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No due process

Discussion in 'Political Debate & Discussion' started by NaasPreacher (C4K), Sep 30, 2011.

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  1. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    First, source? Second, I've already shown why it is acceptable and necessary in THIS instance. The red herring is in "killing any American he wants". That is obvious.
    So I take it by your non response you have no problem with inncoent soldiers dying trying to ensure this "citizen" of his rights.
     
  2. NaasPreacher (C4K)

    NaasPreacher (C4K) Well-Known Member

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    Did President Obama declare martial law here? If so then he had the right to order and execution.

    Due process is a constitutional right - no president has the right to annul it.
     
  3. Crabtownboy

    Crabtownboy Well-Known Member
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    Amen and AMEN. When I have been in foreign countries I have always been very happy that I had an American passport in my pocket. It gave me some protection. It may still give me some protection from the foreign government, but does it and my citizenship protect me from my own government?

    The solo around the world sailor, Tristan Jones, said in one of his books something like this:

    Perhaps we will now have to expand that quote to include our security agencies and forces. I hope not. However I find this deed deeply worrying.

    Yes he was a bad man. Yes he was an enemy. But also yes he was a natural born American citizen. Does this not worry others? I would think so.
     
  4. NaasPreacher (C4K)

    NaasPreacher (C4K) Well-Known Member

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    I hate it when police officers are killed trying to arrest an known criminal just to make sure he has a fair trial. I would hate to see soldiers die arresting an American terrorist. No one ever claimed our rights were cheap.

    Why is 'citizen' in quotation marks? Do you have any evidence that he was not an American?
     
    #24 NaasPreacher (C4K), Sep 30, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 30, 2011
  5. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    Our rights are also not guaranteed. Just ask the unborn.

    He was an enemy of the United States leading an enemy army, he was not a resident citizen committing a crime. He can be called whatever you want to call him.
     
  6. Ruiz

    Ruiz New Member

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    This is a tough one for me and one that I would need more information. However, I tend to agree with the side who wants due process.

    First, those who disagree with the Patriot Act, I agree. Horrible and should be repealed.

    Yet, if a man is actively engaging in trying to overthrow the American Government then there is precedence to kill him. It would be like killing a man who is using a gun to kill police officers and the police officers kill him.

    On the other hand, should we give a pre-meditated order to kill the man? That is where the issue lies. If we target an installation that is hostile to us and he happens to be there when we destroy it, that is one thing. But to target an American, that is entirely different. If we target him for capture and he uses force against our men, they are justified to kill him as a police officer would be justified against any normal criminal. Yet, to target him to kill him without standing trial, is a violation of our constitution. Assassination without a trial violates our laws in general.

    Yet, I tend to think a government targeting private citizens of the United States for assassination is wrong and scares me. I think this could be an impeachable offense under law.
     
    #26 Ruiz, Sep 30, 2011
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  7. NaasPreacher (C4K)

    NaasPreacher (C4K) Well-Known Member

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    I abhor the murder of the unborn. That does not make it right to ignore the rights of an American citizen no matter how bad his crimes.

    Pragmatism is a sorry reason to ignore the Constitution.
     
    #27 NaasPreacher (C4K), Sep 30, 2011
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  8. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    Never answered...a convoy of armed militants who's purpose is killing and harming US soldiers and the US has an American in the midst. What is the military supposed to do?

    Followup question, do you have problems when a police officer uses deadly force on a fellow US citizen brandishing a weapon ensuring he does not receive due process? This answer should reflect the first.

    Third, source that the President "ordered" his execution?
     
  9. NaasPreacher (C4K)

    NaasPreacher (C4K) Well-Known Member

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    I agree. This should be further investigated. No president has the power to claim the kind of authority the president has claimed here.
     
  10. NaasPreacher (C4K)

    NaasPreacher (C4K) Well-Known Member

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    Was this convoy on the way to attack US soldiers? What actual crime was committed here?



    Every police officer does all he/she can do to insure due process. Physical force is only used when there is an immediate threat. 'Taking out' a possible threat otherwise is a sure was to be disciplined. IMNSHO President Obama deserves discipline for ignoring the Constitution he swore to uphold.


    It is in the Fox article and has been common knowledge for over a year. This was the problem here. It was a pre-ordered execution, not a response to an immediate threat. HERE is another source - just the first one to pop up on Google
     
    #30 NaasPreacher (C4K), Sep 30, 2011
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  11. billwald

    billwald New Member

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    I have no sympathy for people who go to that part of the world for ANY reason. You all should be protesting the undeclared war, not the fall out from it.
     
  12. NaasPreacher (C4K)

    NaasPreacher (C4K) Well-Known Member

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    That is not the topic of this thread
     
  13. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    I'm sure they were out just walking the dogs :rolleyes:
    An admitted enemy convoy during a time of war who has stated their purposes is not an "immediate threat"? The military was justified based on the rules of engagement...and no crime was committed by Obama or the military.

    I found this interesting from your source (which is not evidence Obama did what you accuse him of)

     
  14. NaasPreacher (C4K)

    NaasPreacher (C4K) Well-Known Member

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    From the Harper's article linked above

    So all a president needs to kill an American are things that he says? He doesn't even have to commit a crime? This warrior was not in conflict on a battlefield against US forces unless there was a battle of some some sort going on in Yemen.

    The president, in ignoring the constitution he swore to uphold has committed an impeachable offence.
     
  15. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    Another interesting quote from your (biased) article...

    Leading the enemy of the US is not a crime?!? To who, muslims? Let's see how your due process goes by stating on an open forum that you plan on leading a military action against the US. I would be interested to hear what the CIA and FBI has to say to you.
     
  16. NaasPreacher (C4K)

    NaasPreacher (C4K) Well-Known Member

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    'My' due process? I though that was something all Americans shared? If I were to say those thing you suggest I would fully expect to be investigated, possibly arrested, and maybe face trial. That would be 'my' due process. I would not expect the president to order my execution - though maybe I should now.

    This president has violated his constitutional oath the defend the constitution by making himself judge and jury in a criminal case. He should be impeached for 'high crimes and misdemeanors'
     
  17. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis <img src =/curtis.gif>
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    I sure did get a laugh when I heard the team zero syncophants tell us the Patriot Act was a goner. Even one poster on this very thread accused me of being ignorant when I told him he was being lied to.

    Obama must be laughing at how easy this is.
     
  18. NaasPreacher (C4K)

    NaasPreacher (C4K) Well-Known Member

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    Where did I claim that? If it is a crime he should have faced a judge and jury - not a presidential death warrant.
     
  19. NaasPreacher (C4K)

    NaasPreacher (C4K) Well-Known Member

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    I can't believe he will get away with this, and with the support of conservative, freedom loving Americans. When it comes right down to it, President Obama now has declared that he has the right to order the execution of Americans. That is an incredibly dangerous power!
     
    #39 NaasPreacher (C4K), Sep 30, 2011
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  20. NaasPreacher (C4K)

    NaasPreacher (C4K) Well-Known Member

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    When Americans support their president in issuing a death warrant against a fellow citizen the terrorists have well and truly won.
     
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