Poll: More Than Half of Americans Say Torture OK

[poncho]

Burden of proof to prove what?

CIA Director Michael Hayden confirmed today what ABC news reported months ago…The US waterboarded a grand total of…3 people.

Those subjected to waterboarding were suspected Sept. 11 mastermind Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and senior al Qaeda leaders Abu Zubaydah and Abd al-Rahim al-Nashiri, Hayden said at the hearing on threats to the United States.He said waterboarding has not been used in five years

This is the same Michael Hayden who also stated that the words "probable cause" aren't in the fourth amendment. Correct? I should take the word of a man who obviously can't read plain text?

The "mastermind".

Khalid Sheikh Mohammed. “I was responsible for the 9/11 operation, from A to Z.”

He also "confessed" to planning...a second wave of attacks including, bombings in Ny, Chicago, Washington, London's Heathrow airport, Canary Wharf and the Big Ben tower. He also confessed to being involved in the 1993 attack on the WTC, Richard Reid’s shoe bomb, and the 2002 Bali bombings in Indonesia. He also confessed to planning the assassinations of Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton and Pope John Paul II.

Not to mention the killing of Daniel Pearl...“I decapitated with my blessed right hand the head of the American Jew Daniel Pearl... For those who would like to confirm, there are pictures of me on the Internet holding his head.”

He claimed he confessed to all this without being coerced in any way. Did he lie then? According to you and General Hayden (the man who cannot read plain text) he was coerced. Which is it?

Waterboarding is a form of coercion in case you hadn't realized it. Maybe KSM didn't realize it?

Mastermind indeed! This man confessed in other words to have singlehandedly outwitted a 40 billion dollar US intelligence apparatus.

No small feat. Either the man is a real evil genius or he was telling his tormentors whatever they wanted to hear so they would stop tormenting him. Note, I'm taking you and General Hayden's word that he was tormented because he himself claimed he wasn't. Maybe KSM didn't realize waterboarding is a form of coercion? Seems as though an evil genius such as this would realize that.

He must of been one very busy man. Is there anything he didn't confess to while he wasn't being coerced?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUEBhbF50mM&feature=player_embedded

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SfYov5o5_2s

 

[moscott]

What don't you get? They weren't looking for a confession of things he HAD done---they already knew that. They wanted to know future things he/they had planned as far as attacks against the United States. To gain this info by waterboarding is fine by me----nothing since 9/11 2001. As the famous line from the movie goes:

I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom I provide, then question the manner in which I provide it. I prefer you said thank you, and went on your way, Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon, and stand to post. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you are entitled to!

 

[poncho]

What don't you get? They weren't looking for a confession of things he HAD done---they already knew that. They wanted to know future things he/they had planned as far as attacks against the United States. To gain this info by waterboarding is fine by me----nothing since 9/11 2001. As the famous line from the movie goes:

I don't get the part where you fail to understand that coercing information out of people by using force and brutality most usually leads to worthless information.

What you seem to be suggesting is that we save time by wasting it in order to save lives by putting them in more peril. "That's illogical" as Mr. Spock would say.

Hate to break this to ya but Jack Bauer and "24" is fiction. Not to mention Hollywood/Pentagon propaganda.

 

[moscott]

I don't get the part where you fail to understand that coercing information out of people by using force and brutality most usually leads to worthless information.

What you seem to be suggesting is that we save time by wasting it in order to save lives by putting them in more peril. "That's illogical" as Mr. Spock would say.

Hate to break this to ya but Jack Bauer and "24" is fiction. Not to mention Hollywood/Pentagon propaganda.

"worthless information"---really? worthless? People in L.A. may disagree.
http://www.dakotavoice.com/2009/04/cia-confirms-waterboarding-thwarted-attack-on-los-angeles/

You may not fully know what info was obtained and I may never know either---but 1 thing is irrefutable---we haven't been attacked since these methods have been enforced. You view waterboarding as torture---I don't---we'll never agree on that. So if it ain't broke don't fix it IMO.

 

[LadyEagle]

Since we are on page 3, this thread is closed.

LE