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Have you heard? The VOICE

Discussion in 'Bible Versions & Translations' started by franklinmonroe, Oct 23, 2008.

  1. Marcia

    Marcia Active Member

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    Interesting that "The Voice" portrays Jesus as the "Liberator." This sounds a lot like Liberation Theology, a theology some of the emergents seem in sync with.
     
  2. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    Good questions, Marcia. I happened to notice that in Rob Lacey's The Word on the Street (2004, Zondervan) Jesus is also referred to as "the Voice" {my emphasis} --
    Nothing. No light, no time, no substance, no matter - the Voice was there. Before anything moved, mutated or mated, Jesus, God's Voice. was there with God from the kick-off. How come? 'Cos Jesus, "God's Voice", is God. Before anythng began, they had always been. Before there was even anywhere to be, they were there.

    Jesus got the name "God's Voice" because he just spoke and stuff started. From nothing to everything, sparked only by the Voice... ('4D Biography' Intro, a harmony of the Gospels, page 261)​

    The Gospels section in the The Word on the Street is also titled "The Liberator"; and the book of Acts section is titled "The Jesus Liberation Movement". Notice John 1:15-18 (page 262) --
    Like the Baptizer says, "Yeah, I hit the headlines first, but he's the one you should get excited about. He was around well before me" And because he was so stuffed full of good stuff, we benefited - big time. OK, Moses gaves the Contract, but Jesus the Liberator gave us God's gifts and God's truth - loads better. Who has seen God? No one. But we've seen his only Son, Jesus, and you don't get closer than that.​

    I wonder, will we find other parallels between these 'versions'?
     
    #22 franklinmonroe, Nov 5, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 5, 2008
  3. Marcia

    Marcia Active Member

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    Very, very interesting! It almost seems like The Voice took a page from The Word on the Street.

    It also seems to me that they are confusing God's words and voice with Jesus. Jesus is not a word like a word God speaks, nor is he a voice. Jesus is the Logos, which is not the same thing as just a spoken word. This makes Jesus sound like either some kind of created being or some abstract spirit or energy.

    I find it bizarre.
     
  4. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    Would anyone like to see a particular verse from The Voice?
     
  5. Amy.G

    Amy.G New Member

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    Yes. How about John 3:16?

    And Colossians 1:16-20?

    Thanks. :)
     
  6. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    16 For God expressed His love for the world in this way: He gave His only Son so that whoever believes in Him will not face everlasting destruction, but will have evrlasting life. ​
    The Voice has Jesus' words beginning in John Chapter 3 at vesre 5 and continuing to verse 21.


    16 It was by Him that everything was created: the heavens, the earth, all things within and upon them, all things seen and unseen, thrones and dominions, spiritual powers and authorities. Every detail was crafted through His design, by His own hands, and for His purposes. 17 He has always been! It is His hand that holds everything together. 18 He is the head of this body, the church. He is the beginning, the first of those to be reborn from the dead, so that in every aspect, at every view, in everything - He is first. 19 God was pleased that all His fullness should forever dwell in the Son, 20 who, as predetermined by God, bled peace into the world by His death on the cross as God's means of reconciling the whole creation to Himself - all things in heaven and all things on earth.​
     
    #26 franklinmonroe, Nov 9, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 9, 2008
  7. Keith M

    Keith M New Member

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    The Voice...The Message...they can both stay on bookstore shelves gathering dust as far as I'm concerned. I'll stick with the tested and proven NKJV, the NASB and the KJVs. I prefer real Bibles.
     
  8. Mexdeaf

    Mexdeaf New Member

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    Keith M, I'm with you.

    Laurie has written some interesting stuff. I rarely agree with what he has to say but he does challenge you to think through your theology.
     
  9. Amy.G

    Amy.G New Member

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    Amen to that. The thing that really bothers me about it is where will the church be in 50 years if these "translations" catch on and start being used from the pulpit and in bible study classes? Will the generation 50 years from now even know what solid doctrine is?
     
  10. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    Please do not misunderstand: I am not endorsing The Voice. But what specifically do you disagree with?

    Lacking the presentation of objective reasons, these kinds of comments just smack of the inflexibility and intolerance of Onlyist rhetoric. If we are going to defend the multitude of sound & genuine translations then we are obligated to substantiate why some other versions should not be considered 'real' Bibles (it is not as self-evident to the rest of the world as it may be to us).
     
  11. Mexdeaf

    Mexdeaf New Member

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    Good and fair question- to me a real Bible would have to be a translation from original languages rather than a paraphrase. That would be the number one requirement.

    Hey this would be a great thread by itself, franklinmonroe- you want the honors?
     
  12. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    Is this a paraphrase? Many seem to think of it as a work of translation.

    Some selected statements from their Preface (my underline below) --
    ... Most English translations attempt to even out the styles of the different authors in sentence structure and vocabulary. Instead, The Voice distinguishes the uniqueness of each author. The heart of the project is retelling the story of the Bible in a form as fluid as modern literary works yet remaining true to the original manuscripts. First, accomplished writers create an English rendering; then, respected Bible scholars adjust the rendering to align the manuscript with the original texts. Attention is paid to the use of idioms, artistic elements, confusion of pronouns, repetition of conjunctives, modern sentence structure, and the public reading of the passage. In the process, the writer or scholar may adjust the arrangement of words or expand the phrasing to create an English equivalent...

    ... Throughout The Voice, other language devices improve readability. We follow the standard conventions used in most translations regarding textual evidence. The Voice is based on the earliest and best manuscripts from the original languages (Greek, Hebrew, and Aramaic). When significant variations influence a reading, we follow the publishing standard by bracketing the passage and placing a note at the bottom of the page while maintaining the traditional chapter and verse divisions. The footnotes reference quoted material and help the reader understand the translation for a particular word. Words that are borrowed from another language or words that are not common outside of the theological community (such as “baptism,” “repentance,” and “salvation”) are translated into more common terminology. For clarity, some pronouns are replaced with their antecedents. Word order and parts of speech are sometimes altered to help the reader understand the original passage.​

    Some claims made on the official website --
    The Voice is a dynamic translation that brings the biblical narrative to life...

    The Voice partners writers with biblical scholars to create a new and unique translation. Review this chart to read how it compares with other popular translations...

    ... Scholar David Capes, author Chris Seay, and publisher Frank Couch were interviewed by the Houston Chronicle to discuss the unique process of translating The Voice.​

    From Wayne Hasting's blog (he is the Senior VP and Group Publisher of the Bible Division for Thomas Nelson) --
    For the last three years Ecclesia Bible Society and our folks at Thomas Nelson been working hard together as a team on a new Bible translation called The Voice...

    ... One of the primary distinctives of The Voice is how it was created. Rather than being driven from scholars, The Voice was driven by artists, and then vetted by a world-class team of scholars. The Voice gives us a different reading experience and stays completely accurate to the original manuscripts. The artists (writers, singers, and poets like Brian McLaren, Chris Seay, Leonard Sweet, Lauren Winner) help us discover the true voice of the human author of that particular section of Scripture.​

    In the media and other places --
    "We're not only trying to think outside the box; we are not starting within one", says the team behind a new Scripture translation project for the postmodern culture. (source: The Christian Post Feb. 1, 2007)

    ... To that end Capes, a professor of Greek and New Testament at Houston Baptist University, together with Chris Seay, pastor of the nondenominational Ecclesia Church in Houston, put together a team of more than 80 writers, scholars, poets and songwriters to collaborate on a new translation of the Bible. They've titled it The Voice (source: Houston Chronicle Cot. 24, 2008)

    ... This is the first-ever complete New Testament in The Voice translation. (source: Thomas Nelson consumer product detail)​

    If a version is not the work of genuine translation, how do we prove it?
     
    #32 franklinmonroe, Nov 10, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 10, 2008
  13. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    1:11 εἰς τὰ ἴδια ἦλθεν καὶ οἱ ἴδιοι αὐτὸν οὐ παρέλαβον​
    The final word in the Greek verse (no variants between TR and CT text) is a form of paralambano (Strong's #3880) which has the following lexical meanings --
    1) to take to, to take with one's self, to join to one's self
    __a) an associate, a companion
    __b) metaph.
    _____1) to accept or acknowledge one to be such as he professes to be
    _____2) not to reject, not to withhold obedience

    2) to receive something transmitted
    __a) an office to be discharged
    __b) to receive with the mind
    _____1) by oral transmission: of the authors from whom the tradition proceeds
    _____2) by the narrating to others, by instruction of teachers (used of disciples)​

    I wouldn't say that I know Greek well at all, but perhaps it would be possible to construe 'to receive with the mind' as an "inner calling" (where the KJV simply has "received").
     
    #33 franklinmonroe, Nov 10, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 10, 2008
  14. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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  15. sag38

    sag38 Active Member

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    Thanks for giving us the link. And, it's baloney. He's an expert at twisting the scripture.
     
  16. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    I suggest the members of the BB gather to form our own translation. We can call it "Word Up". :)
     
  17. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe Active Member

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    Wow! I posted the link at 4:38 and you replied at 4:44. How did you read it that quickly? His article is about 13 pages of actual text.
     
  18. sag38

    sag38 Active Member

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    I read about the first six pages and that was enough. There was no need to read any further.
     
  19. annsni

    annsni Well-Known Member
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    DH and I went to Barnes and Noble the other night and looked at this. It nauseated me. I'd NEVER use this and can't see how it can be called a Bible.
     
  20. Mexdeaf

    Mexdeaf New Member

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    It seems to me from the above selected quotes (which I snipped from your previous post) that it is clear that the focus of THE VOICE was interpretation rather than translation- much like the NWT or any other ''Bible" with an 'agenda'.

    Plus they started without a 'box' and forgot who the Author of the Scriptures is. At least they are honest enough to admit it.
     
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