Katrina - Random Act or Wrath of God?

Did Jesus Christ fulfill the law or didn't He?

 

For His First Coming, yes.

HankD

 

Really, have a link. Please make it a credible link, not from Jack Van Impe Ministries. Also show me the evidence that this DNA testing can determine which tribe they are from.

Where does scripture say medical and scientific knowledge increases? Doesn’t say that in Daniel.

Once again LE which OT passages apply and which don’t? Are you the one who gets to decide? I asked you about Deu 22:5:

The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God.

You didn't want to have anything to do with this vers, why? Are you not consistent in applying OT verses to today? Why does this not apply but Gen. 12:3 still does?


How about this one:

Amo 5:2 The virgin of Israel is fallen; she shall no more rise: she is forsaken upon her land; there is none to raise her up.

Does this still apply?

Why must you play word games? We all know, when speaking on eschatology, what dispensationalist means. I guess I could play the same game. Any one who believes Matt 24:2 speaks of the events of AD70 is now a preterist. How’s that?

Join the crowd. I have asked you several times to answer “when did the end-times begin”, but you have yet to answer. I can only assume you have no scriptural basis for saying so, it’s just your opinion or it’s what others tell you and you just accept it.

Disgusting is saying you know more than an inspired writer. We showed you what Peter said on the day of Pentecost but since it doesn’t fit your eschatological framework you pull a “Clinton” on us and say it depends on what “this” means.

So you tell us, what does Peter mean by “this is”?

Acts 2:16-24
16. But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel

So if it’s between trusting you or trusting Peter, I’ll stick with the one who is inspired. It is sad when someone argues from a framework yet when it gets down to specifics and using scripture, there seems to be silence.

 

Really, I've said my piece as it pertains to the OP.

If you want to discuss other issues about the tribes, OT Laws, dress codes, end times, etc., feel free to start other threads. No doubt the Moderators of this forum would be all for it, so as not to further derail the OP.

LE

 

Then who are these Jews to whom Paul speaks, religious or physical?

Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

Who is the “all Israel”? Anyone who happened to convert to Judaism in the last 2000 years or happened to be born to a Jewish mother? This is the problem. It seems for this to fit the dipsie view, the “ Jewish race” must have to have continued on since the times of Paul. There seems to be no other option since dispies also believe “generation” refers to race:

Mat 24:34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

Yes, if He desires. But what evidence is there that He desires this?

Not if Old Covenant Israel was a type and shadow of the New Covenant Israel.

What did Jesus mean by this:

Joh 1:47 Jesus saw Nathanael coming to him, and saith of him, Behold an Israelite indeed, in whom is no guile!

Was Jesus recognizing his ethnicity, or something more? It sems Jesus is saying he was more than a physical Jew but also a spiritual Jew.

Why, what prophecy does this fulfill?

It is either fulfilled or not fulfilled. If it is not fulfilled, then none of the Law has passed. If it has been fulfilled then the Law has passed and so has "heaven and earth".It stays or goes as a whole.

 

Katrina is just one of millions of hurricanes that have come ashore during the past several hundred million years. Unfortunately, New Orleans is below sea level. This is not the judgment of God—it is the judgment of common sense!

</font>[/QUOTE]I'm on Craigbythesea's side(no pun intended)---except for one thing----Craigbythesea seems to be "off" in his calculations of the earth's age----the correct # of years should be more along the area of several "thousands" of years and not hundreds of millions---that "Cave Man" calculation of the Earth's age is a and a half!!!!

The vast majority of Hurricanes in the Northern Hemisphere begin as simple little thunderstorms off the western coast of Africa----they begin fueling themselves on the warm water of the Atlantic and the moisture of the atmosphere---they get caught up in the Hemisphere's "Trade Winds" and Jet Streams---etc. etc. until they belch themselves ashore in our front doors and mess up our houses and cause intense stress for insurance adjustors!!

Hurricanes have been belching ashore long before "White Man" even thought about New Orleans----much less a "Party Barge" Casino on Mississippi's Gulf Coast!!! The only thing here to judge before then was lots and lots of Pine and Oak trees---and why would God "aim" the wind at them and not send the wind on up the coast a few hundred miles to the DC area?????


Blackbird

[ September 07, 2005, 10:25 PM: Message edited by: blackbird ]

 

I totally agree Bro. David!

Good to have the back safe and sound!

 

OR, your long post did not respond to my point, which was that there is no "dispensationalist doctrine" that says the pre-trib rapture will occur when the EU reached 10 members. You are saying this as though all dispensationalists believe this and you are wrong.

 

This thread has gotten

 

Chasin' "sophiscated" Rabbits again---don't that just burn Blackbird up???? When the sophistacation is way over his head????

 

Grasshopper the moderator has complained that this thread has gotten off topic RE: Katrina and the direct or permissive will of God.

I can answer all of your questions if you wish.

A new thread can be started concerning our discussion as to who is a Jew and how is that determination made.

My answer to the inquiry of this thread was and still is that Katrina is simply the out working of the law of sin and death started by our father Adam.

There are particular judgments yet to be fullfilled.

1 Corinthians 51
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

While sin and death still reign over the human race "all" has not been fullfilled. That awaits His Second Coming.

Resurrected beings without a sin-nature have no need of "The Law" which is and always will be "the knowledge of sin".

HankD

 

James Newman & Askjo, you might be interested in THIS THREAD

 

We cannot look at the affairs of mankind without looking also at the providence of God. God is still on the throne. Nothing in this world happens without his knowledge and permission. God has a purpose in everything that he allows even though we may not see or realize it at the time. Some have seen the hand of God's judgement on America in this catastrophe, which very well may be. I would not doubt that. When judgement came upon Israel in the OT, so did repentance. Look at the repetitive cycle in the Book of Judges that ended up in judgement and repentance.

Having said that I would like to ask how many have heard what good they have seen come out of Katrina, specifically spiritual good in a positive sense. I am not speaking simply of destruction of casinos. I mean of people who have turned to God as a result this catastrophe. Can you share of any good spiritual consequences of this catastrophe?
DHK

 

DHK

Your post regarding the Sovereignty of God reminds me of some remarks by a Canadian theologian after the initial election of Bill Clinton. Many Christians in this country were very upset and stayed that way for 8 years [including myself]. This gentleman, I can't recall his name, remarked [in an anthropomorphic fashion]: "God has no sweat on His brow".

I think the same remark could be made about the hurricane Katrina.

 

http://www.jerusalemnewswire.com/library/article.php?articleid=676

http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=46178

Another "coincidence," Rita, is now a category 5 and gaining strength.

 

It's hurricane season. Between Katrina and Rita, there was Lee, Maria, Nate, Ophelia, and Philippe. There are anywhere from 10-20 tropical storms (including hurricanes) per year, and most of them are during the late summer months. That's the way God made it.

 

That's the way the world is now, John, but that doesn't mean that God has lost count of the number of hairs on a head or which sparrow falls. He is still in control.

These hurricanes will be judgment for some. For others, they will bring some kind of salvation. There are so many of the horridly poor from New Orleans who are getting a chance in other places they did not have before. It sort of reminds me of the way we have to die to ourselves (painful) in order to receive something so much better -- a new life.

For some there will be only bitterness. For those who look to Christ through the storms in life, no matter how severe, the world will see HIS grace shining through and the catastrophe will have led some to Christ because of the way Christians react.

But all the time, God knows exactly what He is doing and each person affected is not being randomly affected, but affected in a way personal between God and him or herself.

 

John, to dismiss possible judgment by this reasoning is analogous to saying that countries have attacked other countries since time began, therefore the many subjugations that befell Israel in the Old Testament were nothing more than "politics as usual".

Of course if you read the OT, you'll readily see that they were judgments from God.

That's not to say that Katrina & Rita ARE judgements, but I would be very cautious about catagorically denying that they ARE judgments from God.

Fact is, right now we don't know!

 

wouldn't it be incredible if we treated them as judgments and turned from our wicked ways and repented, as a nation?

What a turnaround that would be!

 

Thank you for notifying me.