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Trump is the Legal President

Discussion in 'News & Current Events' started by Aaron, Apr 11, 2021.

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  1. SGO

    SGO Well-Known Member

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    Characterizations are a wonderful part of kingdom living for "people like you".

    Well bless me. I'm doing it too.
     
    #21 SGO, Apr 11, 2021
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2021
  2. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    No, not characterizations.

    You questioned my patriotism because as a Christian who served in the Army for 23 years I have decided that I have to obey my conscious and not cast a vote in our political system.

    I said you were like Jane Fonda because she also was dismissive of military service, defining service to country as service to her own self-interests.

    You replied that you are fond of that comparison (I thought you would be).

    The question at hand is the application of patriotism.

    You say it means one is compelled to vote in the political affairs of a nation. I say it means devotion and service to one's country.

    So under your definition I am unpatriotic because, although a veteran, I have chosen to obey God and follow my conviction not to vote.

    Under my definition those who disrespect our nation by disrespecting the Presidency (the head of our nation) is unpatriotic (and unChristian).
     
  3. SGO

    SGO Well-Known Member

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    I did not question your patriotism.
    I questioned you calling others not patriotic because they believe Donald Trump is still the POTUS.
    Can you see the difference?
    I know you served and do not question that.
    Will you serve Biden when his admin tells you the bible is full of lies?
    Ok. Then there is a line somewhere in what "patriotism" is and is not even in your mind.
    If you keep reading the word of God even though President Biden may (hypothetically) call it an untrue book, would not that be "disrespecting" the President?
    How about when the major media has a hand in engineering Biden's win?
    Can not any one question that?
     
  4. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Post #5

    You went back and deleted it before this post. But it was already quoted in post #7.
     
  5. SGO

    SGO Well-Known Member

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    That's right, I realized my error.


    You did a good job slamming me and then not calling it a "characterization".

    Kingdom living at its finest.

    Go ahead, have another shot.
     
  6. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    No problem. I was not "slamming you" but "keeping you honest".

    I am glad to see you made the comment in error. But you shouldn't have assumed I would have recognized it an error. I was going off your post.

    It bothers me that Christians believe other believers should be compelled to engage secular politics by voting. I do not condemn Christian politicians and cannot understand the mentality of those who try to corner Christians into going against their conscious by voting.
     
  7. SGO

    SGO Well-Known Member

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    Maybe to you it's not a problem, and I appreciate it, but to me it is a problem.

    I do NOT consider you unpatriotic.

    I do have a reaction to you calling me names when you were angry.

    "Keeping me honest" is holding yourself way above.

    I will really doubt it if you say you were just debating.

    That to me, is not kingdom living, but of course it's my opinion.

    Yours not truly,

    Jane
     
  8. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Angry? I think you may have misunderstood my comments.

    You started our contact my questioning my patriotism (granted, in error or a misworded post).

    This did not make me angry. It did not offend me.

    But I was replying to that post. That is what I meant by "keeping you honest" (your reply was as if the post was never made, but you removed it after I had replied).

    I know my refusal to vote is something you have a problem with, but perhaps this is something of a problem in you.

    I believe Christians should abstain from voting. That is why I no longer vote. BUT I do not believe YOU should abstain from voting. I believe you are accountable to God and need to follow your convictions.

    I do not understand why you cannot afford me the same respect.

    I am content in defending my position, following God as I am convicted to follow Him, and allowing others to do the same.

    But if I state my opinion you act as if I am judging others. This hints that you may realize that your decisions are not as innocent as you make them out to be.

    But the bottom line is you have no right to judge me for abstaining from voting (and from arguing for my views). I have never judged you for voting, never had a problem with you voting, and never tried to persuade you to abstain from voting against your conscious.
     
  9. SGO

    SGO Well-Known Member

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    Good argument from I can always justify my actions,

    Jane

    and "people like me".

    Not too many shots now please.
     
  10. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    No, you may think you can justify your actions but post #22 shows otherwise.

    It always works like that, Jane. You decided to justify yourself by making a false statement. I guess you did not realize post #5 had been carried forward in the form of a quote.

    It would have saved us a lot of dialogue if you just said early on you had posted in error. But you tried to justify yourself.

    No biggie. People like to be right in the eyes of other men. I understand that.

    But it is better to want to be right in the eyes of God. For me, that means abstaining from secular politics. For you it means engaging politics.

    This is not a one size fits all issue.

    Who are you to judge the servant of Another???

    I have no problem with Christians who are involved in secular politics because those people answer to God, not to me.

    You, on the other hand, have a problem not only with Christians who vote differently than you but also with people like me who abstain from secular politics.

    I suggest the problem is with you, Jane. As yourself why you have a problem with Christians who choose to faithfully serve God rather than acquiesce to your conscience.
     
  11. SGO

    SGO Well-Known Member

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    "Good argument from I can always justify my actions," is you.

    Calling me Jane again is good too.

    The kingdom is here.

    Let's both of us admit to abusing it so Biden can rule by cheating.

    You will always be right.

    That is the mark of a political man.
     
  12. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I hope we all believe we are right in our convictions. I hope we are willing to defend our convictions. I wish we could do that without pretending the other person is somehow wrong for holding the positions they believe correct.

    You will not be able to make me act against my convictions by following yours. That would be, for me, a sin.

    That is why I have never condemned you for being involved with secular politics. You should do what you believe is correct.

    BUT your constant belittlenent of me for my faith, for following my conscious, is different because it is itself sinful. We are commanded not to encourage others to sin by violating their conscious as we are accountable to a Master who is able to make us stand.

    As far as President Biden goes, I will not change my mind. It is unpatriotic to disrespect the office by not recognizing the President.

    President Biden is the President. Congress confirmed his Presidency. Former President Trump confirmed his Presidency. The states confirmed his Presidency.

    President Biden is President. Get over it.
     
  13. SGO

    SGO Well-Known Member

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    Right again as always.

    Go ahead call me Jane again, Mr. Politician.

    I'll bet Aaron is overjoyed how we made a personal tiff the center of this thread.
     
  14. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Sure, Jane.

    But it is not me being right.

    That was 1 Timothy 1 and Romans 14.

    I apologize for not providing the reference earlier (I assumed we both recognized at least the principle as biblical).
     
  15. SGO

    SGO Well-Known Member

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    Oh, now you are going to the bible.

    Right on Politician.

    You need another shot.
     
  16. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I have been in the Bible all this time. How did you not notice???

    I do not vote because I am convinced it is wrong to be involved in secular politics. I will not be persuaded to act against my conscious because that would be a sin.

    But I also do not judge Christians who are involved in politics because we are not to judge the servant of Another. I have not condemned others for voting because I do not want to cause them to act against their conscious and sin.

    But I do believe my position is correct, which is why I hold it. I expect those who oppose my positions to also believe their position correct.

    YOU, on the other hand, have a problem with my refraining to vote. You questioned my patriotism (then said it was an error). At every turn you condemn me for following my conscious not to be involved in secular politics.

    Then you lie about me supposing, I take it, that by lying you have somehow offended me.

    You have not offended me. You have not made me angry. You can say I am involved in politics, but most here have been around enough to recognize the lie. They may disagree with me (I think most do here) but they know where I stand.

    It is amazing that my faithfulness to God has offended you to the point that you have forfeited your integrity. Are you that bent on your political party that you would trample the blood of Christ to raise the party flag?
     
  17. SGO

    SGO Well-Known Member

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    Jane is not in the bible political man.
    Your arguments may overwhelm me but YOU are not always right.
    You also have attributed ideas to me which I do not hold.
    That has been your Blitzkreig of the past.
    Thanks for the extra shot.
    I have already said you seem to have the desire to be always right even beyond expressing opinions now.
    However, I am prepared to continue for your false accusations and name calling in the guise of rhetorical debate have strengthened me.
    Also, you appeared to forgive me since I had removed the original offending post yet you bring it up again (#35) after I had admitted error.
    You hold grudges too.
    What does the bible say about that, preacher?
     
    #37 SGO, Apr 11, 2021
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2021
  18. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    AGAIN

    I do not vote out of a matter of conscience. I do not judge those who do get involved in politics.

    It is wrong that you have a problem with me not voting.

    You expressed that you believe those who do not vote have no room to speak about patriotism. In hind sight you said you posted that in error. But it can only mean what it means. Just because you regretted posting does not negate the sentiment it expressed.

    Members WILL NOT disrespect the POTUS. If the POTUS is not your president then you are not American.
     
  19. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I am closing this thread because the title of the thread is a lie.

    The House of Representatives and the United States Senate met in joint session and certfied the election results as submitted by the states and as required by the constitution.

    Former President Trump conceded the election to Joe Biden.

    The title of this thread is disrespectful and unpatriotic.
     
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