1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Featured Faith plus right beliefs

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by Michael Wrenn, Jun 9, 2012.

?
  1. Those who hold to faith alone in Jesus

    45.5%
  2. Those who hold to faith in Jesus plus works

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. Those who hold to faith in Jesus plus right beliefs

    18.2%
  4. Baptists only who believe as I do

    9.1%
  5. Anyone who has faith in Jesus -- Catholic, Orthodox, Anglican, etc.

    36.4%
Multiple votes are allowed.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. DHK

    DHK <b>Moderator</b>

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2000
    Messages:
    37,982
    Likes Received:
    137
    Under Protestant he listed:
     
  2. DHK

    DHK <b>Moderator</b>

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2000
    Messages:
    37,982
    Likes Received:
    137
    You started this thread and just a very few religions, none of which preached the gospel.
    If you read books on cults they are classified as a cult. You are entitled to your opinion, but you are wrong.
    Neither of us live in Africa. Your point is moot.
    The Anglican Church in the U.S., Canada, and Britain, are similar to the Catholic Church. One will not find the gospel being preached there. I have been to those nations. I don't frequent Africa.
    Jesus is not the sole object of their faith. Baptism is. If Jesus were the sole object of their faith it would be a different matter, but they make baptism part of the object of their faith by making it a requirement of salvation, and therefore cannot be saved as long as they believe that. It is Jesus alone that saves, not baptism. This religion is a cult.
    Baptism doesn't save. If you believe in that superstition, rather than Jesus saves, then you cannot be saved. It is either one or the other. You cannot believe both.
    You are naive to think that there are only 8 denominations.
    And you are just as naive to think that all the world can be characterized by just the three or four that you started this thread with.
    That is not making it easy on anyone. It is posting a lie.
     
  3. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Aren't Anglicans though like reformed, as they see it as NOT bestowing grace merits as the RCC, but as a sacrament that those saved need to partake of?
    they see spiritual presense of Christ through it, but NOT as RCC do, more akin to reformed like presby?
     
  4. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    good question!

    remembering that individuals within churches such as RCC and CoC can and are still saved despite the group false teachings, due to the Grace of God...

    Would see it as being churches/groups that have the Gospel, but add distinctive doctrines that may/may not be accurate to the Bible...

    Such as presby with view on infant baptism, Assemblies of god with "baptism in holy Spirit", various nazenene/Westlyn 'holiness" views...

    Those churches adhere to saved by faith and grace alone in cross and person of jesus, but add distinct docttrines...

    RCC/CoC/JesusOnly have different Gospel, faith and works, also have distinctive doctrines, but difference is their Gospel itself flawed!

    And I see cals/Arms as BOTH part of the Body of Christ, so churches call fall either side of that dispute, as long as teaching real christ and saved by grace/faith alone!
     
  5. Michael Wrenn

    Michael Wrenn New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2000
    Messages:
    4,319
    Likes Received:
    0
    Yes, I understand that.

    And I'm not accusing anyone. This whole thing started when it was being claimed that faith plus works is false doctrine and anyone believing that was not saved. I countered by then asking if adding right belief to faith was not also false doctrine since it contradicts faith alone.

    Consigning millions of people to hell because they are wrong in one or more beliefs is a gross and tragic error.
     
  6. Michael Wrenn

    Michael Wrenn New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2000
    Messages:
    4,319
    Likes Received:
    0
     
  7. Michael Wrenn

    Michael Wrenn New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2000
    Messages:
    4,319
    Likes Received:
    0
    Thank you for a good post. I might not agree completely, but you do show discernment about the issue.
     
  8. DHK

    DHK <b>Moderator</b>

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2000
    Messages:
    37,982
    Likes Received:
    137
     
  9. menageriekeeper

    menageriekeeper Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2004
    Messages:
    7,152
    Likes Received:
    0
    I'm going to take a stab at this since I'm attending an Episcopal church at the moment. They do not preach faith + anything. They preach Christ alone and the sacraments of baptism, communion etc, are to remind us of whose we are and our responsibilities to the One who bought us.

    On infant baptism: I've attended just one. There was little difference between it and a Baptist baby dedication except that little trickle of water over the babe's head. The liturgy that was read, the prayers that were said, all pointed to the responsibility of those surrounding the baby to raise it to Christ until she was old enough to make her own decision/commitment. Nothing was said about the child's salvation being complete by the baptism. Not.one.word.
     
  10. Steadfast Fred

    Steadfast Fred Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2009
    Messages:
    1,983
    Likes Received:
    1
    The archbishop questions God's Holy Word. God's Holy Word declares that we are saved by grace through faith and that not of ourselves. It is the gift of God, not of works lest any man should boast.

    The archbishop states that grace plus works is not a false doctrine.

    Scripture declares that Jesus is the only one that can give eternal life.

    The archbishop says one does not need a right belief to obtain Salvation.

    Obviously the archbishop is confused as to what merits Salvation and what does not.
     
  11. Michael Wrenn

    Michael Wrenn New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2000
    Messages:
    4,319
    Likes Received:
    0
    I was going to answer in-text, but it is difficult to do it that way considering your post. So, I will try to answer this way and hope I don't leave something out.

    So even though you say Anglicans are going to hell, you just mean American Anglicans. :laugh:

    The Churches of Christ come from the Restoration Movement -- not a cult.

    It was you who consigned millions of Christians to hell by posting the list that you did. Do I need to quote you again?

    There are 8 denominational families -- not 8 denominations, but eight families, so not a lie.

    Difference between you and me is that I believe that a person can have a wrong understanding of baptism and be saved as long as they have faith in Jesus. You believe they cannot because you require faith plus right belief, thus you go against faith alone just as you accuse others of doing. Some hold to faith plus baptism as necessary to salvation, others faith plus works, and you, faith plus right belief; you have all denied the truth.
     
  12. DHK

    DHK <b>Moderator</b>

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2000
    Messages:
    37,982
    Likes Received:
    137
    There is so little difference between Anglican and Catholic that there is a movement for them to join back together again. If you remember the split was caused mostly because Henry VIII wanted a divorce and the RCC wouldn't allow it. So he split the church so he could have a divorce that would be recognized by "the church." There is little difference.
     
  13. DHK

    DHK <b>Moderator</b>

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2000
    Messages:
    37,982
    Likes Received:
    137
    No, I cannot comment on something I don't know about. Unlike you I am not going to comment out of ignorance. I haven't been to Africa. Have you? Why would you make assumptions about something you know nothing about?
    They are a cult. Again, you know little about the COC. That is evident from your posts. If you knew about them you wouldn't post like this. How about if I tell you that you can't be saved unless you are baptized by a COC minister who was in turn baptized by a COC minister. And you cannot remain saved unless you remain in the COC. Now does that sound like a cult?
    People will go to hell if they don't know and believe the gospel. Do you need Scripture?

    1 Corinthians 1:18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.
    1 Corinthians 1:23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;
    1 Corinthians 2:2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.

    Unless you believe Christ and him alone you cannot be saved. Any other gospel is foolishness to the unsaved.
    I referred you to that website to show you how many religions there really were, not because that man was really correct. Every denomination under "Protestantism" is still a denomination. I don't care about your denominational families. I have nothing in common with the Oneness Pentecostal or the United Church, both of which are either extreme cults or apostate churches. They Oneness Pentecostal requires that you both be baptized and speak in tongues in order to be saved. The United Church denies the very fundamentals of our faith like the resurrection of Christ, a literal heaven and hell, the deity of Christ, etc. I have nothing in common with those. The United Church here in the city that I live in, yesterday, held a "unity service" in special commemoration for all the gays living in the city. They wanted to celebrate the gay community. I have nothing in common with this church. But you say you do. Well good for you!! I am happy for you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    People in the above churches don't even believe in Jesus.
    In the other church they trust in sign gifts that ceased long ago, and in their baptism to save them. That is not salvation!! They have a different Jesus.
    Their Jesus is not the Jesus of the Bible. Like Benny Hinn, they believe that each person of the trinity has also 3 parts to it, thus making the trinity out of 9 total personnages. They worship a different Jesus. Yes, doctrine is important.
    No, I don't deny the truth. Salvation is by grace through faith, and not of works. Check Eph.2:8,9. I believe what the Bible teaches, not the cults.
     
  14. Steadfast Fred

    Steadfast Fred Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2009
    Messages:
    1,983
    Likes Received:
    1
    One need only look at the archbishops website and his personal beliefs to realize that he is preaching a false doctrine and to be rejected.
     
  15. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    is he preaching the "official" teaching though of the Anglican church?

    JI packer is one of them, aren't there conservative members/groups within their ranks?
     
  16. Fred's Wife

    Fred's Wife Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2010
    Messages:
    501
    Likes Received:
    0
    He is not "Anglican"...he belongs to the "Celtic Anabaptist Communion"...very ecumenical. Check out the website that was posted on the Primitive Baptists thread.
     
  17. Michael Wrenn

    Michael Wrenn New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2000
    Messages:
    4,319
    Likes Received:
    0
    Shows your ignorance of Anglicanism. Anglicanism contains many different theologies -- Lutheran, Calvinist, Arminian, Eastern Orthodox, Anglo-Catholic (RC elements), Zwinglian, Holiness, Celtic.
     
  18. Michael Wrenn

    Michael Wrenn New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2000
    Messages:
    4,319
    Likes Received:
    0
    Well, you've distorted my position so badly that I don't know where to start.

    I know exactly what the Church of Christ believes because I have thoroughly studied the Restoration Movement.

    I have nothing in common with any "church" that approves of homosexuality; they have denied the faith. You know how I feel about that, so don't say I approve of something when you know I do not.

    Yes, doctrine is important; I never said it wasn't. And there is false doctrine of course. I consider that Calvinism is false doctrine and that Baptist who hold to it are holding to false doctrine. But if they have accepted Jesus as their Lord and Savior, they are saved and not going to hell.

    We are ignorant of many things; we are often wrong; we see through a glass darkly. I will not consign millions of people to hell for having wrong beliefs. If people go to hell for having wrong beliefs, even though they have accepted Jesus by faith, then nobody will be in heaven -- not you, not me, not anybody because no one has 100% right beliefs.
     
  19. Michael Wrenn

    Michael Wrenn New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2000
    Messages:
    4,319
    Likes Received:
    0
    My doctrine is not false; I affirm Christian orthodoxy.

    But PLEASE reject me! I have no wish to have any association with the likes of you.

    I wish you would stop responding to me, and stay out of the threads I start. Your sole purpose for posting is evident. You are despicable.
     
    #79 Michael Wrenn, Jun 11, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 11, 2012
  20. Michael Wrenn

    Michael Wrenn New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2000
    Messages:
    4,319
    Likes Received:
    0
    First of all, I/we are not Anglican.

    Certainly there are conservative Anglicans. And there are continuing Anglican groups like the recently formed Anglican Church of North America and Anglican Mission in the Americas that are good conservative Anglican jurisdictions.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Loading...