Featured Unbelief....or All Sin?

He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that disbelieveth shall be condemned. Mk 16:16

The problem here is that you all, including Lordship Salvation Puritans such as Icon, read eternal consequences into passages such as this when it's not intended. There is no mention of eternity in heaven or hell here, you people insert it. Christ is referring to 'that generation' of Jews, and the 'damnation' is the incurring of the curses outlined in Lev 26/Dt 28 upon those Jews and their progeny, which are all TEMPORAL consequences, NOT eternal.

Your little finite minds can't even begin to comprehend infinity, yet you all are trigger happy to send folks to hell as if Christ's atonement accomplished nothing.

What is it with 'you people'? Is it that you want to feel vindicated for what you've given up in order to go to heaven? Do you not understand the grace of God?

 

You all remind me of the Queen of Hearts in Alice's Wonderland. Instead of "off with their heads", it's "to hell with them". You divvy out eternal consequences as if you've authority to do so.

 

I do understand what you are putting forth, however, John is not the only place that a distinction is made.

Here is part of the Hebrews 9 passage dealing directly with the question:

15 For this reason He is the mediator of a new covenant, so that, since a death has taken place for the redemption of the transgressions that were committed under the first covenant, those who have been called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance. ...

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Here, Christ is presented as the mediator (see 1 John - the mediator) and it also presents the "redemption of transgressions." It is important to note, that there was NO LIMIT of the "redemption of transgressions" but the statement is merely that the "transgressions that were (committed) under the first covenant" are no longer. They are paid in full. Not just some of the transgressions, but the transgressions. If there was a transgression, it is no longer.

I would remind the readers that the "law" (OT) is a "schoolmaster" (no longer in a position of condemnation) - Romans 2, Galatians 3. The blood of Christ was the redemption of transgressions for the whole "kosmos." One must be very careful not to assign a limit to this "redemption of transgressions," because the writer of Hebrews shows no indication that the application was only to a select few.

THEN the writer makes clear that "those who are called" (good Calvinist the writer must have been) "may receive the promise of eternal inheritance."

Hebrews is clear in this passage - "redemption of transgressions" is made for all, but only "those who are called" gain the eternal inheritance.

Through the rest of Hebrews 9 - 10, the statements of the effectiveness of the sacrifice in comparison to the OT temporary sacrifices, why it is offered only once, and the results of scorning the sacrifice.

At no place in the Hebrews 9 - 10 passage is the "redemption for transgressions" limited to the called. It just isn't there.

What is most certainly evident is the estate of those that would scorn the redemption - that "terrifying expectation of judgment and fury of a fire." Such is appointed not only to those who are believers (works tried by fire) but the adversaries who are not given to believe (according to the Hebrews 9:15).

The "covenant death of Jesus" erased the need for continual sacrifice. No one anywhere, and at any time need to consider that some animal sacrifice will be acceptable in the heavens. If that were not so, then the blood sacrifices would remain as they were in the OT for the unbelievers, and Christ's would be specific and apportioned only to believers.

The blood sacrifice of Christ was not merely potential, but complete (past, done, no longer repeated). That heavenly tabernacle, in which the blood of Christ was offered, did not signify that the offering was only to those chosen. That is clear from Hebrews. Rather, the sacrifice was made. That the sacrifice was not for just believers, but once offered that removed any authoritative sacrifice or even the need for sacrifice from the whole world.

What is also clear in the passage is that only those chosen are given to the blessed eternity, but those not chosen are considered adversaries and appointed to the flames.

I enjoy passages were the Doctrines of Grace are so clear.

 

Mark 16:16 is not the only verse that speaks of eternity. The disciples were not mere Jews. They were disciples of Christ, more accurately known as apostles or Christians. Judaism, as a religion, they had forsaken.

Here is a timeless truth for all eternity applicable to all, not just Nicodemus:
Joh 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
--The "he" is whosoever," as in anyone in the world.

Joh 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

What does everlasting mean? Was the grace of God extended to Judas Iscariot and those who crucified our Lord? Were their sins not only atoned for but was the atonement made available to those wretches who actively refused it?

 

With out doubt ALMOST every phrase of Hebrews 9 and 10 deal with the security of and example of the best sacrifice that could be offered, especially for those called to belief.

However, there is a turn of the phrase in Hebrews 9:15 that (imo) is often missed, misaligned, or misapplied. It is uncomfortable to those who would prevent in some measure the application of the Cross to all humankind, but that uncomfortableness should never be a consideration. The truth of the Scriptures should always be supreme, so look again, and consider. That truth does NOT lead to universalism.

Here is the verse:

15 For this reason He is the mediator of a new covenant, so that, since a death has taken place for the redemption of the transgressions that were committed under the first covenant, those who have been called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance.​

Focus upon this phrase: "...a death has taken place for the redemption of the transgressions that were (committed) under the first covenant..."

Who was "under the first covenant" in which animal sacrifices were obliged? Some may say, well it was the Jews. Then the death was not only for the remnant saved, but for all Jews. What of the gentile's who were also in the outer courts? The death of those sacrifices were also applied to them. What of Jews or gentiles that did not make the journey? The death was for them, too. So, then the death took place "for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first covenant."

What transgressions? The breaking of the ten commandments - or other offenses written by Moses under the guidance of God. That would include (taking Roman's "all have sinned") everyone who has or will ever live. There for, the "redemption of the transgressions" applies to every single person that ever has or will live.

Now to some, they will immediately draw the conclusion that certainly everyone is then saved. NOT!!!

For the very next phrase says, "those who have been called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance." So, then although all sin under the first covenant is indeed redeemed, not all are called, not all are saved.

It is that same principle found in John's writing (John 3, 1 John 2, 1 John 4). The unbelievers are without excuse.

God is just because the lost stand condemned not for sins, but for unbelief. This is found in the picture of the final judgment, too.

What of their sins - are not the lost in flaming torment because of sin? NO!

They are in the flaming torment because of unbelief ("condemned already... John 3). Look further at the statement in John 3:

17 “For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him. 18 “He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. 19 “This is the judgment, that the Light has come into the world, and men loved the darkness rather than the Light, for their deeds were evil. 20 “For everyone who does evil hates the Light, and does not come to the Light for fear that his deeds will be exposed. 21 “But he who practices the truth comes to the Light, so that his deeds may be manifested as having been wrought in God.”
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So, where is the Scriptures state that one is "condemed" because of sin (either one or many)?

Look carefully at this section of Romans 8:

1 Therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death. 3 For what the Law could not do, weak as it was through the flesh, God did: sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and as an offering for sin, He condemned sin in the flesh, 4 so that the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
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See, here it shows no limit placed upon the "offering for sin;" in deed, "He condemned sin in the flesh"
CERTAINLY, believers are the ultimate benefactor ("so that the the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh.")
WHO are the condemned? Those who "walk according to the flesh but (not) according to the Spirit." Why are they condemned? Reread the previous sentence.

Titus 3 says this:

3 For we also once were foolish ourselves, disobedient, deceived, enslaved to various lusts and pleasures, spending our life in malice and envy, hateful, hating one another. 4 But when the kindness of God our Savior and His love for mankind appeared, 5 He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit, 6whom He poured out upon us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior, 7so that being justified by His grace we would be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
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The above shows that the deeds (good or bad) is NOT the basis of condemnation or not. The believers are believers according to HIS mercy.

One final question: What good then is the OT law? Romans 3:24 For the believer, "The Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, so that we may be justified by faith." The law is our tutor, school master, that which points to Christ.

What of the unbeliever? Galatians 3 makes this point:

10 For as many as are of the works of the Law are under a curse; for it is written, “CURSED IS EVERYONE WHO DOES NOT ABIDE BY ALL THINGS WRITTEN IN THE BOOK OF THE LAW, TO PERFORM THEM.”... 12 However, the Law is not of faith; on the contrary, “HE WHO PRACTICES THEM SHALL LIVE BY THEM.” (note: I did not use the caps)
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Galatians goes on to state that those who are not believers are under the law, and must live by that law "condemned" (as John says "already." The law did not condemn, the sin did not condemn, the lack of belief condemned.

1 Corinthians 15 says: " The sting of death is sin, and the power of sin is the law;"

Therefore, the unbelievers are condemned. Law empowers sin, and sin's sting is death - all humankind die believer and unbeliever: The final judgment is belief or unbelief.

Ok, I have shown you enough from more than one writer of Scriptures so you may know some of the evidence that supports my statements.

Do not forget that John uses a different form of the word translated "propitiation" than anywhere else in the NT. It is specific to the blood, and not to the act, or the place. That blood was shed for all humankind, from Adam to the very last one to have a belly button.