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And Now, the Antichrist!

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by John of Japan, Nov 28, 2017.

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  1. David Kent

    David Kent Well-Known Member
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    At a baptist church we used to attend, the pastor spent 4 weeks on the prayer in Daniel 9 and only one on the prophecy.
     
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  2. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    Concerning 666 and the identity of the Antichrist, some (including asterisktom) have calculated him to be Roman emperor Nero. Unfortunately for this scenario, he committed suicide in AD 68, and thus had no connection at all with the events of AD 70, when preterists think (with no Biblical nor historical evidence) that Jesus came in judgment spiritually (without a body, to them). The method of numerology used for the Nero calculation is called gematria, a very uncertain Hebrew method. (Should we include the vowel points? What if my calculations are different from yours?)

    My approach to prophecy is to go no further than Scripture. Therefore, I do not try to calculate anything from 666, but believe that Antichrist's identity is hidden by this number until we need to know. What does 666 mean to us Christians? It is "the number of a man," as Scripture says. That's all.
     
    #102 John of Japan, Dec 1, 2017
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  3. prophecy70

    prophecy70 Active Member

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    Rev 13:18
    This calls for wisdom. Let the person who has insight calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man. That number is 666.

    So the first century churches John wrote to had no idea what this meant either?
     
  4. prophecy70

    prophecy70 Active Member

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    I do not believe he came Spiritually. Who actually admitted they believed this?
     
  5. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    You have to be joking. The Jewish interpreters, who do not believe that Jesus is the Messiah, correctly interpret when Messiah shall come (v. 25)? Really?
     
  6. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    That is correct. They did not have enough data to do the calculation, just as we do not. (By the way, you should source what translation you use. Which is this one? The word "insight" should be translated "understanding.")
     
  7. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    All the preterists on the BB.
     
  8. prophecy70

    prophecy70 Active Member

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    It is essential to a correct understanding of Daniel 9, to point out that it is incorrect to read this passage as if it were speaking about the Messiah. This may appear obvious to Christians since their translations has the word “Messiah” mentioned twice in this chapter; however this is the result of a blatant and intentional mistranslation of the Hebrew word (משיח ~ Moshiach”).

    This word literally means “anointed” and is an adjective as in the 1 Samuel 10:1-2 where the word clearly means an act of consecration. It is not a personal pronoun that refers to a particular individual called “The Messiah.” The word (משיח ~ Moshiach”) is used throughout Jewish Scriptures no less than 100 times and refers to a variety of individuals and objects. For example:

    Priests: Leviticus 4:3
    Kings: 1 Kings 1:39
    Prophets: Isaiah 61:1
    Temple Alter: Exodus 40:9-11
    Matzot ~ Unleavened Bread: Numbers 6:15
    Cyrus ~ a non-Jewish Persian King: Isaiah 45:1

    Even Christian translators translate the word (משיח ~ Moshiach) as “anointed” one verse earlier when it is used in Daniel 9:24.

    www.JewsforJudiasm.com

    In no way do I agree with what they believe spiritually. Im just using them for the language


    Remember what you said about the use of the Greek word Parousia?
     
  9. prophecy70

    prophecy70 Active Member

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    All? what do you consider me then?
     
  10. prophecy70

    prophecy70 Active Member

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    NIV,

    Some have insight some have understanding.
     
  11. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    Well, duh, of course Messiah means "anointed one" in Daniel. That is also what the Greek Christos (Christ) means. So in a word, you accept a "Jews for Judaism" interpretation over that of every single Christian interpreter of Daniel down through the ages. That's very surprising, and even sad.
    I said a lot about it. So? Are you aware of polysemy in the term? (A linguistic term for multiple meanings in a word.)

    Apparently, if we follow your Jewish interpreters and you, "messiah" never means our blessed Savior Jesus Christ, in spite of all of the Christian interpreters of all the ages. :Sick

    PS added in: Just a quick look shows that these Hebrew interpreters are conflating the verbal and the proper noun usages of the word. Just sayin'. I guess it suits their purposes to do that, but it's hardly honest.
     
    #111 John of Japan, Dec 1, 2017
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  12. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    Oh goody, the NIV, my favorite dynamic equivalence translation to oppose. ;)
     
  13. David Kent

    David Kent Well-Known Member
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    666, the number.

    Irenaeus and some later ECW thought it may mean Lateinos, that is the Latin Man, They got that from the fact that the littele horn in Daniel 7 came out of the 4th beast, the Roman Empire.
     
    #113 David Kent, Dec 1, 2017
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  14. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    I have not figured you out yet. To my knowledge, this is the first time you've self-identified as a preterist. By the same token, I don't think you have figured out preterism yet.
     
    #114 John of Japan, Dec 1, 2017
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  15. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    The website you gave doesn't exist. You probably meant JEWS FOR JUDAISM keeps Jews Jewish by teaching Jews Judaism.

    Are you aware that Jews for Judaism was established to keep Jews from becoming Christians? So everything on their website is with that agenda. They write on their home page, "Jews for Judaism responds to the threat of Christian missionary groups...."

    So, in your agreement with their interpretation, even with your denial as to spiritual things, you are aligning yourself with the enemies of Jesus Christ, the Messiah.
     
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  16. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    I am certainly enjoying reading through this thread!
     
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  17. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    And that person shall be slain/judged at the time of the second Coming by Jesus, so preterists are really wrong on this!
     
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  18. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    Glad to hear that.
     
  19. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    Exactly. When Christ comes, He will need nothing more than “the brightness of His coming” to destroy the Antichrist and his works (2 Thess. 2:8). Antichrist will be condemned to the Lake of Fire forever, along with his false prophet, and Satan who empowered him (Rev. 19:20).
     
    #119 John of Japan, Dec 1, 2017
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  20. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    When did that get recorded in history as already happening?
     
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