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Gov't plan: Private insurance will be illegal!

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rbell

Active Member
This might be the scariest issue of all, regarding our proposed fascist healthcare system:

This Investor's Business Daily article, they go further than our congressmen: they actually read the bill. Here's the shocking truth:

When we first saw the paragraph Tuesday, just after the 1,018-page document was released, we thought we surely must be misreading it. So we sought help from the House Ways and Means Committee.

It turns out we were right: The provision would indeed outlaw individual private coverage. Under the Orwellian header of "Protecting The Choice To Keep Current Coverage," the "Limitation On New Enrollment" section of the bill clearly states:

"Except as provided in this paragraph, the individual health insurance issuer offering such coverage does not enroll any individual in such coverage if the first effective date of coverage is on or after the first day" of the year the legislation becomes law.
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So we can all keep our coverage, just as promised — with, of course, exceptions: Those who currently have private individual coverage won't be able to change it. Nor will those who leave a company to work for themselves be free to buy individual plans from private carriers.
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SOURCE

How could anyone with any modicum of intelligence support this gosh-awful piece of legislation?

Keep in mind...if you are an American like me...one who prefers to provide for yourself and not rely on the generosity of others...you can keep your insurance you have. But you better not, EVER, wish to change it. And you better not, EVER, change jobs, or move to another state.

I cannot fathom how anyone could possibly support this.
 
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rbell

Active Member
Magnetic Poles said:
And the sky is falling, the trolls are coming out from under the bridges, and flying monkeys are coming to take the children! Katy, bar the door!
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I notice that you didn't deal with any of my evidence.....at all.

If what I'm showing is not right, how 'bout refuting it?

I just showed, from the bill itself, a terrible consequence of this legislation.

Refute it, please.





That's what I thought. :thumbs:
 
D

donnA

Active Member
Magnetic Poles said:
And the sky is falling, the trolls are coming out from under the bridges, and flying monkeys are coming to take the children! Katy, bar the door!
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now prove it.
Makes sense, if private insurance is going, then so are those jobs. Prove that if private isnurance is illegal people won't lose jobs.
 
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Mexdeaf

New Member
Magnetic Poles said:
And the sky is falling, the trolls are coming out from under the bridges, and flying monkeys are coming to take the children! Katy, bar the door!
Click to expand...

According to your compatriots, the sky IS falling ("global warming" or "climate change"), the trolls are "the rich", and the flying monkeys are anyone who doesn't agree with their vision of "change" (at any cost).

It's too late to bar the door, we already let O in the White house and the gave the Dems the keys to our country.

It's sad, really. People are blinded by their optimism and lulled to sleep by their complacency. Putin won't have to fire a shot.
 
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Magnetic Poles

New Member
rbell said:
I notice that you didn't deal with any of my evidence.....at all.

If what I'm showing is not right, how 'bout refuting it?

I just showed, from the bill itself, a terrible consequence of this legislation.

Refute it, please.





That's what I thought. :thumbs:
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What you did was pull a section out of context from an op-ed piece. If you find a link to the entire bill, we can actually discuss it. I heard on the radio yesterday where they were discussing this very rightie talking point...and showing that in an adjacent section there are caveats that don't do at all what this out of context section seems to do according to rightie editorials.
 
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rbell

Active Member
Magnetic Poles said:
What you did was pull a section out of context from an op-ed piece. If you find a link to the entire bill, we can actually discuss it. I heard on the radio yesterday where they were discussing this very rightie talking point...and showing that in an adjacent section there are caveats that don't do at all what this out of context section seems to do according to rightie editorials.
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Wrong. I quoted a section of the bill itself.

How do you discuss a 1,200 page bill? You must discuss sections.

It obviously states that those who currently have private individual coverage won't be able to change it. Nor will those who leave a company to work for themselves be free to buy individual plans from private carriers. Now...if other sections state otherwise, then it's a badly written bill that contradicts itself.
 
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Magnetic Poles

New Member
rbell said:
Wrong. I quoted a section of the bill itself.

How do you discuss a 1,200 page bill? You must discuss sections.

It obviously states that those who currently have private individual coverage won't be able to change it. Nor will those who leave a company to work for themselves be free to buy individual plans from private carriers. Now...if other sections state otherwise, then it's a badly written bill that contradicts itself.
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The bill is 615 pages, and available at http://wonkroom.thinkprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/06/help-bill.pdf .

I did a text search and cannot find your excerpt, which is not from the bill directly, but in the op ed you cited.
 
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Magnetic Poles

New Member
rbell said:
Now...if other sections state otherwise, then it's a badly written bill that contradicts itself.
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Not necessarily...even contracts usually have sections that list exceptions and provisos. This is not uncommon in legislation either. I would like to examine the language in question in its entire context. If the link I found is not the right one, I would like to see the current version. Don't know if it is or if it isn't. But don't fall for right wing fearmongering, nor for left wing cheerleading.
 
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tinytim

<img src =/tim2.jpg>
No.. I don't.. but I did notice that's the senate's version.. Isn't there a house version.

And I heard there were more versions, like one from the republicans...

To tell you the truth.. I am sooo confused on the issue.. and that bill doesn't help... lol
I was hoping to find one I could understand.

I am afraid this is one time I can't comment... <<<<OOOO>>>>>
 
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Magnetic Poles

New Member
I'll give you this...both of these bills just about require a J.D. to make heads or tails of. This is what we get when we have lawyers and lobbyists running the show. I did notice there are references to other laws as exceptions, without specifying what those exceptions are.
 
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Magnetic Poles

New Member
I think THIS is a pretty good analysis as to why the OP is parroting the fearmongering of the right. I would advise reading this analysis in its entirety, but here is one excerpt below. In short, new private plans CAN be offered, but they must meet the new standards (e.g. no pre-existing conditions exclusions).

Excerpt:
Backing up a little more. In order for a new plan for individual or group insurance to be offered it has to meet three tests under 101 (b):those of Sub-title B: Affordable Coverage, Sub-title C: Essential Benefits, and Sub-title D: Consumer Protection. If you meet those tests you are allowed to write new individual policies. Nothing is outlawed except the right to sell inadequate plans to new customers.

​
While I don't think either of these bills are perfect, I don't buy into the spin that the righties are using. This is more fearmongering, which seems to be right out of their play book. Instead, they should offer a plan of their own, rather than purposefully pulling sections out of context and using them to build fear.
 
Aaron

Aaron

Member
Site Supporter
Magnetic Poles said:
And the sky is falling, the trolls are coming out from under the bridges, and flying monkeys are coming to take the children! Katy, bar the door!
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Said Obama, which is why this "reform" must be passed. No time to debate it. We gotta pass it NOW!
 
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