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Why I stopped being a Baptacostalist

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Yeshua1, Jan 24, 2020.

  1. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    The Lord saved me by His grace and mercy while in college, and started to attend an assemblies of god church then. Went to their Institute, became trained in their way to view biblical doctrines, and was a teaching Elder over 10 years.

    The same time when the Lord was delaing with my views on sotierology,he was also showing me in the scriptures that how they viewed especially acts was wrong, as that was a historical record of the transition age from Old to New testament, so not a manual on how to do theology for today!
     
  2. JonC

    JonC Lifelong Disciple
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    To be clear - the gospel that saved you was not Calvinism but the gospel of Christ as taught in the Assemblies of God Church?
     
  3. JonC

    JonC Lifelong Disciple
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    Also, I am not very familiar with the Assemblies of God. Are they Wesleyan Arminanism?
     
  4. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    They both taught the same Gospel, in the sense we are lost sinners, Jesus died for us, place faith in Him to get saved, but the differences between just what was happening between God and me to get me to that point was different....
     
  5. JonC

    JonC Lifelong Disciple
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    So the gospel was the same but the understanding of aspects were different?
     
  6. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    They are supposed to be Wesleyan Arminian, but most A.G. pastors I know believe in true total depravity. That would put them closer to classical than Wesleyan.
     
  7. Aaron

    Aaron Member
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    Let's be very clear. No doctrine saves. It is a Person that saves, and that Person can and does reach through a veritable bulwark of errors and corruptions that heap up in the teachings about Him. There are elect in the Catholic and Anglican and Orthodox churches, and there are elect in the Protestant and Evangelical churches, and even in Charismania.

    But no doctrine is equal. Jesus is the Truth. The Bible is the truth about the Truth. Calvinism is the truth about the truth about the Truth. Noncalvinist doctrines are lesser truths about the truth about the Truth. In fact, they err in the central truth about what it was that Christ actually did on the Cross. Regardless, the Savior, the Person Who saves, saves despite the leaven that has been added to the lump. If He didn't, no one could be saved.
     
  8. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    The message of Jesus being very God and very man, died for the sins of His people, rose again to justify them, that would be the same, but the actual process used by God in those would be different! AOG universal atonement, Calvinist Limited, AG classic Arminian theology in regards to salvation proper etc!
     
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  9. JonC

    JonC Lifelong Disciple
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    So would it be fair to say different understandings of the same Gospel?
     
  10. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    No, any and all are indeed saved by the Gospel of salvation expressed by Calvinists/Reformed. but the AOG and other non cal churches use the same terminology, but do invest it with different meanings!

    The Holy Spirit still takes the Gospel regardless of AOG or Baptist, as He makes sure the Elect understand what it really is being meant when preached!
     
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  11. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    They do have the holiness views of say the Wesleyan/Nazareth churches as in regards to sanctification, but classic Arminian in regards to sotierology.
     
  12. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Very good way to express it, as Spurgeon himself stated "Calvinism is the gospel", as meaning that it explained closest to what the Bible teaches on the process of salvation.
     
  13. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    same Gospel as in the Bible, but different understandings of the actual salvation process!
     
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  14. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    I came close to becoming a C but i still felt a bit uncomfortable being in the 'IN" group.
    there had been a definite change after my rebirth and that is what i sought - people filled with the Spirit.

    So i had/was developing own personal doctrinal creed (undecided C or A) checklist - first criteria, then fruit of the Spirit second criteria and has served me well these years. All Baptist. :)
     
  15. Maverick

    Maverick Member

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    I was asked to reply here. I have not been on here in a long time. I am a Bapticostal. Indeed, AG is really Baptist+. I have never heard my current pastor ever preach a sermon that would not be well received in a Baptist church. Indeed, I could take him to 99.9% of Baptist churches and pulpit committees would be trying to steal him until they spoke about the gifts. That said,

    First, I am neither Calvinist nor Arminian as both blew it in some areas. This I am a Calamin or I prefer to say that I am a Biblicist and let dead theologians rest in peace or at least these two who have caused more division in the Body than Origen or other major heretics. If I had a time tunnel I would go back and snatch both of them as babies and take them back to Moses.

    Second, I was a full body tat Independent Fighting Fundamental Baptist for 42 years with a five year gig as an Asst. Pastor in a BGCT SBC church. I was fed up with the IFBs and tried that. I suspect I would make most of you here look like flaming Liberals in comparison as I think Salty would bear me witness. I was a full fledged cessationist.

    Third, I am still more Baptist than many who have the name, but are as Liberal as Bernie or members who have no clue why they are a Baptist let alone the doctrinal statement of the church they have been members for many years. Somewhat like the lady I met on visitation that thought Martin Luther King started the Lutheran church.

    Fourth, while there are loonies in the Charismatic/Pentecostal movement you cannot lump them together like John MacArthur. Indeed, you should read the response to his book. https://www.amazon.com/Authentic-Fire-Response-MacArthurs-Strange/dp/1629984558

    Fifth, I changed my position when I was boning up and researching to tear up a tongues speaker. In the process, I found out that one of our main passages to militate against the gifts was not saying what I was taught. Has That Which Is Perfect Come As I have re-read the Word without the Baptist bias I have found that we have hindered the Spirit by our theology and that is why we do not see some of the things our Pentecostal brethren see.

    SIxth, at times the problem is terminology. When you get a sermon who do you get it from? Hopefully, the Spirit. When you are counseling someone and ask a question because you have a feeling at what the the core issue is and that is called a word of wisdom. When you say something profound from the pulpit that was not in your sermon workup it was a word of knowledge especially when someone comes forward to be saved because of that spontaneous inclusion.

    Seventh, I don't believe they have everything correct just like Baptists do not have everything right or we would not be splitting all the time or having dictator pastors or members that say "if the pastor says that white wall is black, I am going to believe him." I asked that deacon what flavor Kool-Aid did he want with his cyanide.

    Finally, it would seem rational that as we are transitioning from the Church Age to the 70th week of Daniel that we would see some increase in the amount of signs and miracles to bring Jews into position to be saved since we have sucked at Jewish evangelism by keeping so much of Catholicism in the churches that came out of the Reformation including anti-Semitism. There is nothing that says the days of Acts were ever over. Take off your glasses and allow the Holy Spirit who wrote it to interpret it for you. Avoid the New Age stuff, the Kundalini spirit and whatever those Matthew 7:21-25 got, but don't put leg irons and handcuffs on the Holy Spirit. Indeed, you may well be grieiving, quenching and resisting Him and that is why yur churches are splitting and dying. I do not have time to get into a long term debate. I only responded by request as I know how well this would go over. Like that old TV show lad "I said my piece. I had my say." May God bring us all into wisdom and fullness in the Spirit!
     
  16. Aaron

    Aaron Member
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    Fair to say better and worse understandings.
     
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