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H1N1's Damage Close Up

Discussion in 'News & Current Events' started by Martin, Dec 8, 2009.

  1. Martin

    Martin Active Member

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    From CNN.com...

    "In the rare cases when the H1N1 virus kills, scientists have found, it penetrates deep into the lungs, creating widespread damage -- a pattern similar to what killed millions during previous flu pandemics in 1918 and 1957. The New York Office of Chief Medical Examiner examined medical records, autopsy reports and microscopic slides of 34 people with H1N1 who died between May 15 and July 9, 2009, during the early days of the pandemic. The report found that among those deaths, inflammation and damage in the lungs extended all the way to the alveoli, tiny sacs at the farthest end of the lungs' airways. "Generally, flu stays in the upper airways," said Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases. "What this shows is clearly this virus has capability of infecting and causing inflammation and destruction of cells from the trachea, all the way down into smaller cells of the lungs." (MORE)
     
  2. Victorious

    Victorious Member

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    I believe evidence shows that the vaccine is more dangerous than the phoney "pandemic."
     
  3. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    You believe wrong. The claims of the H1N1a vaccine being "dangerous" have come up empty.

    The H1N1a flu is serious stuff, when it kills. But it doesn't kill at any more of a rate than the common seasonal flu. It's a new form of influenza, and therefore worthy of attention. It's not, however, worthy of the hype that it has been given in the media. Its vaccine is likewise not worthy of the hype that antivax wingnuts have give it.
     
  4. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member

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    What evidence is this? I am concerned about vaccines but have seen no conclusive evidence for the harmfulness or safety of them?
     
  5. Martin

    Martin Active Member

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    I disagree most strongly. There are clear numbers showing the deadly nature of the H1N1 flu (and seasonal strains). I have not seen, or heard, of large numbers of people getting ill or dying from the vaccine. Btw, I got the H1N1 and seasonal vaccines and I am just fine (as are the other people I know). Sure that is somewhat anecdotal but my point is that the vaccine is not dangerous for most people. Having said that, in a perfect world such vaccines would not be needed. I'm sure there are side-effects of these vaccines that we don't know or understand. I know that is true with the vaccines they give our pets.
     
  6. Martin

    Martin Active Member

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    Even more evidence of H1N1's danger (HERE).
     
  7. Magnetic Poles

    Magnetic Poles New Member

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    As I fly very frequently with plane loads of people hacking and coughing into our shared air, I always get the seasonal flu shot. I also got the H1N1 vaccine as soon as it was widely available.
     
  8. Bob Alkire

    Bob Alkire New Member

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    A little off subject. I know little to nothing about flu shots. I have never had a flu shot and never had the flu, I have had colds. My parents of my knowledge never had a flu shot or the flue. None of my children while at home had the flu shot and only one time did one have what the doctor said was the flu.

    My wife's family is about like mine, no flu shots, no flu.

    I have friends who didn't get the shot and some got the flu, some didn't and friends who got the shot and some got flu like deals and some didn't.

    I try and not take any medicine or pain killers, like at the dentist. I did take both when they put my fingers back together though. I know I could be called a little crazy about this, but I had a doctor when I was a child that said medicine taken for one thing, will do well but it also can do not so well on other things. I don't know if my family went with this because they couldn't afford it or because they believed it, and same question about my grandparents. I bought into it 100%.
     
  9. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member

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    People tend to over medicate themselves, sometimes you just have to let things run their course. The H1N1 has not been what it was hyped to be.
     
  10. Crabtownboy

    Crabtownboy Well-Known Member

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    Aren't you thankful it is a milder flu than first feared?
     
  11. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    Me too. I'm a business traveller. I always get the seasonal flu shot, if for no other reason, for the courtesy of those with whom I travel. This years, I got both the seasonal and the H1N1a vaccine. I believe it would be irresponsible and disrespectful to the wothers with whom I come into contact if I didn't get vaccinated.
     
  12. targus

    targus New Member

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    Devil's advocate here...

    Why is it irresponsible and disrespectful - the only others who would be effected would be those who didn't get the vaccine themselves.

    Wouldn't it just be their own fault then?
     
  13. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    An influenza vaccine contains a sterilized version of the flu virus. It doesn't reproduce, but your body immediately begins producing an immunity to it. It's highly effective.
    It's possible you've gotten the flu, but might have thought it was a cold. The symptoms are very similar.
    You never get pain killers while at the dentist? You're a better man than I. I'm a dental wimp, and I see my dentist every six months, cringing every time I do.
    That's potentially true. Medications are taken for a very specific reason. If you take a medication for a reason not prescribed, they could be potentially dangerous.
     
  14. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member

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    And reason defeats the ridiculous every time.:laugh:
     
  15. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    Thats a good question.

    Because if I contract it, I stand the chance of transmitting it to potentially hundreds of people in any given month. That can be avoided by me simply getting vaccinated. I'm simply being polite and courteous to others.
    There's a difference between a casual traveller and a frequent traveller. I don't expect a casual flyer (for example, a family travelling on vacation once every year or two, or a college kid flying home for break) to innoculate themselves, because being in a travel situation for them isn't common. For me, however, I'm constantly in that situation, so I consider myself to be of a higher responsibility than they.

    That's just me. I don't expect others to hold to my same standards, and don't judge another based on their own personal travel decisions to vacciante or not vaccinate.
     
  16. Bob Alkire

    Bob Alkire New Member

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    I thank you for your reply. You took what I said literally, which is my fault. I know the definition well. I don't know how good it is suppose to be, how much help it is and the negative side of them. I know each year a lot of the men where I work who don't make it to work, had the shot, but it only seem to bother them a day or so. Or they might be going hunting, who knows?

    My wife said that I must have had them when I went over seas in the service. They gave us shot on top of shot on top of shot. Many of us got very sick.
     
  17. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    I did take you literally. Sorry about that. There have now been literally millions of H1N1 vaccines administered, and they've been shown to be quite effective (those vaccinated with H1N1a vaccine generally aren't getting the H1N1a virus). Supposed dangers have not materialized. Fortunately, the spread of the flu (both H1N1a and common seasonal flu) in the unvaccinated population has been relatively mild to date.

    I'm not sure what you would have received in the service. Perhaps someone else who served can answer that.

    As for claiming to not feel well after getting a shot, in order to kick off for the weekend early, I can't tell you how many times I've done it myself :wavey:.
     
  18. Winman

    Winman Active Member

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    That's ridiculous.

    Because the person who got the vaccination didn't get the flu proves the shot prevented it? I have never had a flu shot and I have not had the flu in over 20 years.

    The fact that a person who got the vaccination did not come down with the flu proves nothing whatsoever, unless that's what you WANT to believe.
     
  19. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    I think you might have a misunderstanding of how the statistical study group vs control group works. What happens is you look at the rates in the general population, and then compare it to your control group. For example, if in the general population, the contraction rate of a particular virus is, say 1 in 20, but in the your control group of vaccinated individuals, the contraction rate is one in every 500, then it's an indicator of efficacy of that vaccine.

    I'm not sure why you say that's ridiculous.
     
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