Undocumented immigrants

[freeatlast]

Southern Baptists adopt ‘Gospel response’ toward undocumented immigrants
http://blog.chron.com/believeitorno...ts/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

It is time to get out of the SBC!

 

[FR7 Baptist]

I'm going to stay in the SBC. I love the Southern Baptist Convention even though I disagree with them on this.

I don't see why the Convention is even addressing this as it's not a religious matter. I'm going to express my strong disagreement with the resolution. My Salvadoran grandmother didn't immigrate to the United States lawfully in 1964 so these illegal Mexicans can prance across the border and take our jobs and drive down wages. I say prosecute illegal enterers and deport the illegals, with a very few exceptions, and start throwing employers of illegal aliens in jail.

 

[preachinjesus]

This is a great move by the SBC.

We should be about people not Republican politics. This is a great resolution!

 

[FR7 Baptist]

This is a great move by the SBC.

We should be about people not Republican politics. This is a great resolution!

This isn't a partisan issue. I'm a hardcore Democrat and a social democrat and I recognize our first priority in national policy has to be real Americans and not these foreign people.

 

[billwald]

Good for 51% of the SBC. The dictatorship of the 51% which you all love so well. <G>

 

[StefanM]

I generally agree with the resolution.

RESOLVED, That we ask our governing authorities to implement, with the borders secured, a just and compassionate path to legal status, with appropriate restitutionary measures, for those undocumented immigrants already living in our country.

The bolded portion is essential. Until the borders are secure, any path to legal status will be pointless. After securing the borders, however, we can take a compassionate approach to those already here, including "appropriate restitutionary measures."

 

[carpro]

I'm going to stay in the SBC. I love the Southern Baptist Convention even though I disagree with them on this.

I don't see why the Convention is even addressing this as it's not a religious matter.

Agreed.

What to do, politically, with illegal aliens is not the business of the Church.

 

[poodle78]

Southern Baptists adopt ‘Gospel response’ toward undocumented immigrants
http://blog.chron.com/believeitorno...ts/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

It is time to get out of the SBC!

If the Convention's resolutions were in any way binding, I would agree!!

It certainly was a banner week for the SBC:
1. A resolution for a thinly-veiled amnesty
2. Al Mohler wants to apologize to homosexuals. This is very interesting to me as my pastor thinks Al Mohler walks on water...because he is predestined to do so... (My pastor is the same man who will not use the word 'gay.' His term of choice is 'sodomite.')

We should have condemned man-made global warming and hit the trifecta!!!!

Keep this up and Obama will gladly address our next convention.

 

[freeatlast]

If the Convention's resolutions were in any way binding, I would agree!!

It certainly was a banner week for the SBC:
1. A resolution for a thinly-veiled amnesty
2. Al Mohler wants to apologize to homosexuals. This is very interesting to me as my pastor thinks Al Mohler walks on water...because he is predestined to do so... (My pastor is the same man who will not use the word 'gay.' His term of choice is 'sodomite.')

We should have condemned man-made global warming and hit the trifecta!!!!

Keep this up and Obama will gladly address our next convention.

Do you have a link to where Al Mohler calls for an apology to homosexuals? I know he said that Baptists need to repent in regards to homosexuals, but I would like to read the apology statement if you have it.

 

[poodle78]

Do you have a link to where Al Mohler calls for an apology to homosexuals? I know he said that Baptists need to repent in regards to homosexuals, but I would like to read the apology statement if you have it.

Sorry, I read two articles and they ran together in my mind. Al Mohler did not issue a call for an apology, only for a repentance for homophobia.

It has been a rough week for me in general, but that is no excuse for not having the facts correct.

I apologize and will try to do better in the future. That would not mean, however, that I agree with any comment Mohler made in the body of the article.

To answer you question, though, we probably read the same article from One News Now.

:BangHead:

 

[Ruiz]

Good for 51% of the SBC. The dictatorship of the 51% which you all love so well. <G>

Don't you think this was an ad hominem attack? Not really a logical engagement in the topic.

 

[Ruiz]

Agreed.

What to do, politically, with illegal aliens is not the business of the Church.

Moral issues, which I believe this is, is the business of the Church.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Moral issues, which I believe this is, is the business of the Church.

Is SBC "The Church" now?

 

[Ruiz]

Is SBC "The Church" now?

I would address Carpro, I was using his language and just reiterating his verbiage. The premise he made was whether this was an issue for the church, I affirmed it was.

 

[carpro]

Moral issues, which I believe this is, is the business of the Church.

You believe wrong.

It is a legal issue.

 

[Ruiz]

You believe wrong.

It is a legal issue.

Carpro

See my post in the "illegal Immigrants" section. All law is moral. There is no rational basis for law without morality. Thus, it is imperative that we build on a moral foundation otherwise our laws will become immoral. To separate the two will either lead to extremes like anarchy (no law) or authoritarianism (government is the arbiter of law) but will also be open to abuses.

If you view law as being based upon moral principles, then you hold to the old style common law principles. THeir idea said that a jury first decided if the law was moral, then if the person who violated the law was guilty. The basic structure was that law was first subject to moral judgment. If that is the case, then this is not merely an issue of law, but morality.

I, personally, hold to a common law understanding of law and therefore believe that we should first judge the law on the basis of it being moral.

 

[Salty]

Carpro

All law is moral.

What is the morality of this law?

It is illegal to rob a bank and then shoot at the bank teller with a water pistol.

 

[carpro]

What is the morality of this law?

A better question might be , what exactly is immoral about immigration laws?

I believe Ruiz is reaching, in order to accommodate his own prejudices.

 

[Ruiz]

A better question might be , what exactly is immoral about immigration laws?

I believe Ruiz is reaching, in order to accommodate his own prejudices.

Carpro

No, I am not searching and I would rather you discuss the issues than resort to ad hominem attacks, that just shows your lack of argument.

I noted before and you can read my posts. If you disagree with them, take issue with my rationale. However, I have placed them forward. I do borrow much from my research into the theological opposition to slavery, first relying upon the horrid treatment of people and chauvanism based upon nothing more than skin color. I believe socio-economic principles rely upon those issues as well. People are people no matter their education or socio-economic status. Government is right in keeping out criminals and terrorists, but the limitations they place on immigration is class centered.

 

[Ruiz]

What is the morality of this law?

It is illegal to rob a bank and then shoot at the bank teller with a water pistol.

Salty,

All law are moral in nature. Now some may be immoral or even stupid, but it is based upon someone's morality. Christians can call a law immoral because we have the ultimate standard of morality.

Just because I advocate a moral understanding of law, doesn't mean I agree with all laws. Merely, I believe someone who wrote the law was doing it from a moral direction.