Featured Pardon by Grace or by Works?

The cults pit Scripture against Scripture and ignore the context when they do so causing "apparent" contradictions when in reality there are none.

What does the Bible say about Abraham?
Romans 4:3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.
--Abraham was saved by faith alone. This is what the Scriptures clearly teach. Now you can go ahead and take the Scriptures from James out of their context, thereby foolishly making the Bible look as if it contradicts itself, or you can find out the context that those verses are written in, and see how they harmonize with what Paul wrote--your choice.

 

He did exactly what you and Moriah and others are doing! He offered up the fruits of HIS OWN WORKS on the very same altar that Abel offered up the slain lamb (Jn. 1:29)! Abel offered up the life of a slain substitute while Cain offered up FRUITS of his own labors. What God rejected was WORKS of his own hands as a suitable offering. Only the shedding of blood of a SUBSTITUTIONARY LIFE is acceptable with God. You are following in the way of Cain.

Why don't you accept the Biblical explanation in Hebrews 11:4? I will tell you why because you reject it.

heb. 11:4 ¶ By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.

1. Faith was required prior to offering it up because he offered it up "by faith." Thus faith preceded the good work.

2. The offering did not obtain regeneration/salvation/justification but obtained the "WITNESS THAT HE WAS" already righteous by faith.

3. Hence, he did not offer up the sacrifice in order to become a child of God, to become justified, to become regenerated but as a WITNESS that he already "was" all that by faith.

Because you have jerked the text out of its context, applied it wrongly and then set up a yes or no answer to a false premise. I placed the text back in its context proving that salvation is purchased without money or price but by the sure mercies of David which are based solely upon the blood purchase found in the everlasting covenant in the Person and redemptive work of Jesus Christ.

Repentance and faith have their source in the regenerative power of God and not in man (Rom. 7:18b; 8:7-8; Jn. 6:44; 64-65; Acts 11:17; Philip. 2:13; Heb. 12:2, etc.)

it is self-evident that you have yet to obey God in "repentance FROM DEAD WORKS" and you never will unless God has mercy upon you and EMPOWERS you to do so. I say it is self-evident because you are still believing in and teaching the doctrine of "dead works" for salvation.

 

No sabbatical necessary. Just the plain truth! You are preaching "another gospel" which does not repent from "dead works." That is the simple truth - not a slander, not a personal attack - just the plain simple truth.

 

You don't even try to harmonize Scripture. You demonstrate in this post right here how you have Scripture contradicting Scripture.

Romans 4:3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

Romans 5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:

Both teach "by faith alone," but you don't want to believe what the Scriptures teach.

Did you mention the context? No.
Did you explain the context? No.
Do you even know the context of James? Apparently not.

The context of the book is important.
The context of the book of James is: "Practical Christian living." It is directed to Christians in general about their daily walk with Christ. It is not so much a theology book but rather about practical advice.

Then in chapter two, we encounter a chapter on the subject of faith and its practical implications. Paul writes a theological treatise on the doctrine of soteriology in the book of Romans and covers this subject very carefully and deeply from the theological side. James looks at it from a practical view. How does one put their faith into practice.

James gives examples to prove his point?
James 2:15-16 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
--This is one of many concrete examples of faith put into action that James gives. He is speaking of Christianity, not about salvation. Every verse here speaks about the Christian life.

James 2:18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
--This is the key verse of this chapter.
Don't just tell me you have faith. Demonstrate it! He tells the reader that he will demonstrate his faith by his works. His faith is the outcome of a genuine relationship with Jesus Christ.

James 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
--His faith is not just knowledge. His faith is a relationship with Christ. The object of his faith is Christ. Faith must have an object. The object of the demons faith is not Christ.

James 2:23-24 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
--Look carefully at verse 23. It is in harmony with Rom.4:3. In fact it is almost word for word the same. He believed God. Therefore he was made righteous. It was not by works. It was by faith and faith alone.
--Verse 24 is the outcome of his faith. He was justified by faith. The works were the outcome of the faith. This is made clear by verse 23. The two verses cannot contradict each other. "I will show you my faith by my works" he says. And so Abraham did.

 

As I said, as long as you refuse the context of the book, you will never grasp the understanding of the book. There is nothing I can do for you. You have the Bible contradicting itself and are perfectly content at leaving it that way.

 

Utterly ridiculous thinking here concerning the OP title, although I am not surprised in the least.

If we are pardoned by works, Christ died in vain, which is exactly the case for those thinking their 'pardon' comes by works as they can and never will (without the grace of God) fully trust in Him alone.

 

Jesus says the Father and he will make their home with the one who obeys (give them the Holy Spirit), and James says faith without deeds is dead. You are the perfect example of whom Peter speaks when he says about Paul, “He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction.”
Paul is explaining that we do not have to work for our salvation, as in various ceremonial washings, because faith in Jesus’ blood cleanses us. We no longer have to observe special days, because Jesus is who those days were about. We no longer have to make animal sacrifices for sin, because Jesus is the sacrificial Lamb.
You make Jesus and James contradict the Bible when you misunderstand Paul! Faith without works is dead! It you do not obey Jesus, then you do not love him, and he will not reveal himself to you. THAT IS THE WORD OF GOD. People gladly misunderstand Paul so that they do not have to give up any sins. What a job the devil has people doing, teaching that we do not have to obey.

 

Do you believe "the works of the law" are restricted to only the ceremonial aspects of the Mosaic Law? If so, how do you support that restrictive view?

In Romans 3:24-4:25 Paul is dealing only with the doctrine of justification by faith "without works". Abraham lived prior to the Mosaic Law and therefore "without works" in Romans 4:5-6 cannot possibly refer to any aspect of the Mosaic law. So your intepretation of Romans 4:1-6 "without works" is impossible.

However, in Romans 6-8 Paul deals with the doctrine of justification without works in connection with regenerative life which is evidenced by good works/obedience. The obedience or good works originate with regenerative life not justification by faith.

James 2:14-26 makes no theological distinction between justification and regeneration but sees them as they are - inseparable - in the sphere of practical Christian living. Hence, where there are no good works in the practical life of a professed Christian there is no basis to believe there is any justification by faith.

The issue you are missing is that Paul is dealing with Justification by faith without works as a distinct theological aspect of salvation apart from regenerative life in Romans 3:24-5:1. However, in Romans 6-8 Paul deals with the PRACTICAL inseperable connection of justification by faith with regenerative life which is manifest by good works/obedience.

James is not dealing with justification by faith as a theological treatise but with justification by faith as a PRACTICAL application to daily Christian living which is inseparable from regenerative life and good works. There is no contradiction between Paul and James. Paul is dealing with justification from the theological aspect in Romans 4 distinct from regeneration while James is dealing with the pratical application where there is no distinction in the Christian LIFE between justification and regenerative life. Think about what I said carefully before responding.

 

You have stated it very well, short and succinct.

 

Colossians 2:14 having canceled the written code, with its regulations, that was against us and that stood opposed to us; he took it away, nailing it to the cross.
Ephesians 2:15 by abolishing in his flesh the law with its commandments and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new man out of the two, thus making peace,
Colossians 2:14 Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day.
Romans 14:17 For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking, but of righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit,
Galatians 4:9 But now that you know God--or rather are known by God--how is it that you are turning back to those weak and miserable principles? Do you wish to be enslaved by them all over again? 10 You are observing special days and months and seasons and years!
Hebrews 9:10 They are only a matter of food and drink and various ceremonial washings--external regulations applying until the time of the new order.
Hebrews 13:9 Do not be carried away by all kinds of strange teachings. It is good for our hearts to be strengthened by grace, not by ceremonial foods, which are of no value to those who eat them.
Read all of Hebrews 9.

You reference Romans 3:24 and claim Paul speaks about works being repentance…yet Paul speaks about CIRCUMCISION just 6 scriptures later!
You reference Romans 4:25 and claim Paul speaks about works being repentance…yet Paul speaks about CIRCUMCISION in Romans 4 as the ONLY example of WORKS. Where anywhere in the Bible is works and NO REPENTANCE CONNECTED? NOWHERE is that in the Bible.

Circumcision came to Abraham! Circumcision is a work of the law.

You do not speak the truth. James says Abraham’s faith was working with his actions. Nowhere do we get that it is only after some kind of regeneration. You speak strange doctrines that are not in the Bible.

 

Since I believe the whole Mosaic law was abolished, then obviously the ceremonial was abolished. So your texts prove nothing unless you can prove that the civil and moral law as part of the Old Covenant was not abolished. Romans 3:19-20 includes the moral law because the moral law is included at the beginning of this dissertation on the law in Romans 2:16-18. Both the ceremonial and moral law are included in Romans 2:16-26 and this is the law Paul continues to speak of right into Romans 3:19-20. Indeed, in Romans 7:7 the tenth commandment is inclusive in the law Paul speaks about, thus proving that the words we are not "under the law" in Romans 6:14 includes all the law, civil, ceremonial, moral. Hence, you have offered no exclusive evidence at all. Indeed, all the law, both moral, ceremonial and civil was given by handwriting as Moses had to write the moral law himself.

Rom. 7:7 ¶ What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

Rom. 2:21 Thou therefore which teachest another, teachest thou not thyself? thou that preachest a man should not steal, dost thou steal?
22 Thou that sayest a man should not commit adultery, dost thou commit adultery? thou that abhorrest idols, dost thou commit sacrilege?

I think you better recheck you facts here. Romans 3:30 is a DENIAL that circumsion plays any difference in justification by faith not an affirmation and not an example. Circumcision is the very first applicable work performed upon a Jewish Infant that represents his committment to the WHOLE MOSAIC LAW. Romans 3:19-20 involves the WHOLE MOSAIC LAW as Romans 2:16-27 includes the TEN COMMANDMENTS as well as the ceremonial law.

Rom. 3:30 Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.

Again, you need to recheck your assumptions. Romans 4:6-12 is a DENIAL that circumcision or uncircumcision plays any part in justification by faith. There was no MOSAIC LAW at all when Abraham lived and so this cannot possibly be used to support your position.

Rom. 4:11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also:

"repentance from dead works" - Heb. 6:2

There was no Mosaic Law when Abraham lived. Hence, circumcision at the time of Abraham did not represent the Mosaic Law but represented ALL WORKS regardless of what they may be. This is a complete repudiation of your whole position.

That was my very point. James is speaking of the PRACTICAL DAILY relationship between justification by faith and works which includes the regenerate condition of Abraham. However, Paul is not referring to the PRACTICAL DAILY relationship between faith and works but is speaking of the THEOLOGICAL distinction of justification by faith to works or "without works." Paul deals with the PRACTICAL DAILY relationship between justification by faith and regenerative works in Romans 6-8. Hence, there is no contradiction between Romans 4:6 "without works" and James 2 "by his works." You simply are not understanding the different contexts.

"For we are His workmanship [1] CREATED IN CHRIST JESUS [2] unto good works...."

Good works are the product of God's CREATIVE work within us. That creative work is described as the new birth as this is God's work not man's work ("his workmanship") as we are born not of the will of man, or the will of the flesh or of blood but of God (Jn. 1:13). James 1:18 says explicitly we are born again by God - He begat us by his own will. The "new" man is described as a "new creature" and it is from this new creature that "good works" originate within man. This is simply the abc's of Biblical doctrine.

James 1:18 Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.

 

The commands that a person should be put to death, for instance for adultery, that is abolished.
However, for you to believe and teach that not committing adultery is abolished is laughable.

When “The Law” is spoken of in the scriptures, it is not separated, as you are separating it. Remember that when you study those scriptures. Never is not sinning abolished. Sin is never okay.

You need to pay more attention. You used Romans to try to prove no works means we do not have to repent and stop sinning! I have shown you that all of Romans 4 is about no works meaning things like circumcision.

Dead works meaning acts that lead to death!

Circumcision means nothing now. Uncircumcision is nothing now, BUT WHERE DO YOU GET THAT THE BIBLE SAYS REPENTANCE IS NOTHING, OR THAT BEING FAITHFUL TO YOUR WIFE IS NOTHING.

1 Corinthians 7:19 Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing. Keeping God's commands is what counts.

 

You are admitting that the PENALTY of that law has been abolished. Good! Because that is the sense in which I mean the whole moral law has been abolished because Christ paid the PENALTY in full and thus we are not under any of the Law for condemnation. It has also been abolished as a theocratic government administration.

I never said sin was ok. I only said the whole law is abolished in regard to PENALTY because Christ paid it in full. I only said the theocratic government administration on earth is abolished. We are no longer under the condemnation of the Law if we have been "justified by faith" as justification denies we are under any penal consequences of the law or else we are not justified.

And you are wrong! Romans 4 denies we are justified by any kind of works before or after the law was given in Moses. Works is not of grace as verse 4 states clearly. Abraham was justified BEFORE he was circumcised and the works he was talking about were the works PRIOR TO circumcision in verses 1-6. Romans 3:9-11 proves he is talking about MORAL WORKS as only the MORAL law can define "good" and "righteousness" which are MORAL terms not ceremonial terms. The law under consideration is both the ten commandments or moral law and the ceremonial law or any law of righteousness as Romans 2:16-26 includes the ten commandments as well as circumcision.

Which refers to justification by keeping MORAL, CIVIL, CEREMONIAL laws as he is talking to Jews. Law keeping is called "dead" works because all have already failed what the law demands and the condemnation for failure is DEATH - Rom. 6:23!

IT NEVER EVER MEANT ANYTHING AT ANY TIME concerning justification before God becuase Paul explicitly states that Abraham and all who are children of faith are justified by faith with or without circumcision as circumcision makes no difference to anyone at anytime in regard to justification because Abraham was justified by faith BEFORE he was circumcised and BEFORE the Mosaic law instituted ceremonial laws.

I never said it is nothing or that it is not wrong. I only said the condemnation for violating those laws has already been paid in full and there is no condemnation to those who are justified by faith or else they are not justified at all.

Compare that text and its context with this verse by Paul in a similar book dealing with the very same subject:

Gal. 6:15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.

It is the "new creature" that produces "good works" ("For we are his workmanship CREATED in Christ Jesus UNTO good works...."). Obedience is a consequence of regeneration not justification.

 

I cannot believe you think that we do not have to obey the moral law. You believe that God nailed NOT SINNING to the cross.

Sin is never okay. God did not do away with doing right.

I am the one who is telling you that Abraham was justified BEFORE he was circumcised. Circumcision is a work of the law.

Those scriptures do not support your beliefs. Romans 3 is about no one is righteous and never sins. It is about the Jews who were God’s chosen people sinned just like anyone else.

 

Moriah, this is dishonest, and the type of dishonest posting you have often been guilty of. You need to stop.