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Christ Died for Our Sins

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Eternally Grateful

Well-Known Member
KenH said:
It is the perfect righteousness of Christ, something neither you nor I can produce, that is imputed by God to His elect.

Do you understand that the only way to stand perfect before God is to be perfectly righteousness?

That righteousness comes from Christ's perfect obedience to the law of God on behalf of every person that God elected to salvation before the world began.
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Do you even listen to anything I say? You keep posting things to me I believe as if I do not believe them. I am just asking, because I do not want to waste my time, and it is getting frustrating trying to discuss with others who do not seem to be hearing a word your saying..
You or I cannot produce such a righteousness, not by believing nor by baptism nor by any works of any kind.

The sins of the elect were imputed to Christ and His perfect righteousness was imputed to them. And it is all by God's sovereign grace.
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Your right, You can’t PROIDUCE IT

But if you do not RECIEVE it, You will NEVER GET IT.
 
E

Eternally Grateful

Well-Known Member
KenH said:
If you believe that regeneration, the new birth, precedes faith and repentance(which are gifts from God), then we agree on those items.
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I cant agree with that

That states we are born again IN SIN, Thats impossible. Sin must be redeemed (justification) before we can be made alive.
 
E

Eternally Grateful

Well-Known Member
KenH said:
I posted about justification here: A Just Redemption | Baptist Christian Forums (baptistboard.com)
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Justification is when God declaired us righteous, or free from the debt of sin.

We can not be regenerated while we are still under the penalty of sin. God would have to go against his perfect justice to do that. He can not. That is why his love had to provide a way for salvation. Because his justice is perfect. And he could not go against his own values.

Love does no harm. And Love will do whatever it can. It will not force a person to do something it does not want to do. It not only gives, It recieves. That is what makes love pure..

God is a loving God.. But he is also a just God. His love can not overrule his justice.


That is the fatal flaw for those who believe in regenerate first. And it is the reason I can never believe in that doctrine. (Not the only reason, but it is all I need)
 
kyredneck

kyredneck

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Eternally Grateful said:
That states we are born again IN SIN,
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So?

Eternally Grateful said:
Thats impossible.
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Maybe for your God, but not for the God of the Bible, Nothing's impossible.

Eternally Grateful said:
Sin must be redeemed (justification) before we can be made alive.
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You really should read more of your Bible:

6 For while we were yet weak, in due season Christ died for the ungodly.
8 But God commendeth his own love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, shall we be saved from the wrath of God through him.
10 For if, while we were enemies, we were reconciled to God through the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, shall we be saved by his life; Ro 5
5 even when we were dead through our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace have ye been saved), Eph 2
.
 
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E

Eternally Grateful

Well-Known Member
kyredneck said:
So?
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The fact you ask this question just proves to me you do not understand how a perfect justice system works. Ands why, when CHrist comes to rule. He will rule perfectly.

Maybe for your God, but not for the God of the Bible, Nothing's impossible.
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Going against your own Justice is impossible for a perfect judge. It makes him not perfect.

He can’t pronounce judgment that your are dead because you have sinned, And yet make us alive while we are still under the penalty of sin.

Again, The mere fact you would make this statement just proves to me you do not understand a perfect justice system.

You really should read more of your Bible:
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You really should show some humility. Thats the one thing I have noticed about these arguments, People are the most rude non christlike people I have ever met, You give God a bad name

Instaed of telling me what I SHOUDL DO. As if I have not done so already. Why do you not just make your case.. You do not have to get arrogant about it
6 For while we were yet weak, in due season Christ died for the
8 But God commendeth his own love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, shall we be saved from the wrath of God through him.
ungodly.
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Yes CHrist died for us WHILE WE WERE DEAD. He had to. Since we could not be redeemed UNTIL HE DIED. And through his death he offered us reconciliation

10 For if, while we were enemies, we were reconciled to God through the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, shall we be saved by his life; Ro 5
5 even when we were dead through our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace have ye been saved), Eph 2
.
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By grace we have been saved THROUGH FAITH

Sorry my friend, UNTIL faith occures. THERE IS NO SALVATION. we are still dead in our sin.

Instead of telling others they should read the Bible.Maybe you should seek to see why they believe the way you do.

Vs 8 - 9 of that passage shows WHY we are saved (made alive) it is by grace THROUGH FAITH.

Again, the regeneration issue is the last nail in the coffin and why I can not believe the way you do.

I have asked for years someone to explain how we can be made alive BEFORE justification. No one has yet to give me a viable reason.

Until someone does. I can not see it your way.
 
E

Eternally Grateful

Well-Known Member
KenH said:
It is the only way that a human being can be regenerated. You have a very, very flawed theology. I would be curious in what church or denomination you were taught such stuff.
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Not without justification

You keep leaving out justification as if it is meaningless.

As for what church I learned it from. I learned it at an early age at Hope baptist church in columbus Ohio. I learned it when I came to christ. After weeks of begging god in my bedroom night after night, after i finally took the stand and had a deacon explain the gospel to me in plain simple language, then I recieved christ I was justified. And after I knw I was born again and had confidence that God kept his promise. And I have continued to hear it in every baptist church I ever went to. When I left the church as a prodigal due to some stuff in my life. And later repented and returned. And started to study myself. I came to te same conclusion And every churhc i have been to sine (baptist or non denomination) teaches the same

It was not until about a decade ago when I joined a christian chatroom. I even heard ot regeneration preceding justification. And no one has been able to show my why God would overturn his justice before his justice is satisfied.

You have been given an opportunity. If you can feel free.

By the way,

Your in a baptist chatroom.. Why would you visit a chatroom where everyone in that denomination (that I know of) disagrees with you?
 
KenH

KenH

Well-Known Member
Eternally Grateful said:
By the way,

Your in a baptist chatroom.. Why would you visit a chatroom where everyone in that denomination (that I know of) disagrees with you?
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I attend Grace Baptist Church of Ruston, Louisiana. Thus I am a Baptist based on the name on the sign in front of the church I attend. I believe, as do the other folks at Grace Baptist Church of Ruston, that salvation is 100% based on the sovereign, free grace of God and is not conditioned at all on the sinner whom God elected before the foundation of the earth and for whom Christ died as his propitiation, as the gospel teaches. We are justified based on the righteousness of Christ imputed to the elect just as their sins were imputed to Christ and He paid the penalty for them on the cross by His blood.

No one can attain a righteous standing based on anything that he can do or believe. Any teaching that conditions salvation on anything done by the sinner is totally at odds with the gospel of Christ. Salvation is 100% by God - from first to last - and 0% on the sinner.
 
E

Eternally Grateful

Well-Known Member
KenH said:
I attend Grace Baptist Church of Ruston, Louisiana. Thus I am a Baptist based on the name on the sign in front of the church I attend. I believe, as do the other folks at Grace Baptist Church of Ruston, that salvation is 100% based on the sovereign, free grace of God and is not conditioned at all on the sinner whom God elected before the foundation of the earth and for whom Christ died as his propitiation, as the gospel teaches. We are justified based on the righteousness of Christ imputed to the elect just as their sins were imputed to Christ and He paid the penalty for them on the cross by His blood.

No one can attain a righteous standing based on anything that he can do or believe. Any teaching that conditions salvation on anything done by the sinner is totally at odds with the gospel of Christ. Salvation is 100% by God - from first to last - and 0% on the sinner.
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Your the only baptist I ever met who believed in what I call fatalism. (Your future is determined and there is nothing you can do) or double predestination.

PS. I believe salvation is based on the sovereign free grace of God. I just reject the fact that God over rules his justice in order to make a person alive while still under the penalty of sin, so they can then magically believe and be justified after the fact.
 
KenH

KenH

Well-Known Member
Eternally Grateful said:
Your the only baptist I ever met who believed in what I call fatalism. (Your future is determined and there is nothing you can do) or double predestination.
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Frankly, I couldn't care less about being called a Baptist. I care only about being a disciple of the Lord my Righteousness, Christ Jesus.
 
KenH

KenH

Well-Known Member
Eternally Grateful said:
I care about the truth. Eternity is to long to mis out on because of pride and missing the truth.
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And the truth is that if one is saved then Christ is the Lord their Righteousness(Jeremiah 23:6, Jeremiah 33:16). If one is saved then Christ is their wisdom, their righteousness, their sanctification, their redemption(1 Corinthians 1:30).

A mere human can never be his own righteousness(Isaiah 64:6).
 
E

Eternally Grateful

Well-Known Member
KenH said:
And the truth is that if one is saved then Christ is the Lord their Righteousness(Jeremiah 23:6, Jeremiah 33:16). If one is saved then Christ is their wisdom, their righteousness, their sanctification, their redemption(1 Corinthians 1:30).

A mere human can never be his own righteousness(Isaiah 64:6).
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I never said otherwise. Yet it appears you keep insisting I do.

I do not believe or trust myself my friend. My faith is 100% in God and his righteousness.
 
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