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Featured Harambe the Gorilla: A Serious Theological Lesson

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by Protestant, Jun 5, 2016.

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  1. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Has any of the acolytes answered the question? Nope.
    But has any of them answered the question, does God transfer an individual into Christ based on crediting their faith as righteousness. Romans 4.

    Have various change of subject efforts been posted? Yes

    They cannot defend their skewed view of scripture.

    No productive discussion is possible with those who ask questions endlessly, but cannot make a clear statement in answer to a simple question.
     
    #101 Van, Jun 8, 2016
  2. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Here is a typical claim: "..you have seen Van offer Mt 23 over and over, when it has been shown to be error" but no place is referenced or quoted where it was shown that Jesus did not teach men were entering the kingdom of heaven until blocked by false teachers. This verse Matthew 23:13 demonstrates both Total Spiritual Inability and Irresistible Grace are mistaken doctrines.
     
    #102 Van, Jun 8, 2016
  3. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    at least I like your emoticons...lol
     
    #103 Iconoclast, Jun 8, 2016
  4. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    your heretical statements that would reduce God to a respector of persons have been answered over and over....God does not "transfer "individuals based on anything they do.
     
    #104 Iconoclast, Jun 8, 2016
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  5. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    I am not seeing anyone elevate themselves in the place of God. there are people posting here who have the text explained to them in greek and english who flat out reject it because they are unable to welcome it.
     
    #105 Iconoclast, Jun 8, 2016
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  6. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Here is a typical response. No scripture, just the disparagement (heretical statements) and the denial of scripture, But it is an answer to the question, and demonstrates why all the other acolytes have continued to refuse to answer it.

    2 Thessalonians 2:13 teaches individuals are chosen for salvation by being set apart in Christ through faith in the truth. God transfers them from the realm of darkness into the kingdom of His Son, Colossians 1:13.
     
    #106 Van, Jun 8, 2016
  7. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
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    Still waiting for Van.
     
    #107 TCassidy, Jun 8, 2016
  8. SovereignGrace

    SovereignGrace Well-Known Member
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    *****Jeopardy music*****
     
    #108 SovereignGrace, Jun 9, 2016
  9. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I agree there are people who will and have rejected these explanations. Some may indeed have simply rejected scripture in the process while others may have merely disagreed with your explanation. I don't think it is fair to determine all instances where someone disagrees with us is a rejection of scrioture.

    And there are people like this on either side of the isle. We have seen the claim that Calvinism is a denial of scripture by others. These claimed (regardless of camp) are simply wrong.
     
    #109 JonC, Jun 9, 2016
  10. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    "JonC

    ok....

    you have repeated this charge and yet when I ask you for a few examples of this very thing you have not produced one.
     
    #110 Iconoclast, Jun 9, 2016
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  11. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    That, brother, is untrue, however you may not have been involved in those threads. One example was the claim that a denial of Jesus being estranged from God's presence was a denial of scripture. Many Calvinists were quoted (Gill, Owen, Packer, against-Spurgeon and Sproul for). Only a minority believed the disagreement amounted to a denial of scripture.

    Another example is foreknoowledge. Some have insisted the Calvinistic understanding denied scripture that describes God acting in response to man.

    In discussing the atonement, some have charged those who hold my view as denying John 3:16 as I believe Christ came to redeem only the elect. Others have accused those men of denying Scripture that states Jesus died for His sheep.

    There are four examples. I am actually surprised these are new to you, but at least we can lay aside they do not exist. Scripture does not bow to our interpretations. Calvinism is much larger than many would have it defined.
     
    #111 JonC, Jun 9, 2016
  12. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    I did not ask you what "some say"......YOU SAID THREE TIMES THAT......I DID IT.........IT IS CLEAR I DID NO SUCH THING.
    That which is already defined in theology stands before you or I was on the scene....it is you who depart from confessional standards..
    Not me
     
    #112 Iconoclast, Jun 9, 2016
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  13. tyndale1946

    tyndale1946 Well-Known Member
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    I just want to make an observation... In my over 14 years off and on this board I have never seen a Non-Cal turn into a Cal or a Cal revert back to a Non-Cal... I know that all Cals were at one time Non-Cals... I know at one time I was and there is not one Cal on here that was born one... What separates the two is their perspective of God... Brother Glen
     
    #113 tyndale1946, Jun 9, 2016
  14. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I never said that you did, Icon. I am not sure exactly this departure from orthodoxy you are accusing me of. Where do you believe I have departed from "confessional standards"?
     
    #114 JonC, Jun 9, 2016
  15. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    Skandelon was a Calvinist and became non-Cal.

    I just praise the Lord that he predestined me to be a non-Cal!
     
    #115 InTheLight, Jun 9, 2016
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  16. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I have known Calvinists who became persuaded Calvinism was error.

    I believe it to be correct insofar as we typically define Calvinism (the 5 points) But far too many seem to stand more on what they reject them what they affirm.
     
    #116 JonC, Jun 9, 2016
  17. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Again, Icon, where does my belief depart from "confessional standards"?

    (I am calling on you to back up your statement).
     
    #117 JonC, Jun 9, 2016
  18. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
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    I had a friend who was a staunch Particular, Reformed, Baptist.

    He later stopped believing in Particular Redemption and became a General Baptist, Free Will Baptist, believing in a General Atonement.

    Later still he stopped being a Baptist altogether and joined an Episcopalian church.

    And even later still he told everybody he was now an atheist and that God does not exist.

    And last, but certainly not least, he blew his brains out with a shotgun.

    Changing or not changing your mind is not definitive of anything except your own confusion. :(
     
    #118 TCassidy, Jun 9, 2016
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  19. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    Before you call on me to do anything.......3x you said I equated my opinion and those who disagreed with it......with rejecting scripture......I asked you to show it.......you cannot because I never did it so do not twist it .....reread our exchanges in order and unless I am totally misreading it....that is what happened.

    You posit yourself as describing real Calvinism, and I said to you that I have not departed from the confessional standards, meaning on the 5 pts I fully subscribe to them.....you have posted that you are Calvinistic.....meaning you agree in part but not totally...... I agree totally.
    You are now saying you agree in total with the accepted confessions? ???
     
    #119 Iconoclast, Jun 9, 2016
  20. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    Skan was never a Cal.....he was among them but never grasped it.....we know because we questioned him on it.
    A Cal could post Cal answers ....he could not. He further was exposed when he failed to show up at the Romans 9 debate with any exegesis at all.
    There are many who have gone from partial to full Cal on here.
    I never was afflicted with those false ideas...

    Learned of them after God had already gotten a hold of me.
     
    #120 Iconoclast, Jun 9, 2016
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