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Featured Who changed the sabbath?

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by Jason1, Jun 24, 2017.

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  1. MennoSota

    MennoSota Well-Known Member
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    You are dodging the question.

    How will you be saved when the law is the witness that condemns you when you stand before YHWH?
     
  2. Jason1

    Jason1 Member

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    Its putting things in correct perspective.

    Tit 2:14 who gave Himself for us, to redeem us from all lawlessness and to cleanse for Himself a people, His own possession, ardent for good works.
    Col 1:14 in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins,
    Eph_1:7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

    So how about you when we read this:

    Heb 10:26 For if we sin purposely after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a slaughter offering for sins,
    Heb 10:27 but some fearsome anticipation of judgment, and a fierce fire which is about to consume the opponents.
    Heb 10:28 Anyone who has disregarded the Torah of Mosheh dies without compassion on the witness of two or three witnesses.
    Heb 10:29 How much worse punishment do you think shall he deserve who has trampled the Son of Elohim underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was set apart as common, and insulted the Spirit of favour?
    Heb 10:30 For we know Him who has said, “Vengeance is Mine, I shall repay, says יהוה.” And again, “יהוה shall judge His people.”
    Heb 10:31 It is fearsome to fall into the hands of the living Elohim.
     
  3. MennoSota

    MennoSota Well-Known Member
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    Like the Judaisers, you want to add works. Let's look at Hebrews 10, because the passage exposes you as the person who is fallen.

    Notice that it is Jesus sacrifice, once and for all, that redeems us.
    Notice that sacrifice, forever makes perfect, those whom Jesus has redeemed. Notice that God never remembers our lawless deeds. We are forgiven.

    Got it? Good.

    Now look.

    Now that you know this and know about God's forgiveness. Don't reject it and keep sinning by trying to be saved by works. Salvation and forgiveness have been given. If you reject this truth you have nothing but God's terrible judgment and raging fire to look forward to.

    Jason, the very chapter, Hebrews 10, condemns you and tells you that you are going to hell. You are a Judaizer who is rejecting grace and forgiveness in an attempt to save yourself by good works.

    You dangle by a thread over the flames of hell. Everyone here sees you dangling. It's like a suspense movie. We all hope you will be saved by God's grace. Yet we see you struggle by your own futile attempts as the thread grows hotter. Will you not trust God to fully redeem you as Hebrews 10 tells you He does?

    Hebrews 10:8-10,12,14-31
    [8]First, Christ said, “You did not want animal sacrifices or sin offerings or burnt offerings or other offerings for sin, nor were you pleased with them” (though they are required by the law of Moses).
    [9]Then he said, “Look, I have come to do your will.” He cancels the first covenant in order to put the second into effect.
    [10]For God’s will was for us to be made holy by the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ, once for all time.
    [12]But our High Priest offered himself to God as a single sacrifice for sins, good for all time. Then he sat down in the place of honor at God’s right hand.
    [14]For by that one offering he forever made perfect those who are being made holy.
    [15]And the Holy Spirit also testifies that this is so. For he says,
    [16]“This is the new covenant I will make with my people on that day, says the lord: I will put my laws in their hearts, and I will write them on their minds.”
    [17]Then he says, “I will never again remember their sins and lawless deeds.”
    [18]And when sins have been forgiven, there is no need to offer any more sacrifices.
    [19]And so, dear brothers and sisters, we can boldly enter heaven’s Most Holy Place because of the blood of Jesus.
    [20]By his death, Jesus opened a new and life-giving way through the curtain into the Most Holy Place.
    [21]And since we have a great High Priest who rules over God’s house,
    [22]let us go right into the presence of God with sincere hearts fully trusting him. For our guilty consciences have been sprinkled with Christ’s blood to make us clean, and our bodies have been washed with pure water.
    [23]Let us hold tightly without wavering to the hope we affirm, for God can be trusted to keep his promise.
    [24]Let us think of ways to motivate one another to acts of love and good works.
    [25]And let us not neglect our meeting together, as some people do, but encourage one another, especially now that the day of his return is drawing near.
    [26]Dear friends, if we deliberately continue sinning after we have received knowledge of the truth, there is no longer any sacrifice that will cover these sins.
    [27]There is only the terrible expectation of God’s judgment and the raging fire that will consume his enemies.
    [28]For anyone who refused to obey the law of Moses was put to death without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses.
    [29]Just think how much worse the punishment will be for those who have trampled on the Son of God, and have treated the blood of the covenant, which made us holy, as if it were common and unholy, and have insulted and disdained the Holy Spirit who brings God’s mercy to us.
    [30]For we know the one who said, “I will take revenge. I will pay them back.”He also said, “The lord will judge his own people.”
    [31]It is a terrible thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
     
  4. Jason1

    Jason1 Member

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    You still have absolutely no idea what a judaiser is. They are about adhering to works of man and additions or subtractions of scripture.

    Obedience is required indeed. Do you think the message repentance was all garbage that every prophet including Yeshua preached? It is the most wrong headed move someone could make saying that disobedience will save you more than obedience, lol.
     
  5. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    True - amen! My Bible has 66 books in it ... not just 27 or just 23.

    Very true.

    "This IS the Covenant I will make ... I will write My LAW on their heart and mind" -- unchanged in Hebrews 8:6-10 from its Jeremiah 31:31-33.

    Nice that we can agree on something.

    No one claims that God's Commandments have power to save - only the Gospel does. The reason we do not take God's name in vain is not because we want to be saved-by-works-not-by-Gospel. An obvious detail that everyone gets.

    ... AND YET "this IS the Love of God that we KEEP His Commandments" John 5:2-3

    1 John 2:1 "These things I write that you sin NOT"
    1 John 3:4 "sin IS transgression of the LAW"

    Romans 6 is an entire chapter explaining the point that those released from the condemnation of the Law are not to be slaves to law-breaking sinning.

    Romans 8:4-10 says that wicked "do not submit to the Law of God - neither indeed CAN they" as contrasted to the saints who walk in obedience via the power of the Holy Spirit.

    Rom 3:31 "do we then make VOID the Law of God by our faith? God forbid! In fact we ESTABLISH the LAW"

    Hopefully you figured out the flaw in that logic before considering whether to take God's name in vain as a Christian.
     
  6. MennoSota

    MennoSota Well-Known Member
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    I know exactly what a Judaizer is. I'm corresponding with one and quoting him in my response.

    Jason, you have created your own oral law, which you determine must be followed in order for God to redeem a person. You pick and choose from the law and emphasize the laws you think you might be able to follow, but you reject all the laws you say you can't follow at the moment. You are the scribe and Pharisee that dictates the meaning of the law to others and then declares that only by following those dictates can anyone have right standing with God.

    You are the failed person in Hebrews 10 who has no hope.

    You dangle by a thread over the flames of hell while we, the adopted children of YHWH watch and pray that our Father might extend His hand before you drop in...just as He extended His hand to save us as we dangled by our own thread.

    Oh how I wish you could see the perilous position you are in.
     
  7. Jason1

    Jason1 Member

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    Dude, your Pauling/Marcion only position is heretical. Read all of the scriptures to get the whole story.
     
  8. MennoSota

    MennoSota Well-Known Member
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    I have said enough. My sandals are dusted off. I leave you to your death.
     
  9. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    The NT has NO verses that tell us that the church is now still under the sabbath, rather, we are now under the Lord's day!
     
  10. Jason1

    Jason1 Member

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    That's utterly ridiculous. The new testament wasn't designed to give new laws or take away old ones.

    The "Lord's Day" is a day of wrath, anger, and judgment. Is that what you want to keep? There was no transformation to the catholic sunday sabbath and the scriptures have been twisted.
     
  11. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    We are now not under the law, so no saturday Sabbath required, as early christian observed that day as the Lord's day Sunday!
     
  12. Jason1

    Jason1 Member

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    Haven't you already said this long ago, yet you keep attacking the messengers of righteousness? (Repent and obey - the gospel). Quit eating the seed already (the word).
     
  13. Alcott

    Alcott Well-Known Member
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    It sure ain't nuthin I want to lose.
     
  14. Jason1

    Jason1 Member

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    Amo_5:18 Woe unto you that desire the day of the LORD! to what end is it for you? the day of the LORD is darkness, and not light.
     
  15. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    The day of the Lord refers tot he time of judgement, but the Lord's day is the celebration of the day Jesus raised from dead, Sunday!
     
  16. Jason1

    Jason1 Member

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    Rev 1:10 I came to be in the Spirit on the Day of יהוה, and I heard behind me a loud voice, as of a trumpet,

    The "Lord's Day" and "Day of the Lord" are the same thing. The Rev verse has been twisted by the churches to mean something it was not intended to mean.

    The 7th day sabbath is, and will continue to be the day of rest. Check this one out:

    Mat_12:8 “For the Son of Aḏam is Master of the Sabbath.” ​
     
  17. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Man was not created for the Sabbath, but Sabbath for man, and Jesus kept the Law, but now under grace, and NO scripture placethe church under the OT sabbath!
     
  18. Jason1

    Jason1 Member

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    We were always under grace from the beginning.

    Scripture places all His people under the commandment of the sabbath. Read all 10
     
  19. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Except that Jesus fulfilled the Law, and so we are no longer under that sabbath day, as now on the Lord's Day!
     
  20. Jason1

    Jason1 Member

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    He never ended the law. If you think so, then you're following a lawless, sinful Jesus who can't do anything for you except lead you to hell.
     
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