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Featured What would qualify as being heretical doctrines?

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Yeshua1, Jan 27, 2018.

  1. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Do churches such as the Sda and Church of Rome in their main doctrinal teachings rise to that level or not?
    what in the scriptures would constitute that threshood being reached?
     
  2. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    I was trying to see how others viewd groups that claim to be a christian church, and yet deny the essential Gospel that saves lost sinners?
     
  3. Felipe Rios

    Felipe Rios Member

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    Tough question. I guess it depends on the person lol Some people would call my view on the Bride as heretical and others would not. Over the years I feel that it depends on the person.
     
  4. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    The scriptures tell us what the Gospel is, and both Rome and Sda distort it to such a degree not even teaching it !
     
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  5. JoChris

    JoChris New Member

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    I am an ex-Roman Catholic. I had full RC upbringing, mass/ sacraments, nuns at primary school and so on. I left in my mid teens, partially due to reading the bible, partially extreme boredom.

    RC church doctrine outranks scripture. I never heard the full Gospel until first year of University.
    No matter how soft and welcoming the current Pope seems to outsiders not one RC church doctrine has changed. I am amazed that so many people cannot see/ignore this fact.
     
  6. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Rome still upholds the Council of Trent, so they still affirm a false Gospel!
     
  7. Reformed

    Reformed Well-Known Member
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    There are small "h" heresies and large "H" heresies. Historically, large "H" heresies have been called "damnable heresies". The Apostle Peter describes such heresies:

    2 Peter 2:1 1 But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves.

    We need to exercise extreme caution and not levy anathemas against those things scripture does not condemn. On the other hand, we should not overlook destructive teachings that could lead someone down the path of destruction.
     
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  8. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    Yes...people like John Shelby Spong who is still active in my area....a danger to orthodoxy
     
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  9. Darrell C

    Darrell C Well-Known Member
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    Heloo JoChris, this statement of yours is a great statement that examples why so many in the Catholic Church...are in the Catholic Church.

    They are in the same boat as you were, which was one of being indoctrinated into what was taught. So one issue we should consider is that many are going to be brought up in the Catholic Church and take it for granted that the spiritual leadership they are under is properly teaching that which they need to know. While we should, I feel, have compassion for the indoctrinated, this does not excuse them from learning about God...on their own. It's hard for me to think that the Lord does not minister conviction upon those in religious organizations who are exposed to Scripture itself, that they read Scripture themselves and learn of God.

    So yes, we can blame the organization/s for their teachings, but we must also consider why it is more people don't read their Bibles and challenge the leadership they are under (if it is teaching error).

    I would also say that while there is certainly that which we would have no trouble calling heresy taught in the Catholic Church (and this would go for SDA as well), something else we must consider is the wide range of believers among them, knowing there are those who are conservative on up to the fanatical radical big haticals (lol). I've talked with Catholics who are by far more conservative in their views than some of the protestant and evangelical believers I have talked to. They do not embrace everything the Catholic Church teaches, and the fact is, most protestant and evangelical believers can be seen not to embrace everything their particular group teaches either.

    Third, I think there is a tendency to caricaturize other groups, and assume that they embrace...what the opposing side says they believe.

    And what I mean by that could be exampled in "the worship of Mary." not all Catholics view worshiping Mary as what is taught by the Catholic Church, and which side is wrong (the doctrine of Catholicism or the adherent) is always, always a subject open for debate, lol.

    So what is the answer? First, try to educate ourselves as to what it is Scripture teaches. Second, educate ourselves as to what it is we believe, based on those Scriptures. Third, educate ourselves as to what it is our antagonist believes specifically (as opposed to assuming they embrace and endorse doctrines we perceive them to). And finally, seek to educate our antagonist as to what the Bible actually teaches.

    Most groups have a common ground with the 66 book canon of Scripture, and regardless of whether they embrace other "holy writings" with the 66 Books of the Bible, they should still acknowledge that what is in there is inspired and trustworthy (and if they are of the sort that denies the veracity of Scripture, you have an entirely different discussion ahead of you), so start there, and examine doctrines you might feel in error according to what you both agree is the Word of God.

    I do not recommend mounting campaigns against "false religions" unprepared, because if one doesn't know Scripture to begin with, then we have only one religious person seeking to attack another. When it should be about a genuine concern for lost souls.


    God bless.
     
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  10. Felipe Rios

    Felipe Rios Member

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    I agree with you but unfortunately nowadays people use that word very loosely.
     
  11. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    BOTH the church of Rome and the Sda teach and hold to doctrines that deny the real Gospel, and would not be able to lead a sinner to salvation in Christ if not for the grace of God working despite their teachings!
     
  12. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    The Councilof trent is still officially the teaching of the catholic Church, and it repudiates the Gospel of Jesus, especially as regarding the Pauline Justification aspect, and the Sda denies that one is saved by faith alone grace alone, as we MUST also keep Sabbath and view Ellen White as a real inspirit Prophet of God!
     
  13. Darrell C

    Darrell C Well-Known Member
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    Nothing "repudiates the Gospel of Jesus Christ." Not really. There are many in Protestant and Evangelicals who also butcher the Gospel as well. So regardless off who it is making a mess of things, be ready to counter with a strong and sound Gospel that is based on the Word. Doesn't matter hw long one has been wrong, if they're wrong, they're wrong, lol.


    Yeah, well, that's a subject open for debate. I do not embrace the Doctrine of Justification as many in Protestant circles hold to as a concept.

    I distinguish, for example, between Abraham being justified by grace through faith alone, and being justified by the Blood of Christ.


    And the sad fact is so do most. Not openly, of course, but when we examine their doctrine there is really no difference between saying "one must have works" and equating the Sacrifice of Christ with the sacrifices of the Law, which is what most do because they view the "salvation" of the Old Testament Saint as identical to that enjoyed by those under New Covenant Provision.

    The Old Testament Saint was justified, just as Paul examples with Abraham...through faith. The Old Testament Saint was also justified, just as James examples...through works.

    But if you bring that into a New Covenant context you are just as bad as the Catholic that thinks one must be "saved by faith and works."

    And it is more important to me to talk with those who are closer to my own views than mounting a campaign against the innumerable false religions of the world. I would also say that I believe there are enough nominal Catholics who are just ignorant of Catholic Doctrine to actually be saved, because they are placing their faith first and foremost in Jesus Christ as their Savior, and that is how we are saved, not by being flawless in our doctrine.

    Every group has its problems.


    That is their right:


    Colossians 2:16
    King James Version (KJV)

    16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:



    And in point of fact if they believe that, they had better well keep it, because if they violate what they think they are supposed to do, then do they sin.

    But let me again say this: many of the people who think they have to keep the Sabbath are under leadership which has taught them this is what God expects, and there is no reason why any of them cannot simply read the Bible for themselves and understand God's will for their lives better. The greater condemnation is on those who teach it...


    James 3:1
    King James Version (KJV)

    3 My brethren, be not many masters, knowing that we shall receive the greater condemnation.



    ...but, again, every believer has a responsibility to understand the Word of God themselves. Others cannot "believe" for us, and sadly, many simply adopt the faith of someone else, rather than cultivating their own faith and relationship with Christ.


    Again, sometimes some of the funky things others believe isn't completely unbelievable. We see "prophetesses" in Scripture, so that someone claims to be a prophetess in the minds of some is going to be plausible. Charismatics often have "prophetesses." But, what is disturbing is when they buy into something like that and what is "prophesied" is total garbage and in conflict with God's Word. Now, we can view them as morons, but we don't have to share that particular bit of information with them, right? What we can share is dialogue as to why we view their beliefs to contain error, and hopefully, the Spirit of God will bring conviction.


    God bless.
     
  14. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Both churches hold to another Gospel, and what did the Apostle Paul say concerning those who taught a contrary Gospel message?
     
  15. Darrell C

    Darrell C Well-Known Member
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    You tell me, Yeshua!, but I want the Scripture quoted.


    God bless.
     
  16. JonC

    JonC Lifelong Disciple
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    I would have to say that anything I disagree with would be a heresy. I am, after all, the standard when it comes to these things. I've made a few exceptions for friends and am offering - for a limited time - unorthodox offset packages (formerly called heresy indulgences).

    The Silver package (basic orthodoxizing package) starts at $19 and covers 2 minor and 1 major doctrine.

    The Gold package is $39 and is the same as the silver but includes a prayer cloth.

    The Platinum package is $49 and is the same as the silver but includes exceptions for hyper-Calvinistic tendencies and anti-Calvinistic rantings.
     
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  17. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Just read the RCC view of the Pauline Justification of the Gospel, they totally rejected that view, and so go under label of teaching another Gospel
    Sda states that one MUST be a Sabbath keeper to keep salavtion, can lose it, and see Ellen White as being a true Prophet of the Lord, who had additional revelations given to her by God
    Another Gospel, another salvation, that really can save none in and by themselves!
     
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  18. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    You forgot the Diamond edition, that covers for Charasmatic chaos, false modern Apostles/Prophets!
     
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  19. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    Isn’t that true of any who are truly saved?
     
  20. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    Where is the free offer?

    Without a freeby, the mailing list won’t be filled with folks “led” to buy products, later.

    Offer that dry oak leaf as representing the dry wood of Calvary, and include that poem by Colin Moffett, “The Tree for the Cross,” so that folks can put it up as a daily reminder to follow what Paul said to gather and send it to you.

    Be sure to were a fedora, smoke a big cigar, and show off horses.

    Oops, wrong guy.

    :)
     
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