LOL...you gonna pay for that?
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Undocumented immigrants
- Thread starter freeatlast
- Start date
LOL...you gonna pay for that?
dwmoeller1
New Member
As you can see, the legal dictionary agrees with me (see sense 1)
For being an illegal immigrant there is no punishment (in the legal sense) for being an illegal immigrant. If caught your status is assessed and you are returned. No fine, no prison sentence. But, if you are going to broaden the sense of "crime" outside of its legal definition, then by that standard anyone who drives is a criminal since, at one time or another, every driver (I think it safe to say) has gone over the speed limit or in some other way broken some traffic law. So, if one is going to take a broad view of what a criminal is, then you probably fit the bill as well.
dwmoeller1
New Member
For those who have a problem with illegal immigrants and consider them criminals (or some equivalent), here is a simple solution:
- liberalize the immigration laws so that anyone who is not a known criminal or intent on harming US citizens can easily and quickly gain legal status
- grant all illegal immigrants amnesty and full pardon if they go through this process within a specified time period
Problem of illegal immigration all but solved. Unless one has a problem with poor (or Hispanic) immigrants altogether, this should be a perfectly equitable and reasonable solution.
Plus it will let us live up to the ideal of:
"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"
- liberalize the immigration laws so that anyone who is not a known criminal or intent on harming US citizens can easily and quickly gain legal status
- grant all illegal immigrants amnesty and full pardon if they go through this process within a specified time period
Problem of illegal immigration all but solved. Unless one has a problem with poor (or Hispanic) immigrants altogether, this should be a perfectly equitable and reasonable solution.
Plus it will let us live up to the ideal of:
"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"
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If that were the case, the problem would have been "solved" in 1985, or around there, when Ted Kennedy's amnesty went thru.
This is what makes you a partisan hack. Resistance to amnesty being born in racism is such a tired argument.
We HAVE lived up to it, and then some. _
dwmoeller1
New Member
Except that the amnesties you mentioned missed the first and very key point I made - immigration laws were not liberalized to any significant extent. Thus, amnesty was granted without changing the conditions and doing away with the primary motivations driving illegal immigration. It does no good to grant amnesty w/o first addressing the key issues driving it.
But, make legal immigration easy, quick and readily available to all classes of people and you do away with a large motivation for *illegal* immigration.
Hmmmm...and I never voted anything but Republican (ok, so once I voted for the Constitution party)
FWIW, my position on immigration is libertarian, not liberal. I never argued that resistance to amnesty is born in racism. I merely suggested it as one possible motivation (and not even the most prominent). Unless you are going to deny that it is *a* motivation, I can't see your objection.
But while we are on it, what other reasonable objections might one raise about amnesty combined with liberalization of immigration laws?
We have in the past. We no longer do. No immigration is severely restricted, particularly for those the poem describes. We accepted the "huddled masses" from northern and western Europe with basically no restrictions, began protesting and creating restrictions when the "huddled masses" started coming from southern and eastern Europe as well as Asia, now we barely let a trickle of any sort of "huddled masses" in at all.
freeatlast
New Member
If every American is treated as a security threat when they travel then certainly every illegal should be treated with the same seriousness and held to standards and punishments that protect the security of this nation and be rounded up. This should be done by all police and law enforcement including the military.
Here is what should be done with all illegals and those who help them. It should be against the law to rent, hire, or give any assistance to them unless there is some immediate life threatening issue which needs to be addressed but then the illegal is turned in even while receiving treatment. Anyone who violates this should be subject to a mandatory 5 years in prison without parole or good time.
All illegals should be rounded up and put in prison for 5 years no parole or good time if it is their first offence then deported to their home country. If they return they get 10 years no parole or good time and deported. if they return a third time life without parole.
During their time in prison they should work to support the full cost of their sentence and deportation.
If they have children they would be taken and deported back to their home country immediately. All this with no discretion of the courts to give any different sentences.
Every person who is in this country legally on a visa of any kind should be required to wear a monitoring device at their expense during their stay.
Here is what should be done with all illegals and those who help them. It should be against the law to rent, hire, or give any assistance to them unless there is some immediate life threatening issue which needs to be addressed but then the illegal is turned in even while receiving treatment. Anyone who violates this should be subject to a mandatory 5 years in prison without parole or good time.
All illegals should be rounded up and put in prison for 5 years no parole or good time if it is their first offence then deported to their home country. If they return they get 10 years no parole or good time and deported. if they return a third time life without parole.
During their time in prison they should work to support the full cost of their sentence and deportation.
If they have children they would be taken and deported back to their home country immediately. All this with no discretion of the courts to give any different sentences.
Every person who is in this country legally on a visa of any kind should be required to wear a monitoring device at their expense during their stay.
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Like Amercan succeses and other country's failures. When America is no longer attractive, then people will no longer be attracted to it. That is your goal, the leftist democrat/republican pushover position. The libertarian platform is border enforcement. And legal immigration has been steadily increasing since 2008.
Life without parole? You serious? You must be joking.
freeatlast
New Member
Nope I am not joking. If they defy the law the third time they should get life without parole. They would not have to worry about life if they do not violate the law the third time. If they do it is all on their own heads.
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freeatlast
New Member
You did not read my post or you would not have made that statement as it does nto apply in this case.
Catching, incarcarating and deporting are much more expensive than an effective drug interdiction program. If we were not overcome by drug addiction, legal and illegal, the drug cartels would not have free reign from Columbia to the U.S. of A. Key people in high places are bought off all the way from Bogota to the U.S. even though we kept Manuel Noriega in jail about twenty years. He was extradicted to France last year to face(?) money laundering charges. Now what?
Our economy is controlled by crude oil and opium derivatives, legal and illegal.
The love of money is still the root of all evil. We have an insatiable lust of material possessions.
Jesus is still the only remedy for sin.
Some of these illegal aliens with green cards are born again. Now what?
Peace,
Bro. James
Our economy is controlled by crude oil and opium derivatives, legal and illegal.
The love of money is still the root of all evil. We have an insatiable lust of material possessions.
Jesus is still the only remedy for sin.
Some of these illegal aliens with green cards are born again. Now what?
Peace,
Bro. James
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Astonishing that someone bearing the name of Christ would suggest this.
So, you're saying that if Jesus came across a starving, struggling family of illegal immigrants, he'd call the police and tell them how freaking wrong they were? I can't buy that. I believe he would have compassion for them.
If we're refusing to share the gospel (in word and deed), we're a sorry excuse for a Church.
Bob Alkire
New Member
Great, I'm happy that they are saved. Now they should obey the law and go back home and get a green card and come back the correct way according to our law. Right here in town we have many from all over the world who are here correctly, with a green card. I'm not against immigration, just do it the correct way.
freeatlast
New Member
Your statements as to cost are incorrect. Please show some figures to back them up.
If they have a green card they are not illegal. If they are born again and illegal they are still criminals and need to serve time and be deported.
freeatlast
New Member
Like any liberal the only way they have to defend their non Christian view is to twist what is said. I never said what you said. I said if there was a life threatening issue take care of the issue and turn them in also put them n prison and then deport them. If you are really so concerned about sharing the gospel why don't you go to other countries and do it or go into the prisons if you will as they could hear it there.
freeatlast
New Member
AMEN! :thumbs:
Bob Alkire
New Member
I'm all for evangelizing all people which would include undocumented immigrant. I've had many immigrants in my home while they got on their feet which I'm sure many others here have. But they all were here correctly.
The convention ended up adding the clause “this resolution is not to be construed as support for amnesty for any undocumented immigrant.”
http://blog.chron.com/believeitorno...t-resolution-to-help-undocumented-immigrants/
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I do not know about figures. I do know that illegals with or without green cards is a symptom of the problem not the cause. If we spend the money necessary to reduce drug addiction, we may get less oppressed people crossing our borders--illegally. There is also a major market for fraudulent documents in including green cards and birth certificates. Now what? Most employers do not verify authenticity of green cards. This is exploitation of the masses as usual.
The real solution is still preaching Jesus Christ and Him crucified.
Peace,
Bro. James
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