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New survey: Only one-third of Catholics believe in Real Presence

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by rsr, Aug 10, 2019.

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  1. rsr

    rsr <b> 7,000 posts club</b>
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  2. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    Which is why most Catholics now go to independent churches ... if they go at all.
     
  3. utilyan

    utilyan Well-Known Member
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    I actually expected lower numbers. Maybe quarter of church goers. And maybe 1 out 10 of non-goers.
     
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  4. Adonia

    Adonia Well-Known Member
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    If true, it seems to me that these people are in the wrong faith tradition and should be worshipping elsewhere.
     
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  5. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    They do!
     
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  6. MarysSon

    MarysSon Member

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    Then why are the numbers of ALL Christian churches dwindling, hmmmm?

    What is happening in the Catholic Church is not exclusively a "Catholic" problem - but a problem of people becoming more secular.
     
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  7. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    Sincerely.... most modern churches suck. You can read many archived threads on here that will explain it in detail. Seriously though, there aren’t enough “Born Again” people to move it forward. Do Catholics take being born again seriously?
     
  8. MarysSon

    MarysSon Member

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    Of course we take being born again seriously.
    We are born again at Baptism, as Christ prescribes in John 3:5.
     
  9. JonC

    JonC Lifelong Disciple
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    I can see this. I have several Catholic friends who are pretty much agnostic. They are very vocal about supporting the Catholic church while not necessarily affirming its teachings (they do so out of tradition). Many just reject specific doctrines.

    Given the nature of the church (historically, when "Christendom" refered to entire nations) I suspect this has always been common to some extent. It is, IMHO, the "thorn" in the early Roman Catholic Church.
     
  10. davidtaylorjr

    davidtaylorjr Well-Known Member

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  11. MarysSon

    MarysSon Member

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  12. rsr

    rsr <b> 7,000 posts club</b>
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    Come on, guys. Stay on topic. If you want to argue about baptism, start your own thread.
     
  13. utilyan

    utilyan Well-Known Member
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    Our baptism are not symbolic an fake.

    As the Eucharist.

    We take what God says as the law. So like if he says eating a particular fruit is forbidden.....you might think that is symbolic and the fruit actually doesn't do anything, We'd say you are wrong Cause GOD CAN DO WHAT HE WANTS , HOW HE WANTS.

    You have a lack of respect of God's ORDINARY power. God says the gospel converts people, you say no, that god is required to intervene. Silly view of God's power.

    You can set your sprinkler to water a lawn.......but God can't save a person with a gospel.
     
  14. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    Jn 3 was not speaking of Christian baptism. There was no Christian baptism until after the day of Pentecost.
     
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  15. MarysSon

    MarysSon Member

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    I was asked about whether or not Catholics take being born again seriously and I responded with the Catholic answer.
    I don't mind staying on topic - but my response was challenged by somebody who didn't like it, so I let him know what the Bible had to say about it.
     
  16. MarysSon

    MarysSon Member

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    There was no Eucharist until the Last Supper either - but the Bread of Life Discourse in John 6 is ALL about the Eucharist.
     
  17. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    Hello MS,

    John six is all about Jesus as the true Manna yes indeed.
    The wafer does not transform into the real body,the roof of your mouth.
    We are to feed on Jesus and His word spiritually.

    Jesus did not expect Nicodemus who was "thee teacher in Israel" to know about something new, but rather to understand OT. teaching.
    The unbiblical NT. priest does not consecrate a wafer to change into anything, but the thin wafer that sticks to the roof of your mouth.
     
    #17 Iconoclast, Nov 3, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2019
  18. MarysSon

    MarysSon Member

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    Tie for a Bible lesson . . .

    In John 6:53, Jesus stated in no uncertain terms: “Amen, amen, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you.

    Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him on the last day. For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me and I in him.”


    It is interesting to note that the usual Greek word used for human eating is “phagon”, however, this is not the word used in these passages. St. John uses the word, “trogon”, which means, "to munch or to gnaw" - like an animal eats. John using hyperbole to drive his point across so that the crowd would understand that he was not speaking metaphorically. Jesus meant what he said.

    Just as the Paschal Lamb was to be eaten, it is also true for the Lamb of God.

    In verse 60, his disciples said, "This saying is hard; who can accept it?"

    Did Jesus explain what he "really" meant? No, he said: "Does this shock you?" He knew that some would not believe because they didn't have true faith from the Father.

    This is why his followers abandoned him and returned to their former way of life in verse 66. This verse says, “As a result of this, many of his disciples returned to their former way of life and no longer accompanied him.”

    This marks the only time in Scripture where Jesus' disciples left him for doctrinal reasons. They simply couldn't handle what Jesus was telling them.

    It is also important to note what happened AFTER this. Did Jesus plead with them or explain that he was speaking “metaphorically” or “symbolically”? NO. He turned to the Apostles and said, "Do you also want to leave?" He didn't explain to them either - like He ALWAYS did.
    Here it is completely evident - except to those who refuse to see - that Jesus meant what he said.
     
  19. JoeT

    JoeT Member

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    Maybe you should be aware these are self-participating members of Pew's own panel group. "The American Trends Panel (ATP), created by Pew Research Center, is a nationally representative panel of randomly selected U.S. adults. Panelists participate via self-administered web surveys. Panelists who do not have internet access at home are provided with a tablet and wireless internet connection."

    This is not a survey or a survey sample of the Catholic community or for that matter other religious communities. You need to review some of, what should be embarrassing, conclusions about Protestantism. Pew has never been a friend of Catholicism in particular nor has it been a friend of Protestantism in particular.

    Like all the rest of Pew's reports on Catholicism, I find them quite meaningless and not indicative of my community or Parish.

    JoeT
     
  20. davidtaylorjr

    davidtaylorjr Well-Known Member

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    No, actually it wasn't.
     
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