JonC's thread "Reverend" as a title got me thinking about something else I read awhile back, A Pastor with a D. Min. Degree Should Not Be Addressed as "Dr."
Thoughts?
Thoughts?
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"Doctor" as a Title
- Thread starter rlvaughn
- Start date
It's not appropriate to use "Dr." to address someone with a "practitioner's degree"?? Tell that to an American with an M.D., DDS, DVM, etc. British usage is different.
For many years, the beef has been the usage of Dr. for those with a D.D. That was before the D.Min. became a fairly common degree in my sector of the Baptist Galaxy. I see Dr. as a useful way to show respect to a man, who while a pastor (or pastor equivalent), is not your pastor
Examples of pastor equivalents in my life are Evangelist Bill Hall, Fred Moritz, Jerry Tetreau, Bob Jones III, B. Myron Cedarholm, Richard Weeks, M. James Hollowood, et al.
For many years, the beef has been the usage of Dr. for those with a D.D. That was before the D.Min. became a fairly common degree in my sector of the Baptist Galaxy. I see Dr. as a useful way to show respect to a man, who while a pastor (or pastor equivalent), is not your pastor
Examples of pastor equivalents in my life are Evangelist Bill Hall, Fred Moritz, Jerry Tetreau, Bob Jones III, B. Myron Cedarholm, Richard Weeks, M. James Hollowood, et al.
Personally, I usually only use "Dr." in educational contexts. So, for example, if I were to write to Nathan Finn as the Dean of the School of Theology & Missions at Union University I would address him as "Dr. Finn." If I were to introduce him as a speaker at our church, I might say something like "our brother Nathan Finn, who is Dean of the School of Theology & Missions at Union University." If I were to send him an e-mail about Baptist history I would write "Dear Nathan" or "Dear Brother."
The writer seems to apply that principle in certain instances to MDs and JDs.
From your second quote, I believe your source is being a punctilious pendant. It's about custom and usage. MDs get the Dr. and JDs don't. Actually, I think lawyers are waiting to become judges. That way they get the "Your Honor" in the courtroom and Judge outside it.
Whoever wrote that wasn't thinking clearly. There are two types of academic degrees.
Research degrees. Ph.D., Th.D., etc.
Professional degrees. D.Min., MD, DO, etc.
We call a man with the professional degree in medicine (MD) "Doctor."
It seems to me, judging from general practice, that "Doctor" is just as acceptable for a Professional degree as for a Research degree.
However, I also think any title other than "Pastor" is a step down. I believe the calling to be a Pastor is the highest calling God places on mankind.
My congregation didn't call me "Doctor." Some called me "Pastor." Some called me "Tom." Either was acceptable to me.
My students didn't call me "Doctor." Most of them called me "Tom." A few (very few) called me "Professor" or "Prof."
I have never called a lawyer a doctor and have never heard them refer to other lawyers as such.
I have always followed Associated Press style in writing: Doctor is reserved for the healing arts (MD, DO, DVM, DVM, etc.) For a specialized publication, I would use Doctor in accordance with the publication's style.
The local exception has been for clergy in which Doctor may be used as an honorific in place of the Rev., etc. But only one honorific is allowed.
That's in writing. In person, of course, I refer to the president of the local university as doctor, as well as the rest of the faculty with doctorates.
None of that, of course, applies to the question at hand.
For pastors with advanced degrees, I prefer to follow the Geneva Bible (Matthew 23:10-11):
10 Be not called doctors: for one is your doctor, even Christ.
11 But he that is greatest among you, let him be your servant.
I have always followed Associated Press style in writing: Doctor is reserved for the healing arts (MD, DO, DVM, DVM, etc.) For a specialized publication, I would use Doctor in accordance with the publication's style.
The local exception has been for clergy in which Doctor may be used as an honorific in place of the Rev., etc. But only one honorific is allowed.
That's in writing. In person, of course, I refer to the president of the local university as doctor, as well as the rest of the faculty with doctorates.
None of that, of course, applies to the question at hand.
For pastors with advanced degrees, I prefer to follow the Geneva Bible (Matthew 23:10-11):
10 Be not called doctors: for one is your doctor, even Christ.
11 But he that is greatest among you, let him be your servant.
or is it you are calling for a "MD" Doctor - becasue the dentist is drilling on your teeth??
Fully agree - it is a sign of respect. And it's a shame that so many have lost the art of respect in our country.
It certainly can be a sign of respect, but using it does not guarantee or even necessarily signal respect -- e.g., it can be used in scorn or mockery in a way that signals the opposite of the supposed intent.
It is also incorrect to assume we can't be respectful without using this title.
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PastoralMusings
Active Member
What sort of respect is conveyed when we use the "Dr" or "Pastor?" If we acknowledge a degree or a position and do not use it with the sense that we accept them as being any more authoritative than they truly are, I see no problem. Jesus' issue with titles was the fact that people were investing too much authority and respect in a man. Thus we should call no one our master, father, or doctor in the sense that we do not yield to them the obeisance due to Christ.
I have a pastor friend who is also an economist. On his job he is "Dr", but elsewhere we just call him "brother." I like "brother" because we are a brotherhood. I'm not picky, however. I'll answer to almost anything I'm called, as long as I'm called for supper.
I have a pastor friend who is also an economist. On his job he is "Dr", but elsewhere we just call him "brother." I like "brother" because we are a brotherhood. I'm not picky, however. I'll answer to almost anything I'm called, as long as I'm called for supper.
Referencing using the title "Brother"
1) we dont use it just for the pastor
2) somewhat a regional thing.
When I was down South - just about everyone used that term ( even if you didnt know
if the individual was a Christian)
Up North - around our area - it is not as common to use the term brother as a fellow Christian
3) Any group will refer to others as "Brother" military for one
1) we dont use it just for the pastor
2) somewhat a regional thing.
When I was down South - just about everyone used that term ( even if you didnt know
if the individual was a Christian)
Up North - around our area - it is not as common to use the term brother as a fellow Christian
3) Any group will refer to others as "Brother" military for one
Interestingly, "Brother" is used in the form of address, see Acts 9:17 and Acts 22:13. (Most translators seem to agree this is the best way to translate σαουλ αδελφε.)
And Ananias went his way, and entered into the house; and putting his hands on him said, Brother Saul, the Lord, even Jesus, that appeared unto thee in the way as thou camest, hath sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight, and be filled with the Holy Ghost.
And Ananias went his way, and entered into the house; and putting his hands on him said, Brother Saul, the Lord, even Jesus, that appeared unto thee in the way as thou camest, hath sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight, and be filled with the Holy Ghost.
Pastor Sam
Member
I am going to skip over your comments. I believe if someone works and attends school and gets a degree that have a right to that title. I have an Uncle who has several Dr; degrees and he has earned them and he deserves them.
Many of these others are phonies. The only others who deserve the title are those who really have earned it by giving their life to the service of God.
Many of these others are phonies. The only others who deserve the title are those who really have earned it by giving their life to the service of God.