1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

reaching out to homosexuals

Discussion in '2004 Archive' started by massdak, May 25, 2004.

  1. Daniel David

    Daniel David New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Messages:
    5,316
    Likes Received:
    0
    Johnv said:

    1. Certainly, this is more effective, loving, and supporting than finger wagging.

    2. OTOH, referring to a "homosexual" does not necessarily mean that person is committing sinful sexual acts, any more than the word "heterosexual" referrs to a person committing sinful sexual acts.

    3. They're legitimate diseases.

    4. Finger wagging is not biblically apprporiate.

    5. We are no less sinners when we're saved than when we're lost.

    6. We don't want to push a sinner away from a relationship with Christ.

    My response:

    1. How do you know?

    2. The problem with homosexuality though, is that being a homosexual is evil before God, not just doing homosexual acts. Heterosexuality though is God-ordained.

    3. You are calling sin a disease. Nice.

    4. Please be more specific as it appears as though you are opposed to confrontational evangelism.

    5. Have you considered the New Testament?

    6. Pushing them from Christ? They are already opposed to Christ. They are running from God. They are dead toward God. No John, you blew this one pretty bad. Are you going to push them closer to hell? Aren't they already going that way?
     
  2. Charles Meadows

    Charles Meadows New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2003
    Messages:
    2,276
    Likes Received:
    1
    Daniel David,

    Well I'll never fault you for lack of orthodoxy! We are better witnesses when we share Christ's love with sinners than when we wag our fingers. We conservative Christians have a reputation of being judgmental and unloving to those different than we are. We don't need to wink at their sin in order to show them kindness. JohnV made a number of good points. If you tell a sinner he's going to hell and he laughs at you what do you do? Do you go home and pat yourself on the back and say, "Oh well I gave him the gospel"?
     
  3. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2001
    Messages:
    21,321
    Likes Received:
    0

    You're kidding, aren't you?

    The Bible is specific to a "man lying with a man". Hence, this is the point with which we should contend.

    According to the bible, heterosexual sexual activity outside of marriage is also an evil.

    But using your contention, alcoholism is unnatural, since sobriety is ordained by God (a point which I would agree with). However, a Christian who has fought with alcoholism, and refrains from drunken behavior in the future, is still a Christian, and still an alcoholic. The only former alcoholic is a dead one. It's not inaccurate to say there are alcoholics leading Godly lives. Likewise, there are homosexuals leading Godly lives. These folks are people who work to overcome the sins to which they were slaven to.

    I was referring to alcoholism. There's no skirting the issue. Alcoholism is a disease. However, if one refrains from the sin of getting drunk for his entire life, he's still an alcoholic. Drunkenness is a sin. Alcoholism is a disease. Two different things.

    I'm opposed to casting judgemental aspersions on people we do not know. Jesus appears to only condemn the religious community. People who are outsight sinners, he does not condemn. Rather, he dines with them, communes with them, and loves them. He does confront their sin, but not by finger pointing. The woman at the well and the adulterous woman are prime examples.

    The NT still contends that we're all sinners, saed or no. Saved individuals are new creations, but they're still sinners.
    You're making that judgement based on what? The fact that they're sinners? In that case, you're lost, too, my friend, since you're a sinner as well. I'm a sinner too. So is everyone on this board. We must all be lost, then.
     
  4. LadyEagle

    LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    22,028
    Likes Received:
    1
    Who here has boasted about wagging their finger and being judgmental and unloving towards homosexuals? I just said I don't want to "understand" them. But I really already do. Consider this:

    "My parents (or single parent, or adoptive parent) were too ___________(permissive, strict, or whatever) and therefore, I (have low self esteem, hate myself, hate the world, or whatever), so that is the reason why I hurt so bad and why I am (gay, drunk, drug addict, prostitute, wife beater, sexual pervert, sexual addict, rapist, murderer, or whatever).

    Anybody can "cop out" and not own up to the fact that they are a sinner and need Jesus Christ. And anybody can blame whatever sin they have on their parents. Big deal. Nobody has perfect parents. Look at Adam and Eve, they had the best shot at it and one of their sons was a murderer, for crying out loud.

    Nope, I don't buy it and I don't buy into the "lie" that we have to "understand the sinner," that the only way to "reach the sinner is to understand" the sinner.

    And I don't care if a drunk or homosexual or adulterer thinks I'm judgmental. I am not responsible for what other people think.

    Real Love is BEING confrontational. And that doesn't require "understanding" or "walking in their shoes."
     
  5. LadyEagle

    LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    22,028
    Likes Received:
    1
    I'm not. I WAS a sinner but now I'm saved by grace. I'm a new creation. I am no longer a sinner and Satan is no longer my father. I am a Child of the King. No sinner here. Former sinner, yes. Present sinner, no.
     
  6. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2001
    Messages:
    21,321
    Likes Received:
    0

    You mean, you don't sin? If you sin, then you're a sinner, saved or not. You sin every day. So do I. And we have to repent of them all the time. At any moment, we've probably got at least a sin or two that's unrepented. Heck, my ex-wife still hasn't repented of her adultery. She's a prodigal. Does that mean that I'm closer to a relationship with Jesus than her? It would be self-righteous of me to presume.

    The bottom line is, even when saved, you still need Jesus. You have a relationship with him, and rightly so, but your need for him has not diminished.

    Why not? Understanding is not condoning. Certainly, you as a mother have endeavored to understand where you children were coming from, even though you did not condone their actions. Understanding (so long as it is not condoning) is not wrong. Of course, choosing not to understand is fine too, if you want to do that. I've simply found that it tends to lead to judgement and bitterness towards our neighbors.
     
  7. Daniel David

    Daniel David New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Messages:
    5,316
    Likes Received:
    0
    Chuckles, Johnv's use of "finger wagging" is just emotionally charged language. It is worthless in discussion.

    Johnv, several points need to be made:

    1. Confrontational evangelism is what the N.T. requires. Now, you can call it whatever you want, but this idea of sharing the love of Christ without loving them enough to tell them they are also lost is not the love of Christ at all.

    2. No, Romans 1 addresses the idea of feeling toward a same-sex individual. That is the point of contention.

    Btw, Christians are not homosexual, ever. Homosexuality is a result of a mind given over to destroy itself. It is active judgment on the part of God.

    3. Heterosexuality though is the original nature God put within humanity. That can be distorted and abused if outside of marriage. Homosexuality though is always evil and never acceptable.

    4. Alcoholism is not a sickness, it is sin. It is a sin to be controlled by anything but Christ. I would like to recommend the Bible to you for further reading on that issue.

    5. I don't have to know a single homo on a personal level to still be able to accurately assess their problem and solution. Again, call it whatever you want.

    6. Although we still sin, the N.T. designation for us is not the same as those who are lost. Sorry.

    7. John, lost people are not morally neutral, struggling between God and sin. They are completely on the side of sin. If you can't even grasp this...
     
  8. Daniel David

    Daniel David New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Messages:
    5,316
    Likes Received:
    0
    John, sheeagle is correct about the nature of a believer. We are no longer sinners. We are saved people who sin. That isn't the same thing as the condition of a lost person.
     
  9. LadyEagle

    LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    22,028
    Likes Received:
    1
    You know there is a difference between BEING and committing. [​IMG] I now have my own personal lawyer in heaven Whose Blood covers it all. [​IMG]

    We have digressed from the topic.
     
  10. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2001
    Messages:
    21,321
    Likes Received:
    0
    A lost person is a person without grace. A saved person is a person with grace. One's being a sinner is a separate spititual issue from being saed or lost.
     
  11. Daniel David

    Daniel David New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Messages:
    5,316
    Likes Received:
    0
    John, I would like to recommend a course called: soteriology. That is just a fancy name for the study of salvation.
     
  12. GeneMBridges

    GeneMBridges New Member

    Joined:
    May 13, 2004
    Messages:
    782
    Likes Received:
    0
    I'm not. I WAS a sinner but now I'm saved by grace. I'm a new creation. I am no longer a sinner and Satan is no longer my father. I am a Child of the King. No sinner here. Former sinner, yes. Present sinner, no. </font>[/QUOTE]1 John 1:8: If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.

    Clearly, you do not understand the difference between justification and sanctification. Justification is a legal standing. It says we are pardoned from sin, not that we are not sinners.

    Sanctification is a synergistic work. It is that to which we are called to strive.

    You claim I am talking about a "social gospel." Clearly you are [personal attack snipped by co moderator] of what the term "social gospel" means. It means we should give alms, feed the hungry, take care of the sick, etc. at the expense of the care of their souls by offering them the gospel that saves it, that of Christ's substitutionary atonement on the cross.

    Where does Scripture say we should understand sinners? Jesus was fully God and fully man. He understood us. Surely we are to follow his example.

    Where does Scripture say we should not understand sinners and the way they behave? It does not, but Jesus example clearly shows that we should.

    I have not said that the things about which I have written excuse homosexual behavior. I challenge you to find one time where I have said that. I have not. I have repeatedly stated otherwise and demonstrated what I have said. I have linked to an ex-gay ministry HARVESTUSA , one of the best, brightest, and most prominent ones that is within one of the most doctrinally sound churches in this entire nation, and all you say is that I am excusing sin. Where have I ever said that homosexuality is not a sin? Where have I said that homosexuality is excused? Where have I said I supported anything of the sort?


    [personal attacked deleted].

    Please do not engage in personal attack of any other member of the BaptistBoard; future posts will be deleted without regard for discussion content.

    Bro. Dallas (co-moderator)

    [ May 25, 2004, 09:41 PM: Message edited by: Frogman ]
     
  13. LadyEagle

    LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    22,028
    Likes Received:
    1
    I never said it did.
     
  14. GeneMBridges

    GeneMBridges New Member

    Joined:
    May 13, 2004
    Messages:
    782
    Likes Received:
    0
    1. The context of confrontational evangelism is also relational evangelism. Read the story of the woman at the well. Nobody has said homosexuals are not lost or that we should not tell them that. We should not, however, set them into their own special category.

    2. There is no point of contention there at all. Nobody has said that Romans 1 does not speak to homosexuality as a sin.

    3. True.

    4. Wrong. Alcoholism can be a disease. Acting out on it is the sin. The craving for alcohol itself is a type of mental illness. What you say flies in the face of Christian Counseling.

    5. The fact that you use the word "homo" says a lot. "Homo" is a bigoted term. Do you think it is appropriate to call people names?

    6. The New Testament says we are saved by grace, it never says we are no longer sinners. It says that if we say we have no sin, we are deceived, and the truth is not in us. If we say we are not sinners it is only in the context of our legal standing in Christ. Its called the doctrine of justification. The doctrine of sanctification is a different story. You confuse the two.

    7. John comprehends that. However, Christians do struggle with sin. Perhaps you need to read over the material at www.harvestusa.org . Do so then come back and tell us what is unbiblical.
     
  15. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2001
    Messages:
    21,321
    Likes Received:
    0

    I don't see Jesus doing a lot of that. His examples of being with lost people show just the opposite. If we're to be confrontational in our evangelism, then we need to start with confronting ourelves. We're to be loving. 1 Cor 13 says nothign about love being confrontational. Indeed, when confrontation is rude, self-seeking, boastful, etc, it is unscriptural. Unfortunately, most examples of controntational evangelism have been just that. OTOH, non-confrontational evangelism does nto violate the precepts of 1 Cor 13.

    Depends how you do it. Yelling "God hates you and you're going to Hell" is not fruit-producing. OTOH, explaining to someone that you were once like them, and if God saved you, he can save anyone, is more fruit-producing. But too few Christians want to share. They just want to scare.

    Roman 1 referrs to the results of unrighetousness. It also mentions boastfulness and disobeying parents. They're listed as results of a prior action. No one's saying that it's not a sin. But it's clearly not the supersized sin that Christians often tag it with.

    No, homosexuality is the result of having a desire to have sex with someone who is the same gender as you. However, I would have agreed with you if you had said that a Christian endeavors to refrain from giving into those desires. Christians work to overcome their sinful desires. However, does does not make a Christian devoid of sinful desires.

    A person who gives in to heterosexual desires is just as evil as the homosexual. No way around that.

    You're completely ignorant of alcoholism. A person who never drinks again remains an alcoholic for the rest of his/her life. You never completely overcome it. That's jsut as true for the Christian who is an alcoholic.

    I do. They're repentant homosexuals.

    A sinner is one who sins. We're sinners, saved or unsaved. If we stopped being sinners, then we stop needing a savior to pay for our sins.
    Paul calls himself the "chief of all sinners". I guess Paul was wrong then?? I prefer to think of myself like Paul thought of himself. if that's not a "grasp", I don't know what is.
     
  16. GeneMBridges

    GeneMBridges New Member

    Joined:
    May 13, 2004
    Messages:
    782
    Likes Received:
    0
    Btw, Christians are not homosexual, ever. Homosexuality is a result of a mind given over to destroy itself. It is active judgment on the part of God.

    Now THIS statement IS an excuse for sin, because if homosexuality is an active judgment on the part of God, then the person is being made homosexual by God. It involves God in making fresh evil in a person's mind and heart.

    No, homosexuality is the outworking of idolatry. "Giving them over to a reprobate mind," is God ratifying their idolatry. It is not Him making them idolatrous. They can not see the folly of what they do. However, the passage goes on to name other sins, and the entire passage is part of Paul's explanation of the radical depravity of man as a whole. ALL sins have the potential to involve God giving people over to a reprobate mind eventually. God passes them over, that is what the theological definition of "reprobation," actually is. If you are Calvinistic, you must necessarily believe that God does this will all those that are not of the elect.

    "Sexual sin entertains a deep hold over men and women. There may be some sense in which, having cooperated with influences and practiced behaviors as an adult, one may never live one's life as if those things had never happened. Sin does leave scars. Let's not confuse the point though. The power of unbridled sin reigning in our hearts and bodies and "leftover" mopping up work to be done as part of a repentant heart, however long it takes, are not one and the same. In fact the latter may be a lifelong process.
    "
    I personally disavow that homosexuality is something any person "is." However, that does not change the fact that Christians are in fact subject to sexual sins of all kinds, including homosexuality. One can, therefore, "be" a Christian and "be" gay, in the same way that one can be an alcoholic or drug addict or an adulterer or divorcee and be a Christian. One cannot however be an OBEDIENT Christian and "be" gay.
     
  17. LadyEagle

    LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    22,028
    Likes Received:
    1
    Romans 8:[33] Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

    [34] Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
     
  18. GeneMBridges

    GeneMBridges New Member

    Joined:
    May 13, 2004
    Messages:
    782
    Likes Received:
    0
    That text does not say we are not sinners. You said, "I am not a sinner, I was one once, etc."

    Paul is talking in Romans 8 about nothing being able to separate us from God's love. He is not giving a license to sin.

    You said to me that I was promoting a social gospel. That charge was blatantly FALSE. You falsely accused me of believing and preaching a gospel I clearly do not advocate or preach. (Not only that you show you do not know what the term "social gospel" means).

    You allege I am trying to excuse sin, yet I have not ever done so. I have gone to great lengths to articulate that very fact, yet you continue to say otherwise. Nothing I have posted is an excuse to sin and I have explained why.

    You said that we are not called to understand sinners. Yet Jesus is the God-man, fully God, fully man, which means more than that He is the perfect atoning substitutionary sacrifice. It also shows us that God made the greatest attempt of all to know us and understand us by uniting God the son to us forever. We are told to be imitators of Christ. You are in error. If we are to truly be like Christ, we are to at least make some attempt to understand others.

    You say you do not want to understand homosexuals, and you justify yourself by saying there is no such mandate in Scripture, yet again, God became a man and in so doing made the ultimate attempt to understand us human beings. Again, you are in error.

    Not only that, we Christians constantly cry out about homosexuals not understanding us, yet you dont' show them the respect of trying to understand them. This shows your attitude is no better than theirs. Nay, it is identical to theirs.

    We are to emulate Christ. Your words have shown a disobedient heart to that. Your refusal to even listen shows as much.

    Paul, unlike you, even after being saved, says that he is a sinner, indeed the greatest of sinners. You say, "I am not a sinner." That contrast is stark.

    1 John 1:8...If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.

    1 John 1:10...If we say we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and the truth is not in us.
     
  19. GeneMBridges

    GeneMBridges New Member

    Joined:
    May 13, 2004
    Messages:
    782
    Likes Received:
    0
    Legends of the Fall
    By Barney Swihart, M.A., M.Div. Men's Staff Worker

    I deal with lives that have been devastated by sexual sin every day. Just the other day I talked with a young man facing the painful exposure of having sexually fallen with another man. This man was distraught and repentant. He shared with me his life long struggle of being raised in a solid, fundamentalist church, and yet feeling like there was no one he felt safe talking to. He went on to speak of the years of loneliness he felt struggling with his "schizophrenic" like existence in his church. On one hand he was an active member of the church. On the other hand, he struggled with the guilt and shame of his secret double life of struggling with pornography and occasionally acting out sexually. There are few sins that carry more guilt and shame than sexual sin. When someone is struggling with sexual sin, they are dealing with something that touches the very core of how they feel about themselves. People who struggle with sexual sin are not just struggling with out of control desires, but also with issues that deeply connect to their sexual identity and self-esteem. The guilt and shame that are associated with these issues are enormous. The result is the pressure to "hide" in their churches out of fear of being exposed. Recently I spoke to a men's church group about the issues of sexual sin and temptation. After I finished speaking, I opened the meeting up for a time of discussion. I was amazed by the uncomfortable shifting in their seats and the silence of the group. As I looked upon this group of men, many sat with heads lowered as if to avoid any eye contact. It was as if everyone was terrified to enter into the discussion for fear of being identified.

    DENIAL

    Many of us would like to think that serious struggles with sexual sin are problems that occur mainly outside the church. However, it has been my experience that whatever sin you see outside the church can, sadly, be found in the lives of those within the church. It is interesting to note that the Apostle Paul, in his letters to various churches, was not embarrassed to acknowledge and address issues of sexual sin in the church. (e.g. I Cor. 5&6) All of us are aware of well-known church leaders who have fallen sexually. However, there are alarming indicators that serious sexual struggles are not limited to a few fallen leaders. This is a growing problem in the church today. This reality certainly has been borne out in my experience. Every week I spend time with pastors, missionaries, and well-respected church leaders who come to me seeking help to deal with the bondage of sexual sin in their own lives. As I talk with other pastors and counselors, I also hear feedback about their own concern about the growing numbers of Christians coming to them for help. In addition, recent church surveys report some alarming statistics. In 1991, The Fuller Institute of Church Growth did a survey on "How Common is Pastoral Indiscretion?" The results were shocking. Thirty-seven percent of the respondents confessed to having been involved in inappropriate sexual behavior with someone in their church. Another recent survey of 300 pastors by Leadership Magazine indicated that 23% admitted to having been sexually involved with someone other than their spouse. It is also reported that some large hotel chains report some of their largest revenues for adult TV channels have occurred during Christian conventions. My worry is that if this high rate of moral failure exists with Christian leaders, what is going on in the lives of the "average" respectable looking men and women sitting in our church pews? My concern is that if struggles with sexual sin are this serious in the lives of men and women in our churches, then what is to be the church's response to this? Can we say that our churches are safe places for the sexual struggler to open up about their sin, so as to seek spiritual help and restoration?

    PREJUDICE

    The reality is that the whole issue of sexual sin in the church is an emotionally charged issue. It is a problem that engenders much fear and prejudice. Many in the church would list sexual sin at the top of their list of "worst sins." This contributes in part to the deep sense of shameful stigma that sexual strugglers feel in their church. But the fact is that such a perspective is not Biblical and is a denial of the grace of the gospel. In I Corinthians 6:9-10, the Apostle Paul lists sins of greed and gossip in the same list with the "sexually immoral" or "homosexual offenders." The truth is, sin is sin. When we sin, we sin against a Holy God and expose our deep need for Christ's forgiveness. Of course some sins have greater consequences than others. (1 Cor.6: 18) The real issue is that in God's eyes all sins are the same and must be confessed openly to Christ for forgiveness. All sin, whether it is greed, gossip or homosexuality, equally needs the grace of God. The danger in viewing sexual sin in a harsher light than gossip or greed, is that the sexual struggler feels a pressure to hide and keep his sin in the closet. It is no wonder then that so many sexual strugglers choose to avoid confession and carry their painful conflict alone. This in turn leads so often to a person living in two worlds, one existing in the fellowship of believers, and the other being the secret dark world of their sin. It is in this kind of isolation that the bondage of sexual sin entrenches itself. Sexual bondage thrives in the darkness of denial and deception that is fostered by such isolation. As long as there is hiding, there is little hope for freedom.

    SIMPLISTIC SOLUTIONS

    Another concern that sexual strugglers have in coming out and asking for help is the fear that simplistic solutions will be offered. Many a sexual struggler has shared with me the frustration over having finally opened up their problem with someone from their church, only to hear the moralistic response of "Just turn to God and repent." This unsympathetic response amounts to being heard as "Just shape up and act the way God wants you to act." Too often the well-meaning, but misguided persons who offer this advice, are Christians who have not wrestled with the depth of their own sin and the complexities of the bondage of serious sexual sin. These people tend to understand the bondages of serious sexual sin as simply "yielding to the flesh" and think that the cure is exhortation and rebuke. Occasionally this type of approach may seem to work. But in the long haul, it fails to address the depth and deceitfulness of the human heart that empowers ongoing bondage. In addition, this kind of self-righteous approach ignores and puts salt into the struggler's deep wounds. This in turn often drives him or her away from God, and the supportive fellowship of their churches, rather than toward the redemptive mercy and love of God and His people. One of the sad consequences of this is that many sexual strugglers have had to turn to secular recovery groups for help. It is sad to say that many have felt there was little else available that offered a "safe place" to honestly deal with their struggles. The truth is that many sexual strugglers report to me that they experienced more love and compassion in their secular recovery groups than in the fellowship of their church. No doubt some Christians have been helped by such recovery groups; however, my burden is to see the Church become a "redemptive" and "safe" place where men and women can honestly deal with their sexual sin. Given the fact that the roots of sexual bondage are profoundly spiritual and moral in nature, it is crucial that the Church see its opportunity to become a refuge where the healing balm of God's truth and grace can be offered. I believe this is why so many men and women have sought out the ministry of Harvest. They came to Harvest because they saw it as a "safe" place where they could begin to honestly face their sexual bondages in the light of God's truth. Because the root issues of sexual bondage are spiritual in nature, the church must also avoid becoming simplistic, moralistic, or uncompassionate in its approach to the problem. As Christians we must acknowledge that there are deep and complex issues of the human heart with which we must grapple. Sexual bondage is never about simple lust or external behavior. It is in response to the deep wounds of life that sexual strugglers develop self-protective relational walls to insulate themselves from further hurt. However, the sad irony is that the very walls they have cultivated to "protect" themselves now have become the "prison" that keeps them in bondage. There are both deep hurts and deeply rooted sin patterns of deceitful thinking and responding that must be exposed and lovingly confronted.

    THE CHURCH AS A REDEMPTIVE COMMUNITY

    In responding to the challenge and need of ministering to individuals struggling with sexual sin, I would suggest that there are three important areas to consider. These are all suggestions that will encourage the church to become a place where people will feel encouraged to honestly open up their lives for help within the context of the local church.

    1. CULTIVATE AN ATMOSPHERE OF GRACE: The church must cultivate an atmosphere of grace through its teaching, preaching, and body life. This is a crucial dimension for the church to become an effective, redemptive community to the sexually broken. What I mean by this is that a church must clearly communicate through its ministry the truth of God's grace. It is the message of grace that invites everyone of us to see ourselves as sinners who deeply need forgiveness. Whether our sins are gossip, greed, or homosexuality, all of us stand in deep need of God's ongoing work of grace in our lives. The truth is, that the sin issues that plague the heart of a man or woman struggling with serious sexual sin, are the same sin issues that any one of us struggle with. At the core of all our sinful struggles are hearts that battle with pride, demandingness, and unbelief. In my own life, I have recently struggled with the battle of being overweight. In dealing with this problem I have come to see the sinful energy behind my overeating is no different from the energy behind my own past struggles with sexual addiction. The challenge for me has been not to minimize the sinfulness of my late night "excursions" into the refrigerator as being less sinful than past indulgences into pornography. As every one of us allows God's truth to humble us with this perspective, we will have a new, growing compassion for the sexual struggler. No longer will there be any room for a pharisaical attitude that says "I thank God I am not like those other perverted people who struggle with sexual sin" (Luke 18:11). It is interesting to note that Jesus saved his harshest rebukes for self-righteous Pharisees. (cf. Matt.15:1-9; 23:1-36; Luke 11:37-52) The message of grace humbles the heart and invites everyone in the church to see themselves as needy beggars who are trying to show each other where to find the ongoing "Bread of life" that Jesus offers. In a practical way I believe cultivating this kind of atmosphere begins with the consistent and clear preaching of grace from the pulpit. It will be the teaching and preaching on Sunday that will foster an atmosphere of grace in the ministry of a congregation. However, I also believe attention needs to be paid to what is being encouraged in the small group structure of a church. It is important that the body life of a church reflect the graciousness and acceptance of the Gospel.

    2. MAKE A COMMITMENT TO CONFIDENTIALITY: Another necessary element to encouraging the church to become a redemptive community is the need to maintain careful commitment to confidentiality. As stated before, there are few sins which carry more guilt and shame than sexual sin. The subsequent fears of exposure and rejection are what keeps many sexual strugglers from opening up to people in their churches to get help. I can tell horror story, upon horror story, about situations where individuals finally opened up with someone in their church, only to find the news of their problem painfully becoming spread to others within the fellowship without their permission. One such man reported sharing his struggles with homosexual feelings with a church deacon he had come to trust. Shortly thereafter he was removed as a Sunday school teacher without church leadership coming to him to discuss the nature of his struggle. The result was a painful sense of betrayal and rejection by God's people, just for taking off a mask and becoming honest. Other situations I have seen involve sexual strugglers experiencing the pain and embarrassment of finding out that they have been the subject of gossip in the church. It only takes one such painful experience of broken confidentiality to shut a sexual struggler down from ever opening up in the church again. Those who gossip and slander reveal their own sinfulness and demonstrate they are not "fit" to be involved in such a delicate ministry of restoration. In working with individuals who struggle with sexual sin it is imperative that serious attention be given to the subject of confidentiality. One must imagine how devastating a violation of trust must feel in order to appreciate the vulnerable position of the sexual struggler. In a practical way, there are a couple of key principles to keep in mind to guard confidentiality. First, is the importance of keeping the circle as small as possible. The more people that know, the greater the chance of some sort of breach of confidentiality. Disclosure should only be given on an "as need to know" basis. Secondly, the simple rule of thumb to follow about who needs to know is only those individuals who are part of the problem (e.g., individuals who have been directly affected by the person's sin) or those who are part of the solution (e.g., the pastors, elders or accountability partners who are directly involved with the person).

    3. PRACTICE LOVING CONFRONTATION AND ACCOUNTABILITY: A final important area to consider is the need for the church to provide a context for loving confrontation and accountability for individuals struggling with sexual sin. One of the greatest needs a sexual struggler has is the need to develop new relationships. The struggle with sexual sin is characterized by withdrawal, hiding, and isolation. However, this approach to relationships only leaves the person extremely vulnerable to pursue sinful avenues to relieve their emptiness and loneliness. It is also all too easy to fall prey, time and time again, to the "old deceitful" way of thinking that keeps them trapped in the bondage of their sexual sin. What is needed are relationships and other contexts where the individual can honestly share their lives and open up about their struggles. This includes relationships where someone not only listens and loves unconditionally, but also confronts in a loving manner. We all need others "to speak the truth in love" (Eph. 4:15) because ultimately it is in "knowing and living out the truth of God that we are set free" (Jn.8:32). However, the relationships that the sexual struggler experiences in the church must be those that reflect the gracious heart of God. Those who are involved with helping or discipling the sexually broken must be willing to love them through the power of Christ's love, surprising them with what they do not deserve, and offering them a taste of God's mercy, forgiveness, and joy. It is in offering them a loving relationship that is not deserved, that they begin the process of being restored to the Lord and others. Remember the story of the immoral woman weeping and anointing Jesus' feet with her hair? (Luke 7) Here is a picture of a woman's heart being so captured by the glory and tenderness of Jesus' mercy, that the shackles of her shame and guilt are dispelled to free her to boldly embrace Him. When Christ's love is given to those held in the bondage of sexual sin, it brings forth the power to astound them and dissipate the power of sexual sin over their lives. The thrust of the entire story is this woman's new freedom came out of the profound experience of forgiveness and mercy she tasted from Jesus' interaction with her. In a practical way, cultivating loving, confrontive relationships can be done in the context of pastoral counseling, one on one discipling, mentoring relationships, and small accountability groups. Consideration must also be made to utilize resources outside the church to further support and help the sexual struggler. This might include referring to a local Christian counselor and any Christian support groups. This is the role that Harvest has attempted to offer to local churches. Harvest has been a sort of spiritual "MASH" unit, seeking to help and restore sexual strugglers so that they might be able to effectively "mainstream" back into their churches. Harvest has done this by offering support groups for sexual addiction and homosexuality and individual counseling.

    CONCLUSION

    I must say that I cannot overemphasize the importance of the church in the process of restoration of sexual strugglers' lives. In my seven years of experience of working with sexual addicts and homosexual strugglers, I have never seen anyone fully experience freedom and restoration without being strongly connected to the life and fellowship of a solid Christian community. It is my burden to see the church of Jesus Christ grow in its vision and effectiveness in reaching out to the sexually broken men and women who struggle secretly and silently in our churches. I long for the church to become a more redemptive place that reflects the graciousness of God. It will not be by pressure of pharisaical exhortation that sexual strugglers will be invited to open up their lives and be restored. This kind of restoration and freedom will only take place in the context of a ministry that invites sinners to have their hearts captured by the glory and tenderness of the gospel. Dr. Dan Allender captures this truth powerfully with this concluding quotation: "Paul says that deception and enslavement to all kinds of passions begin to melt in the light of the kindness and love of God (Titus 3:3-4). The brutal power of lust will not succumb to any force of the human will unless the heart is captured by the glory and tenderness of the gospel. As the good news of freedom from God's wrath increases our wonder, laughter, and passion to live, then the dark desire to possess, to consume, and to destroy will have less power in our lives. The joy of being forgiven, not only of behavior but also of the sin deep in our hearts, will increase our desire to love (Luke 7:47). And an increase in a desire to love will deepen our desire to see beauty enhanced in everyone whom we have the pleasure and privilege to encounter."(Dan Allender, "Lust, Can We Ever Overcome Its Power?" Discipleship Journal, No.64, p.28) May God give us grace for His church to increasingly reflect the glory of His grace as it reaches out to sexually broken men and women!
     
  20. dianetavegia

    dianetavegia Guest

    Posting rules ask that you not post whole articles but rather short blurbs with links to the articles. Please refrain from these long cut and pastes. Also....

    Gene, your posts contain so many personal attacks and unkind words toward one of our moderators that I could spend half the night editing. Instead I'm going to warn you that anymore posts with degrading remarks will be entirely deleted with no further warning.

    Diane Tavegia
    Administrator

    Posting Rules: 2. Use discretion when posting. Not all topics are beneficial or edifying to the board. Topics and/or posts that would condone racism, every form of greed, selfishness, and vice, and all forms of sexual immorality, including but not limited to adultery, homosexuality, and pornography are strictly prohibited. The decision to deem a thread or post inappropriate will remain at the discretion of the Webmaster or his designee. Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, 12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world; 13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ.
    3. Show grace to the other posters. When someone disagrees with you, discuss it; but be slow to offend, and eager to get into the Word and find the answers. Remember, when discussing passionate issues, it is easy to go too far and offend. Further, if we are "earnestly contending for the faith" it would be unrealistic not to expect at times to be misunderstood or even ridiculed. But please note that your words can sometimes be harsh if used in the wrong way. The anger of man worketh not the righteousness of God.
    4. Personal attacks will not be tolerated. The board has an edit button enabled. We encourage you to use it and edit your own words. Moderators and Administrators will be visibly proactive in dealing with potentially offensive situations. Posts of a violent or threatening nature, either implicitly or explicitly, will be deleted, and the poster's membership revoked. We encourage personal problems with other members be resolved privately via email or personal messaging.
     
Loading...