ACLU

That is exactly how the aclu has twisted the 1st amendment into something it was never meant to be.

Since you didn't really answer the question, I'll try again.


How does a student led prayer before a student body at a football game between students violate the "establishment" clause of the 1st Amendment?

There is no possible way a sane person could conclude that it is an attempt by the government to "establish" a religion.

 

I believe I have answered that. Reread my post. It depends on if it is a small voluntary group or imposed on everyone by the state (in the form of the local public school district).

 

So MP and Daisy, are ya'll saying that you believe that fear of violating the "establishment clause" trumps the "free exercise clause"?

 

No you didn't.
How is a prayer, regardless of who leads it and where, an attempt by the government to establish a religion?

Never mind. You can't answer that question because it is so clear that it is not , a child could figure it out.

Unless you have an agenda...like the aclu , which is the eventual destruction of all manifestations of religion, no matter where, when or how.

 

I see this as an attempt to follow the anti-smoking crusade. In this case, first ban religious expression on government property. Second, ban religious expression in "public" places such as work places, restaurants, and other places where the public gathers. Third, ban it in homes, cars, and other private places.

And I imagine it will all be done "for the children" in the minds of liberals.

 

You haven't proven that you've been prevented from "free exercise" of your actual religion.

As someone allergic to tobacco smoke, I really love the smoking ban. I am sympathetic to nicotine addicts, but I'm glad not to have to breathe their smoke.

 

And some Christians willingly accept imposed limits on how they exercise their faith.

 

And some Christians willingly accept imposed limits on how they exercise their faith. </font>[/QUOTE]How has the ACLU prevented you, personally, from practicing your religion?

 

So, Daisy, you don't have a problem if my local government high school has a public prayer over the loudspeaker before a football game starts at a government stadium? If you do have a problem with it then you clearly believe that the "establishment clause" trumps the "free exercise clause", although I don't see how anyone can credibly claim that a prayer before a football game is an establishment of religion.

 

Yes, the ACLU is preventing me from engaging in prayer with thousands of other Christians before high school football games.

 

It must be confusing to be a liberal and a Christian at the same time.

To be bound by Christ to spread the Gospel and bound by your politics to support every effort to stop the spread of your Lord's Gospel, has to cause a lot of inner turmoil.

 

The problem, carpro, is that there are legitimate concerns about the "establishment clause" such as we would not want to see non-Chritian religions banned by the government nor the goverment favoring one Christian denomination over another. But these concerns can be addressed without supporting the ACLU agenda that goes well beyond these concerns.

I think some Christians need to take a step back and consider what they are really supporting with the ACLU.

 

Slippery Slope Fallacy

 

Then after all that banning in comes the police state with biometric national ID's, cameras on every street corner, warrantless searches, no charge arrests, cops in black masks and submachine guns, freespeech zones, corporate coruption, and implantable (keeps the kids safe) microchips.

And that's just in the last 4 1/2 years. Wait till ya see what the globalists will let the Democrats do with all that.

 

Tell that to smokers.

 

Yes, the ACLU is preventing me from engaging in prayer with thousands of other Christians before high school football games. </font>[/QUOTE]No it is not. You may gather together and pray with them. You may not use the loudspeakers to force it on others.

My dad used to say "your right to swing your arms ends where my nose begins." That sums it up pretty well.

 

Slippery Slope Fallacy

http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/slippery-slope.html

 

Tell to smokers, MP. Tell it to smokers.

 

So when the ACLU brings a lawsuit against a person(s) for praying before eating a meal at a government school cafeteria(without using a loudspeaker), are you going to support the ACLU?