitude of influencing conditions on every person with every decision.

    I don't think unbelievers look at it as choosing unbelief. Most, imo, don't see themselves as choosing hatred of Jesus, even though many do hate what Jesus teaches.

    The fallen nature makes it impossible for a man to see the benefit of belief and, therefore, choose faith in God over other desires and choices.
     
  11. Pastor_Bob

    Pastor_Bob Well-Known Member

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    Consider Sergius Paulus:

    Acts 13:5 And when they were at Salamis, they preached the word of God in the synagogues of the Jews: and they had also John to their minister.
    6 And when they had gone through the isle unto Paphos, they found a certain sorcerer, a false prophet, a Jew, whose name was Barjesus:
    7 Which was with the deputy of the country, Sergius Paulus, a prudent man; who called for Barnabas and Saul, and desired to hear the word of God
    . (KJV)

    This man was definitely an unbeliever. He was close associates with a sorcerer and false prophet who literally wanted to keep him from hearing the gospel. Sergius Paulus, in his fallen, unsaved condition, made the choice to call for Barnabas and Saul and "desired to hear the word of God." Ultimately, he believed and was saved. This is a clear demonstration of man's free will.
     
  12. SovereignGrace

    SovereignGrace Well-Known Member
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    When I was lost, I’d talk about the Bible all day with ppl. However, when they tried to convert me, I’d back away. Just because he desired to hear the word does not mean he has free will. The lost do not have free will, but have their will enslaved to sin and Satan.
     
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  13. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    Prove your position with scripture please?
    MB
     
  14. Pastor_Bob

    Pastor_Bob Well-Known Member

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    You exercised your free will to talk about the Bible. You exercised your free will to back away when they tried to convert you.

    He acted upon that which he desired - that is free will.

    Fallen man still has the image of God present in them. They are still able to hear His voice and respond to His offer of salvation. Some respond by accepting - some respond by rejecting.
     
  15. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    Prove your point with scripture
    MB
     
  16. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    I wouldn't pay much attention to Sovereign Grace He never proves what he claims.
    MB
     
  17. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    Please show scripture for your position.
    MB
     
  18. Dave Gilbert

    Dave Gilbert Active Member

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    I've done that, many times.;)
    I encourage you to read Romans chapters 1-3 where Scripture speaks of the default condition of mankind and his relationship to God, as well as Romans chapters 7-8 where it talks about the differences between the "inner man" and the outer man and the carnal mind being at enmity with God, while the believer's mind is not.

    May God bless you, sir.:)
     
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  19. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    Yes I've read all of Romans several times over the years and there is no Calvinist doctrine there. Nor is there a reason this doctrine should even be assumed.
    MB
     
  20. Dave Gilbert

    Dave Gilbert Active Member

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    Several times?
    How many years are we talking about, if I may ask?

    Honest question...
    Did you feel that that was enough?
    If I may ask, how often do you read through the Scriptures?

    I'm only asking because my experience has been that each time I have read through them, God shows me a tidbit I didn't see before.
    Each bit and detail builds up over time, and I see things now that I did not see even two weeks ago.
     
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