1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

KJBOism?

Discussion in 'Bible Versions & Translations' started by william s. correa, May 6, 2006.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. robycop3

    robycop3 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2000
    Messages:
    10,773
    Likes Received:
    248
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Actually, the USA was founded largely by CHRISTIANS. The first English bible known to have been brought to what's now the USA was the GENEVA BIBLE. The first new version to be made in what's now the USA was Eliot's Algonquian-Language Bible, by John Eliot, 1661.

    There are more Jews living in the USA than in any other nation, including Israel. There are more Jews in the US govt. than in any other nation, including Israel. That's why we have several different Bible versions in English in this land...There are more Christians per capita than in any other significant nation.

    MY theory has equal weight with YOURS, Mr. Correa. And, unlike YOURS, MINE is supported by SCRIPTURE. Israel is still God's peculiar people, whom He's gonna bless, despite themselves, not because they deserve it, but to SHOW HIS POWER, and show His word stands. And there are more known Israelis(Jews) here than anywhere else.

    OTOH, there's NO Scripture that can be applied to only the KJV, or any other one version in ANY language, alone.

    Sorry, Mr. Correa, your guess was incorrect...No kewpie doll today.
     
  2. robycop3

    robycop3 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2000
    Messages:
    10,773
    Likes Received:
    248
    Faith:
    Baptist
    KING JAMES BIBLE </font>[/QUOTE]You "MEAN" kgb </font>[/QUOTE]KGB = K ing G eorge B ible
     
  3. DesiderioDomini

    DesiderioDomini New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2005
    Messages:
    836
    Likes Received:
    0
    THis thread is like an icepick to the temple.
     
  4. Snitzelhoff

    Snitzelhoff New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2005
    Messages:
    301
    Likes Received:
    0
    Worse. That would only hurt for a moment.
     
  5. DesiderioDomini

    DesiderioDomini New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2005
    Messages:
    836
    Likes Received:
    0
    Good point, but I've heard more feasible answers from my fish when they explain to me why Wylie Coyote never dies than those being presented lately from the KJVO for the atrocious things they claim.
     
  6. Keith M

    Keith M New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2002
    Messages:
    2,024
    Likes Received:
    0
    No! my friend it is a GOD product, and God gave Us His WORD and trusted us with it to share with the world, just like he trusted Moses and the Prophets to Keep and preserve His Word! He Knew the USA woul send Missionaries to the world lets face it folks this aint the fishing Hole its Out there in the World! </font>[/QUOTE]Like most KJVO believers, Mr. Correa apparently hasn't gotten straight the difference between God's word and an English translation of God's word, or else he simply refuses to accept the truth. The KJV is no more God's word than the NKJV, the NASB or the ESV. They are all English translations of God's word!
     
  7. Rev. Lowery

    Rev. Lowery New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2005
    Messages:
    344
    Likes Received:
    0
    So then what is Gods word if we dont have Gods word then what is Gods word and what is scripture if its not the Bible and you cant have scripture unless it is Gods word?????

    Kieth M.... If you know the KJV is not Gods word then that must mean you know what is Gods word please inform us all.
     
  8. Keith M

    Keith M New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2002
    Messages:
    2,024
    Likes Received:
    0
    [​IMG] :D [​IMG]

    Mr. Coyote and KJVO supporters seem to have a lot in common. No matter how many times they run into a solid wall, no matter how many times they are beaten, trampled, and just plain squashed, they keep coming back for more punishment. Looks like they would eventually learn, doesn't it?
     
  9. Keith M

    Keith M New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2002
    Messages:
    2,024
    Likes Received:
    0
    Why don't you re-read my post and see what I really said, huh?

    I said:
    If you don't comprehend what someone says, why don't you ask them about it rather than misquoting them and confronting them so hastily? It really would help if you know a little bit about what you're saying rather than coming off with half-baked false accusations that someone said something they didn't say at all!

    I forgive you for your error, Rev., and I have asked God to forgive you too. i really don't think you intended to lie - you just had a total miscomprehension of what I really said and this miscomprehehsion caused you to come off with such a totally false accusation. Now you can go ahead and take your foot out of your mouth. [​IMG]
     
  10. Anti-Alexandrian

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2002
    Messages:
    764
    Likes Received:
    0
    You should practice what you preach!! You have been dodging me since I asked you to provide proof that I'm KJVo!! Show me a quote where I have claimed to be a KJVO,or even hinted that I subscribe to that point of veiw.Either produce the quotes,or concede that you either dont know what you're talking about,or you are simply LYING.


    I want you to back-up your "half-baked" accusations or a public apology...


    This is not going away Keith M.It's time to be the man.
     
  11. Rev. Lowery

    Rev. Lowery New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2005
    Messages:
    344
    Likes Received:
    0
    Keith they cant all be Gods word because only the KJV is absolute in its translation. Sure it as been updated but never has anything been removed like ohhh say the deity of Christ ohhhhh and my favorite is the way The Message translates Romans 1:27 it leaves room for Homosexuals to do what they will if they love each other where as the KJV does not. I could go on with the doctrinal errors in the NIV, NASB, ETC. ETC. ETC. but I want brother cause you know in your heart that they are wrong. See ppl want to think God is fallible so they dont have to do what he say's. What better way to do that then to say his word is not infallible and absolute 100% correct, AV 1611 FTW!!!
     
  12. rbell

    rbell Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    11,103
    Likes Received:
    0
    what translation is the ETC.ETC.ETC?

    Man, that must be a tough one to read.

    Rev Lowery...nice avoidance of the issues:

    "I could go on with the doctrinal errors...but I (won't?)...'cause you know in your heart they are wrong."

    How 'bout some scripture for your accusations?

    (going out to buy an ETCETCETC translation)
     
  13. Rev. Lowery

    Rev. Lowery New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2005
    Messages:
    344
    Likes Received:
    0
    sure sure no problem
    (Col. 1:14)
    (KJV) "In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:"
    (NIV) "in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins."


    (Gal. 6:15)
    (KJV) "For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature."
    (NIV) "Neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything; what counts is a new creation."

    (Gal. 4:7)
    (KJV) "...thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ."
    (NIV) "...you are no longer a slave, but a son; and since you are a son, God has made you also an heir."


    (Gal. 3:17)
    (KJV) "...the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ....."
    (NIV) "...the covenant previously established by God"


    (Rom 1:16)
    (KJV) "For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ...."
    (NIV) "I am not ashamed of the gospel...."


    (John 6:47)
    (KJV) "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life."
    (NIV) "I tell you the truth, he who believes has everlasting life."


    (Mic. 5:2)
    (KJV) "But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, [from everlasting]."
    (NIV) "But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah, though you are small among the clans of Judah, out of you will come for me one who will be ruler over Israel, whose origins are from of old, [from ancient times]."

    (1 Tim. 3:16)


    By the changing of one word a verse can be rendered ineffective in declaring the deity of Christ.

    (KJV) "And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: [God] was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory."
    (NIV) "Beyond all question, the mystery of godliness is great: [He] appeared in a body, was vindicated by the Spirit, was seen by angels, was preached among the nations, was believed on in the world, was taken up in glory."

    (Phil. 2:5,6)
    (KJV) "...Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, [thought it not robbery to be equal with God]:"
    (NIV) "...Christ Jesus: Who, being in very nature God, [did not consider equality with God something to be grasped],"

    (1 John 5:7,8)
    (KJV) "For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy
    Ghost: and these three are one. {8} And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one."
    (NIV) "For there are three that testify: {8} the Spirit, the water and the blood; and the three are in agreement."


    (Jude 25)


    (KJV) "To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and for ever. Amen."

    (Notice the additional words that are added in the NIV.)

    (NIV) "to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, *[through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages]*, now and forevermore! Amen."


    (Rom. 14:10-12)
    (KJV) "...for we shall all stand before the [judgment seat of Christ]. {11} For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God. {12} So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God."
    (NIV) "...For we will all stand before [God's judgment seat]. {11} It is written: "'As surely as I live,' says the Lord, 'every knee will bow before me; every tongue will confess to God.'" {12} So then, each of us will give an account of himself to God.

    Now these are only a few errors in the NIV
    Lets look at the NASB

    Matthew 6:13 KJV "And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen." NASB puts the last two phrases in brackets and says they are not in the oldest and best texts (which are the Catholic corrupted texts out of Alexandria Egypt). It's a lie that cannot be proven; in fact the opposite is easily proven. Many verses are done this way.

    Matthew 6:33 KJV "But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and His righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you." NASB "But seek first His kingdom and His righteousness; and all these things shall be added to you."

    Matthew 8:29 KJV "And, behold, they cried out, saying, What have we to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before the time?" NASB "And behold, they cried out, saying, "What do we have to do with You, Son of God? Have You come here to torment us before the time?"" NASB leaves out the word 'Jesus.' Where is Jesus?

    Matthew 9:18 KJV "While he spake these things unto them, behold, there came a certain ruler, and worshipped him, saying, My daughter is even now dead: but come and lay thy hand upon her, and she shall live." NASB "While He was saying these things to them, behold, there came a synagogue official, and bowed down before Him, saying, "My daughter has just died; but come and lay Your hand on her, and she will live."" The NASB changes 'Worshipped Him' to 'Bowed down before him'. Bowing down is not worship. You bow to the Queen of England in respect without worshipping her. If you don't want to admit Jesus is God, then you can't admit worship of Him.

    A few more similar verses:

    Matthew 20:20 KJV "Then came to him the mother of Zebedee's children with her sons, worshipping him, and desiring a certain thing of him." NASB "Then the mother of the sons of Zebedee came to Him with her sons, bowing down, and making a request of Him." The NASB changes 'worshipped him' to 'bowed down before him.'

    Mark 5:6 KJV "But when he saw Jesus afar off, he ran and worshipped him," NASB "And seeing Jesus from a distance, he ran up and bowed down before Him;" The NASB changes 'worshipped him' to bowed down before him.'

    Luke 24:52 KJV "And they worshipped him, and returned to Jerusalem with great joy:" NASB "And they returned to Jerusalem with great joy," NASB leaves out the words 'worshipped him.'

    Matthew 4: 40 says 'Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.' Jesus accepted worship and admitted He was God! In Revelation 22:8-9 KJV "And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel which showed me these things. {9} Then saith he unto me, See thou do it not: for I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren the prophets, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship God." NASB "And I, John, am the one who heard and saw these things. And when I heard and saw, I fell down to worship at the feet of the angel who showed me these things. {9} And he said to me, "Do not do that; I am a fellow servant of yours and of your brethren the prophets and of those who heed the words of this book; worship God."" John did not accept worship.

    These are only a handfull of errors in the NASB

    Now we will look at the NWT

    Isaiah 7:14

    "Therefore the LORD himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel."

    Most of the new translations have attacked the Virgin Birth of the Lord Jesus Christ by substituting the word "virgin" with "young woman" or "maiden." A young woman or a maiden is NOT necessarily a virgin. Mary, the mother of Jesus, WAS a virgin. In fact, Matthew tells us so in Matthew 1:23, when he QUOTES Isaiah 7:14 and uses the word "VIRGIN." What does YOUR translation say in Isaiah 7:14?

    Luke 2:33

    "And Joseph and his mother marvelled at those things which were spoken of him."

    The King James credits Mary with being the mother of Jesus, but does NOT refer to Joseph as His father. However, many new versions imply that Joseph WAS the father of Jesus by changing out the word "Joseph" with the word "father."

    Acts 20:28

    "Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood."

    Many of the new versions attack the Blood Atonement of Christ in this verse by OMITTING the word "blood." Does your's? The Blood Atonement is a MUST for anyone to be saved (Matthew 26:28; Revelation 1:5; Leviticus 17:11; Hebrews 9:22), yet the new versions are taking it out of the Bible!

    Luke 23:42

    "And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom."

    In this particular case, the dying thief is being saved. Romans 10:13 tells us that we are saved by calling upon the name of the "Lord," and this man addresses Jesus as "Lord." The new versions, however, rob Jesus of His Lordship by stealing the word "Lord" from the text! Is your version guilty or innocent?

    Revelation 11:17

    "Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned."

    This verse reminds us that Jesus is COMING AGAIN, or at least it does in the King James. In many versions (or perhaps we should say "perversions") the words "art to come" have been taken out of the text.

    Now for one final verse as I believe I have made my point.

    Revelation 22:17-21 (King James Version)

    17And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

    18For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:

    19And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

    20He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus.

    21The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen.

    Can I Get An AMEN !!!!!

    By the way if you dont see the clear problem please let me know I will be happy to explain in detail the problem but seeing as we can all read here it should be clear.
     
  14. Keith M

    Keith M New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2002
    Messages:
    2,024
    Likes Received:
    0
    Nice try, Rev., but ya got it all wrong! It is belief in this myth that has led you down a road of deep error. As I said before, the KJV is no more the word of God than the NKJV, the NASB or the ESV. Please give us scriptural backing for your fantastic claim, Rev., and we will all believe the KJVO theory just as you do. Until you (or anyone else) can scripturally support the KJVO idea, then it remains just what it is - an absolute myth.
     
  15. rbell

    rbell Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    11,103
    Likes Received:
    0
    funny...

    You make a claim, apparently, of "diminished lordship" as some places in modern versions "remove" Christ, Lord, etc. But if you're going to be consistent, notice that in Jude 25, a Christological emphasis is ADDED. Would a translation that seeks to "diminish the deity of Christ" do that? Would a godless translation ADD the word Christ in Colossians 2:9?

    Colossians 1:14 is a parallel passage to Ephesians 1:7--in which "the blood was not removed." Could it be that the early MSS have it in one passage but not another? If the NIV were truly a corrupt version, would they not remove the word "blood" from the parallel passage as well?

    Also...I fail to see how any of these scriptures change a single facet of my theology.

    I better quit. My arms are sore from tearing down strawmen.
     
  16. Askjo

    Askjo New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2003
    Messages:
    3,736
    Likes Received:
    0
    Rev. Lowery, excellent comment! [​IMG]

    Let the KJV reverence our Lord Jesus Christ. We praise God for providing us most accurate Bible, namely the KJV for our mother tongue available today.
     
  17. Ransom

    Ransom Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2000
    Messages:
    4,132
    Likes Received:
    1
    william s. correa said:

    My point is that they started with the isms, and NOW they send Missionaries? I dont beleive that God would just trust any one with His Word.Thats great that there are some saved folk in S. Korea But what About N. Korea where they Abort and kill more Christians than any where else those are the ones who need Jesus!

    Yeah, good thing there are decent, civilized white folks in the world to preserve God's Word, because the savages over in Asia would screw it up big time. :rolleyes:
     
  18. Rev. Lowery

    Rev. Lowery New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2005
    Messages:
    344
    Likes Received:
    0
    See the thing is modern versions are not translations they are only variations on what is known. If I write a book and say, "OK this is my version of the Bible." What makes that book anymore or less scripture than the book which it is based off of? The answer is simple its called Canon of the Scripture and if my book can not measure up to the original then it is not equal.

    So your next question is how do we know the Bible is exact Rev. Lowery? That's known as this little thing called Faith and believing that God is true to his promises. If you cant or are unwilling to trust God you have more issues than Just MVO'ism. MV's are not scripture they are tools to help us understand scripture. See guys if we say that everything is the word of God then we take away the Authority of God and the authority becomes ours which is stupid.
     
  19. rbell

    rbell Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    11,103
    Likes Received:
    0
    Fine...

    Then the KJV is a variation of what was already known...since it is not the first English translation. Your logic works against you in this case.
     
  20. Joseph M. Smith

    Joseph M. Smith New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2006
    Messages:
    1,041
    Likes Received:
    0
    But there are modern translations which DO go back beyond the AV to struggle again with manuscript evidence, textual variants, the meaning of words, as well as what communicates. Granted that bias can slip in to modern translations -- C. H. Dodd's realized eschatology in the NEV comes to mind. What assures us that bias did not slip into the KJV?

    Personally I use the NRSV with a great deal of confidence. And I also operate on the maxim that one never makes doctrine out of an isolated Scripture verse, particularly one that is obscure or disputed.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Loading...