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Featured I Am Nothing, Christ Is All

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by KenH, May 22, 2024.

  1. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    "But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ."—2 Corinthians 11:3.

    And what is "the simplicity that is in Christ?" The apostle answers this question in another part of his writings, when he saith, "Christ is all, and in all." Now nothing can be more simple than this: "Christ is all;" then it would be equal folly to seek for happiness in any thing but in Christ. And "Christ is in all;" then it would be equal folly to seek for happiness in any thing but in Christ. So that if our minds are led away to seek a supply from any thing short of Christ, this is the same temptation that the devil played off upon our first parent, and succeeded. This indeed is the grand device of Satan: it is the master-piece of his subtilty. This is what all carnal unawakened men fall into: to fancy somewhat that is left for us to do, to qualify ourselves to be made partakers of grace, and to improve the talent which is given to us. And as these things are very flattering to the pride of our nature, and exactly correspond to the state the devil left our first parents in, when he had ruined them, so it becomes the very method which he still pursues with all their poor children, to lull them on to ruin. "Ye shall be as gods (said the devil to our first mother) knowing good and evil;" and, in like manner, thus flattering the pride of our nature, and shutting out Christ, with his blood and righteousness, does he deceive men now. Now Paul was alarmed and distressed on this account. The serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, saith Paul, and I fear lest he should beguile you.—How blessed, then, is the teaching of the Holy Ghost, which strips the sinner, makes him all bare, leaves him nothing, but shews him his whole insolvency, emptiness, and poverty, that he may make room for Jesus! And when he hath thus made the sinner sensible of his nothingness, he makes him equally sensible of Christ's fulness and all sufficiency; and that in bringing nothing to Christ, but living wholly upon Christ, and drawing all from Christ; in this simplicity that is in Christ, he teacheth the poor sinner how to live and how to keep house by faith, wholly upon the fulness that is in Christ Jesus. This is the sweet instruction taught in the school of Jesus. "I fear, (saith Paul) lest the serpent that beguiled Eve, should have corrupted you by his subtilty from this simplicity that is in Christ."

    - Robert Hawker, The Poor Man's Morning and Evening Portions, May 18, Evening
     
    #1 KenH, May 22, 2024
    Last edited: May 22, 2024
  2. JPPT1974

    JPPT1974 Active Member
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    Indeed we are nothing in our own. But Christ Jesus, is in all! As He never leaves nor forsakes us.
     
  3. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    God uses means to carry out what He has decreed and ordained. God is not bound by time. In this present universe, all of God's creation is bound by time. God is omniscient, omnipresent and omnipotent. Human beings, despite their railing against these attributes of God and their self-pride and self-glorying, have limited knowledge, are bound to one location at a time, and have limited power.
     
  4. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    That is what the Bible teaches. I love the fact that God is ultimately in control of ALL things(in spite of what it may look like to fallen mankind) and man is ultimately in control of NOTHING(in spite of what it may look like to fallen mankind).
     
  5. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    I have no qualms with being a "puppet on strings" of my Creator. Everything that God does, He does for His glory. If my "burning" brings to glory to God, then so shall it be.
     
  6. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    Isaiah 29:16 Shall the work say of him that made it, He made me not? or shall the thing framed say of him that framed it, He had no understanding?

    Romans 9:19-21 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will? Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
     
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  7. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    The context is that of individuals; but even nations are composed of...individuals. Thus, your effort to counter the teaching of God's Word fails, regardless.
     
  8. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    The gifts of faith and repentance are granted by God after He regenerates His elect, as HE MAKES THEM WILLING BY HIS POWER, not their own. Away with all human self-pride and self-glorying!

    Psalms 110:3 Thy people shall be willing in the day of thy power, In the beauties of holiness from the womb of the morning: Thou hast the dew of thy youth.
     
  9. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    William Gadsby spoke well and accurately about free-willers in a sermon many years ago in 1843:

    "There is such a solemn disparity between God and ourselves that the soul is brought to wonder how God can be righteous without sending it to hell! This is the difference between the poor child of God, and a self-righteous free-willer. A self-righteous free-willer thinks that God cannot be just without giving him a chance of being saved; and the poor child of God wants to know how he can be just without damning him!"
     
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  10. CJP69

    CJP69 Active Member

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    Irrational and frankly pathetic stupidity!

    No "free-willer" that can think has ever once said or even implied "that God cannot be just without giving him a chance of being saved"! This is a stupidly foolish nonsensical and idiotic thing to say that not one single human being with any working brain cells in his head has ever said.

    Show me the quote!!

    Go ahead! Show it to me. Show me even one single time when anyone who believes in free will has ever said such a mouthful of stupidity!

    You won't do it because such a quote does not exist.

    This jackass who said this was a liar. That's right! He's a liar. He KNEW when he said this that no such teaching existed and his intent was to plant this falsehood in the mind's of his readers because it is an easy straw-man to knock down. Mr, Gadsby should be ashamed of himself and you ought to be embarrassed by his dishonest tactics. Instead, you applaud and propagate this nonsense because you enjoy how the lie tickles your ears.

    The fact is that God could have just as easily (far more easily actually) killed both Adam and Eve when they sinned in Eden. He was not required to provide any means of rescue for mankind but chose to do so because He loves His creation and desires greatly to have a relationship with us and so finds the cost of sacrificing the life of His only begotten Son a worthy price to pay for the benefit of having a never ending relationship with those who choose to respond to Him in faith and accept His free gift of salvation. No one forced Him to do it and there was no moral obligation for Him to do it. He was able to do it and decided that the benefit was worth the price and so decided He wanted to do it and He did so. A thought process that Calvinists don't even believe God capable of, by the way.

    God is just, therefore Calvinism is false!
     
    #5 CJP69, May 28, 2024
    Last edited: May 28, 2024
  11. JD731

    JD731 Well-Known Member

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    Just musing but it seems to me that if anyone was chosen before the foundation of the earth it would be Adam. After God created him he said it was very good.

    Gen 2:31 And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day. Even the tempter in the garden was created perfect and was good before his fall.

    Eze 28:13 Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day (which was the fourth day) that thou wast created.
    14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
    15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.

    How does this work in Calvinism? It seems that sin is ordained of God and is good or there is free will all over the place.
     
    #6 JD731, May 28, 2024
    Last edited: May 28, 2024
  12. CJP69

    CJP69 Active Member

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    Excellent point!

    The Calvinist response to this is intentionally and flagrantly, even proudly self-contradictory. They simply declare that God predestined every action anyone has ever performed whether in thought, word or deed, but without subverting that person's will or becoming the author of sin.

    That's there entire "argument"! They declare that to be true and offer nothing by way of explanation of how it isn't contradictory. They simply declare that it isn't contradictory and leave it at that and count their willingness to believe it is spite of it apparent contradictory nature as a mark of faith and piety.
     
  13. Mikoo

    Mikoo Active Member

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    Did you eve notice that the self-righteous seem to think they know better than God?

    Things like, "Just musing but it seems to me that if anyone was chosen before the foundation of the earth it would be Adam. After God created him he said it was very good.'

    Or, "The fact is that God could have just as easily (far more easily actually) killed both Adam and Eve when they sinned in Eden. He was not required to provide any means of rescue for mankind but chose to do so because He loves His creation and desires greatly to have a relationship with us and so finds the cost of sacrificing the life of His only begotten Son a worthy price to pay for the benefit of having a never ending relationship with those who choose to respond to Him in faith and accept His free gift of salvation. No one forced Him to do it and there was no moral obligation for Him to do it. He was able to do it and decided that the benefit was worth the price and so decided He wanted to do it and He did so. A thought process that Calvinists don't even believe God capable of, by the way.'

    Just so many, "God could've, should've, would've' etc."

    They need our prayers.
     
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  14. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    That is passage is talking about the King of Tyre.
     
  15. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    There is no "free will" of man to subvert as the idea that man ever had "free will" is a fiction.

    Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
     
  16. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    I try to remember to pray daily for God's will to be done in the timing of the regeneration of His elect. I know from God's Word that ALL of His elect will be regenerated according to God's timing, even those, such as myself, who spend decades in false religion. Perhaps there are those who show their opposition to the gospel of Christ on this board, who may be among God's elect, and at some point in their lives He will graciously regenerate them.
     
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  17. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    You, yourself, wrote:

    You saying that it is "unjust" of God to choose a people for Himself, and you accuse God of being "unjust" in having done so.

    Regeneration(being born again, being born from above) is an action that God performs only for those whom He chose before the world began and gave to His Son to be their Surety, and to have their sin debt imputed to Him, and to pay their sin debt, and to have His perfect righteousness imputed to them.

    The natural man has no ability to respond the gospel of Christ, and the natural man certainly cannot regenerate himself, nor contribute anything to bring about regeneration, nor cause regeneration in any way, shape, or form.
     
  18. JD731

    JD731 Well-Known Member

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    That passage is talking about the real king of Tyre and God says who and what he is;
    You just can't believe what he says.

    Ez 28:14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
    15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.

    He was created on day 4 and iniquity was not found in him until Adam was placed by God in the Garden of Eden along with his wife. It seems as if he considered Adam a threat. (only by pride cometh contention)

    Mt 4:8 Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them;
    9 And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me.
    10 Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.


    Ez 28:16 By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.
    17 Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee.
    18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.
    19 All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee: thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more.

    Re 12:1 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:
    2 And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.
    3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.
    4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.
    5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.
    6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.
    7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
    8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
    9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
    10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.
    11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.
    12 ¶ Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.
    13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.
    14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.
    15 And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.
    16 And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.
    17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.
     
  19. Mikoo

    Mikoo Active Member

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    1. 'Lie'?, 'Neither of us'? So you do consider yourself part of the self-righteous crowd. Also, I never mentioned any names. I myself have heard some of the self-righteous crowd use 'Should've'. Soooo, you you are wrong there. You owe me an apology. But, I won't hold my breath waiting.

    2. I see your 'fruit' showing again. Your examples have nothing to do with what I wrote, God IS God. You, my friend, are not. My quotes I used previously stand uncorrected. Actually, kind of proves what I wrote.


     
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  20. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    2 Thessalonians 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie.
     
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