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Intelligent Design = evolution without a commitment to materialism

Discussion in 'Science' started by Gup20, Nov 3, 2005.

  1. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    The clear lesson of history is that the myths and fables of evolutionism only survive in the gray fog of uncertainty and speculation where science is not yet able to validate, certify, confirm, test, reproduce, measure facts and separate them from the bogus fiction of that “bad religion” we know as evolutionism.

    But once the data is actually collected and the “full light of day is shining” the result is to erode more and more of the vast territory of speculation staked out by evolutionism’s priesthood.

    David M. Raup, in Field Museum of Natural History Bulletin 50 (1979), p. 29.

    Now we start getting to the crux of the matter. Raup supports

    Gould sees the same thing in the discrediting of the horse series sequence published by Simpson.

     
  2. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    Just had to get this one by itself as I am sure there are "Stories waiting to be told" about it.

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
  3. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    The clear lesson of history is that the myths and fables of evolutionism only survive in the gray fog of uncertainty and speculation where science is not yet able to validate, certify, confirm, test, reproduce, measure facts and separate them from the bogus fiction of that “bad religion” we know as evolutionism.

    But once the data is actually collected and the “full light of day is shining” the result is to erode more and more of the vast territory of speculation staked out by evolutionism’s priesthood.


    David M. Raup, in Field Museum of Natural History Bulletin 50 (1979), p. 29.

     
  4. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    So when we find that the "Stories" were in the words of these atheist evolutionists "all wrong" and "never existed" and "had to be discarded" -- what "new stories" arise to take the place of the "old stories easy enough to tell"???

    Well in the pseudoscience of evolutionism there is "always" another story to be told!!

    And in the "bad religion" that we call evolutionism there is never a shortage of devotees waiting to fall on their swords over the next "new story" while diminishing the Word of God as "less trustworthy" then there system of "Failed story piled upon failed story".

    (That National Geographic article with Archaeoraptor comes to mind.)

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
  5. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    Poor Paul - he is still stuck on evolutionism's blunders in 1985! I was pointing to the blunders they were making in 1999 and 2000!

    With time constraints nipping at its heels, and peer-review rejections piling up, National Geographic decided to go out on a limb (again, no pun intended) and run the story on its own. Writing for Science News, Richard Monastersky observed:
    In an e-mail to his co-authors and to Sloan, Xu Xing wrote: “I am 100% sure, we have to admit that Archaeoraptor is a faked specimen” (as quoted in Simons, 2000, 198[4]:132)

    Proof of that fact was not long in coming. In the March 29, 2001 issue of Nature, Timothy Rowe and his colleagues published the results of their X-ray computed tomography studies on the Archaeoraptor fossil (2001, 410:539-540). Their study documented the fact that “the Archaeoraptor slab was built in three layers,” and concluded that Archaeoraptor
    </font>[/QUOTE]
     
  6. Paul of Eugene

    Paul of Eugene New Member

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    Hmmmm. is it my imagination or was there some post stuttering going on up there?

    Sorry, Bob, your finding somebody who was an evolutionist and once made a mistake is about as conclusive as looking over the baptist board and finding two sincere believers who disagree with each other about whether or not any version except the king james is ok to read in english.

    The fact that they disagree with this and do so with great vehemence does NOT PROVE that THERE IS NOTHING TO OUR RELIGION!

    It is the same with these things you've "alledgedly" posted.

    By the way, those "pouches" or "slits" in human embryos that so resemble the slits in fish embryos - what's wrong with noting how they have been conserved to no purpose over the eons?

    They certainly seem like a weird thing to see on the human embryo, and I've never heard anybody claim they were good for anything today - so why do you think you can just say Heackel was wrong about them, no argument?
     
  7. Paul of Eugene

    Paul of Eugene New Member

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    Here's a link to a summary of feather evolution:

    http://www.nurseminerva.co.uk/adapt/feathers.htm

    Note that scientists sometimes will say "probably" instead of "certainly".

    Some people will claim that shows weakness on the part of science.

    I claim it shows the strength of the honesty on the part of scientists who post in that manner.
     
  8. Paul of Eugene

    Paul of Eugene New Member

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    Just had to get this one by itself as I am sure there are "Stories waiting to be told" about it.

    In Christ,

    Bob
    </font>[/QUOTE]Hmmph. Just because the horse evolution scenario has been revised and improved Bob thinkgs that proves evolution false!

    Well, horses are indeed a splendid example of evolution, and here's a link to a summary of the current view of horse evolution:

    http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/horses/horse_evol.html

    But let me ask Bob Ryan this - don't horses still have those shin spints on their feet, that cannot be explained except at remnants of three toed ancestors?

    Doesn't the total extinction of three toed ancestors and their replacement by the single hooved current horses show that evolution in fact occurs?

    Doesn't the transformation of three toes into one great hoof count as macro evolution?
     
  9. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    Hmmph. What a "euphamism" we have in that quote -- "revised and IMPROVED" is the new way to admit/confess to "sequence NEVER HAPPENED" and "Positive embarrassment" - "LAMENTABLE story" - "ALL WRONG presentation".

    "Discarded" now means "revised and improved". (Or is it the other way around?)

    No amount of "story telling piled on to story telling" will cause the blunders to vanish as if "edited out of memory".

    Why do evolutionists find that concept to be so surprising?

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
  10. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    That was my point
     
  11. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    Yes it does.

    "Never happened".

    "smooth transitions" of features - like 3 toes going into 1 hoof -- never happened.

    "you can not tell that three-toed-A is in fact the ancestor of large-hoof-B".

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
  12. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    quote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Smooth intermediates between Baupläne [the German word meaning basic morphological designs or different types of creatures—BH/BT] are almost impossible to construct, even in thought experiments. There is certainly no evidence for them in the fossil record (curious mosaics like Archaeopteryx do not count)” [Gould and Eldredge, 1977, 3:147, parenthetical comment in orig.].
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Notice how your "thought experiment" is going when you spin the story about 3 toes turning into 1 large hoof on the same animal?
     
  13. Paul of Eugene

    Paul of Eugene New Member

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    Sure. Its documented how it happened, of course. The present horse has those itty bitty shin splints at the side which used to be full sized toes. There was an earlier fossil in the sequence with three toes that actually touched the ground. And there was an intermediate stage where the side toes didn't touch the ground and just flopped there, a couple of inches off the ground. Naturally, I had to take a picture of THAT fossil!

    [​IMG]

    Now the classic creationist comeback would be Hey you didn't fill a gap there, you created two more gaps!

    Go ahead, BR, lay it on me . . . .

    even though the whole world can see that for the bankrupt argument it is . . . .
     
  14. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    Wonderful - show that the modern horse ever had the toes please.

    Recall that "Stories easy enough to tell" are not the "proof" that is needed.

    You need to SHOW the ancestor IS IN FACT the real 3 toed ancestor -- giving birth to hooved offspring!! So that would BE BOTH available at the same time in the same herd - the SAME species apart from the 3 toe difference.

    "Continuous phyletic evolution" for that claim - not the gratiuitous assumptions ACROSS species AS IF they were in ancestor decendent relationships - merely strung together by "stories".

    In an article published several years ago in Paleobiology, Stephen Jay Gould of Harvard, and Niles Eldredge of the American Museum of Natural History, wrote concerning Archaeopteryx:
    Notice in the above quote - that what Colin Patterson calls “Stories easy enough to make up – but they are not science” is euphemistically called “thought experiments” by Gould and Eldredge!


    [/quote]
     
  15. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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  16. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    Today one may see the platypus as the intermediate between ducks and mamals and might "imagine" it floppying about with the ducks as ducks continued to give birth to platypus offspring -- IF ONLY they were extinct!

    But we SEE TODAY that NOTHING OF THE KIND is happening!

    They are distinct orders and do not give rise to EACH OTHER!

    BUT IF the duckbill had gone extinct then surely we could hoist that skeleton before the masses today and say "look at what the beaver USED to look like" before natural selection DROVE out the duckbill and forced in the more advanced beaver to replace it!!

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
  17. Paul of Eugene

    Paul of Eugene New Member

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    The shin splints on modern horses are enought to show they had real three toed ancestors, BR! The fossil record also shows it.

    I'm so sorry for your theology that all those fossils are there contrary to your theology.
     
  18. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    Finding "other animals" that also have a hoof and even longer shin splints is nice. Do you have "a story easy enough to tell" to go with it? Something that SHOWS that the modern horse descended from a true 3 toed "No-hoof" animal?

    Platypus anyone?

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
  19. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    Notice in the above quote - that what Colin Patterson calls “Stories easy enough to make up – but they are not science” is euphemistically called “thought experiments” by Gould and Eldredge!


    </font>[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]

    Oops! Did I already post that??!
     
  20. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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