God's Sovereignty Over Human Politics & Governments

[KenH]

That thinking is faulty and not found in scripture

1) No, it is not faulty.
2) Yes, it is taught in the Bible.

You have no jurisdiction to say to the Potter that He can't do what He wants to do for His purposes and glory.

 

[Revmitchell]

1) No, it is not faulty.
2) Yes, it is taught in the Bible.

You have no jurisdiction to say to the Potter that He can't do what He wants to do for His purposes and glory.

I didnt make that argument you made it for me. Its not my position. And no you have not made the case that its in scripture

 

[KenH]

I didnt make that argument you made it for me. Its not my position. And no you have not made the case that its in scripture

Romans 9:19-24 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will? Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour? What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: and that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory, even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?

 

[Revmitchell]

Romans 9:19-24 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will? Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour? What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: and that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory, even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?

You posted scripture and nothing else. You impose your faulty definition on it but provide no real evidence for it. Further, I have no idea what you are thinking you are proving with this verse. I cannot read your mind.

 

[KenH]

You posted scripture and nothing else.

Since Scripture alone is not sufficient for you, I will add the following.

"reference is had to Isa 45:9; Now as it would be a most absurd thing for the clay, was it capable of speaking, to say to the fashioner of it, why dost thou put me into such or such a shape and form? or for any piece of workmanship to say to the maker of it, he has no hands, no head, no judgment and skill; or for a child to say to its parents, what begettest thou, or what hast thou brought forth? so absurd and unreasonable is it, for any to say to God, why hast thou appointed me to such and such ends and purposes, and has brought me into being in such a manner, and under such circumstances?"

- John Gill's Bible commentary on Romans 9:20

 

[Revmitchell]

Since Scripture alone is not sufficient for you, I will add the following.

"reference is had to Isa 45:9; Now as it would be a most absurd thing for the clay, was it capable of speaking, to say to the fashioner of it, why dost thou put me into such or such a shape and form? or for any piece of workmanship to say to the maker of it, he has no hands, no head, no judgment and skill; or for a child to say to its parents, what begettest thou, or what hast thou brought forth? so absurd and unreasonable is it, for any to say to God, why hast thou appointed me to such and such ends and purposes, and has brought me into being in such a manner, and under such circumstances?"

- John Gill's Bible commentary on Romans 9:20

Ok well since you are incapable of have a reasoned discussion I will leave you to your misery.

 

[KenH]

Ok well since you are incapable of have a reasoned discussion I will leave you to your misery.

Misery? No, sir.


A hymn written by Joseph Irons in Zion's Hymns.

"Happy Moments"

1. O! the happiness, arising
From the life of grace within,
When the soul is realizing
Conquests over hell and sin;
Happy moments!
Heavenly joys on earth begin.

2. On the Saviour's fulness living,
All his saints obtain delight:
With the strength which he is giving,
They can wrestle, they can fight;
Happy moments!
When King Jesus is in sight.

3, Nearer! nearer! to him clinging,
Let my helpless soul be found;
All my sorrows to him bringing,
May his grace in me abound;
Happy moments!
With new cov'nant blessings crowned.

4. All the world has nothing charming;
Foes and sorrows flee away;
Nor is death itself alarming,
Jesus took its sting away:
Happy moments!
Dawning of eternal day.

 

[Marooncat79]

The God of the Bible has overall control of the entire universe, but "allows", according to His "permissive will", those things that take place, whether good or evil.

God is not the CAUSE of any evil or wickedness, which is from the devil himself, who is "the god of this world" (2 Cor. 4:4); and as John says in his First Epistle, "We know that we are from God, and the whole world lies in the power of the evil one" (5:19)

The theology of the Reformed/Calvinist, is grave error, that teaches, "God ordains everything that comes to pass" (Westminster Confession of Faith Chapter III - Of God's Eternal Decree), and yet say that God is not the author of sin! It is either ALL THINGS, or NOT ALL THINGS. Both cannot be right!

According to Daniel, a Prophet of God, Cyrus is specifically named in his book as the one who would free the Jews to return to Israel.

God controlled it

 

[SavedByGrace]

According to Daniel, a Prophet of God, Cyrus is specifically named in his book as the one who would free the Jews to return to Israel.

God controlled it

Who disputes this?

The Reformed teaching that God ordains all that comes to pass is unbiblical rubbish, as this would clearly make God the author of sin

The teaching that God controls our very thoughts is more unbiblical rubbish

 

[KenH]

Who disputes this?

The Reformed teaching that God ordains all that comes to pass is unbiblical rubbish, as this would clearly make God the author of sin

The teaching that God controls our very thoughts is more unbiblical rubbish

Not rubbish at all. It is Biblical. Your man-based theology just rejects it.

 

[SavedByGrace]

Not rubbish at all. It is Biblical. Your man-based theology just rejects it.

So God controls our lustful thoughts and desires to sin against Him?

This means that when we carry out the thoughts that the Lord gives us, and commit sin, we are simply carrying out His will for us

 

[KenH]

So God controls our lustful thoughts and desires to sin against Him?

This means that when we carry out the thoughts that the Lord gives us, and commit sin, we are simply carrying out His will for us

Do you think that you can act independently of God? Do you think that you are stronger than God?

 

[Marooncat79]

Who disputes this?

The Reformed teaching that God ordains all that comes to pass is unbiblical rubbish, as this would clearly make God the author of sin

The teaching that God controls our very thoughts is more unbiblical rubbish

God is not the author of sin. That is blasphemy

God leaves the lost to their own wicked thoughts and actions which proves depravity

 

[KenH]

God is not the author of sin. That is blasphemy

God leaves the lost to their own wicked thoughts and actions which proves depravity

Do you think that God owes Pharoah an apology?

Exodus 7:13 And he hardened Pharaoh's heart, that he hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said.

 

[Marooncat79]

Nope

why would you ask me that?

 

[SavedByGrace]

Do you think that you can act independently of God? Do you think that you are stronger than God?

Nothing to do with the OP

 

[SavedByGrace]

God is not the author of sin. That is blasphemy

God leaves the lost to their own wicked thoughts and actions which proves depravity

Show ONE verse from the Bible that says God controls our thoughts

 

[AustinC]

Show ONE verse from the Bible that says God controls our thoughts

Show one verse that he doesn't.
Do you see how silly you are being?