japantoday > technology
Riken finds bigger gap in chimpanzee, human genes
Wednesday, July 2, 2003 at 08:30 JST
TOKYO — Researchers at the Institute of Physical and Chemical Research (Riken) said Tuesday they have found a much larger difference in the genes between humans and chimpanzees than the conventionally accepted level.
They say the difference, based on a yet-to-be-completed genome study of the primate most closely related to humans, is roughly 15%. Yoshiyuki Sakaki, director of the Riken genome project who announced the results, said the extent of the difference was greater than previously thought. (Kyodo News)
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Thought some folks here might be interested in this.
apes and humans
Discussion in 'Creation vs. Evolution' started by Helen, Jul 4, 2003.
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Oh kewl beans, just shows we humans must be evolving even more lately! :eek:
Gina -
The researchers have partially compared the genes on one chromosome. In the portion they checked, 199 of 235 genes were identical.
The rest of the respective genomes have not been checked by this method.
Since we know that humans and chimps are much closer in DNA than the variations commmon in many species (using other methods), it remains to be seen if a complete analysis will confirm their tentative findins, or if varition within species will also be much greater by their new method.
Right now, it's apples and oranges. -
They do have an advantage...that opposible thumb for a big toe. Myself, I have trouble peeling a banana with my feet. -
Er, apples and bananas. Sorry.
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The "evidence" or data that man and apes, particularly the chimps, share a common ancestor seems to not be as certain as once proclaimed by evolutionists (e.g., the better than 98% "similarity" between human and chimp genes appears to be fadding somewhat}.
See also these older related newstories with a creationist comment: http://www.creationsafaris.com/crev1002.htm#earlyman51 - Human-Ape Differences Grow Wider 10/25/2002
as well as http://www.creationsafaris.com/crev0203.htm#gene110 - Mitochondrial DNA Database Full of Mistakes 02/19/2003,
and http://www.creationsafaris.com/crev0503.htm#gene127 - Treasure Found in DNA Junkyard 05/23/2003).
[ July 06, 2003, 09:33 PM: Message edited by: Steven O. Sawyer ] -
I noted a bit of inadvertent self-criticism in one of your links:
That might not be "incomprehensible", but apparently it was set aside for something easily-understood.
Genetic variation of 20% or more within a species is has been observed. I can't seem to find what the variation between two-closely related species might be.
But it would normally be a lot less than 98%. My guess is that earlier estimates of 92-95% are more likely. But when we actually have data, that will be clearer.
Here's an interesting site on the comparison of human genes with those of other apes:
"How one defines similarity between species can be a subjective matter. If we consider only highly-similar regions between chimp and human then we are on the order of 97-98% similar. However, if we take into account larger insertions and deletions, then the similarity drops to 94-95%."
Todd D. Taylor, The Chimpanzee Chromosome 22 Sequencing Consortium
RIKEN Genomic Sciences Center, 1-7-22 Suehiro-cho, Tsurumi-ku, Yokohama, Kanagawa 230-0045 Japan
http://hgm2003.hgu.mrc.ac.uk/Abstracts/Publish/Plenaries/Plenary01/hgm01.html -
Why do some "christians" try so HARD to support
a Theory that is so contrary to everything the
Word of God reveals and yet are so keen on
accepting that the Old Testament is allegoric.
Seems like they are putting their eggs in the
wrong basket. -
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Why would apes an humans share *any* genes under the creationist idea?
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Because all life is made up of the same basic proteins. If it were not so, what would people or animals eat?
Galatian, in turn, I have no idea what mental maneuverings it takes to pick and choose bits of verses the way you do and discount the rest of the Bible when it disagrees with you.
After all, you say Genesis is allegorical -- so why try to get ANY of it to support you? -
I sat down and studied this for quite a while so I could reply intelligently...
Oh, wait, I typed in "why do apes share genes with humans" in my search bar and this is the first site it gave. Took a second. LOL
Anyhow, who is this guy and what do you think of what he's saying?
Gina -
Oh yeah, you might want the link, huh?
http://www.apologeticspress.org/docsdis/2002/dc-02-07.htm -
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Because all life is made up of the same basic proteins.</font>[/QUOTE]But the question has neven been sufficiently answered as to why we share the same mutations. To repeat quotes I made a couple of weeks ago (see the Vitamin-C thread for references and discussion):
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It would also seem by the logic of most evolutionists that since chimps have more genetic similarity to humans (supposedly only 1.5 - 5% difference) than most humans have to each other (I believe the human population has about a 7% variation), then it should be easier to mate with a chimp then other "distant" humans. However we KNOW that such comparisons are not true and only serve to promote racial bigotry (as Darwin and the early evolutioniosts did) and possibly some demented exercises in beastiality ("Oooooh! That's not right!"). This is partially due to the fact that chimps have 48 chromosomes while humans only have 46. As the article in your link points out, "A strict comparison of chromosome numbers would indicate that we are more closely related to the Chinese muntjac (a small deer found in Taiwan’s mountainous regions), which also has 46 chromosomes."
Here are a couple more sections from the link
http://www.apologeticspress.org/docsdis/2002/dc-02-07.htm
DO HUMAN AND CHIMPANZEE DNA INDICATE AN EVOLUTIONARY RELATIONSHIP? by Brad Harrub, Ph.D. and Bert Thompson, Ph.D.
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That site was a storehouse of misinformation and hilarious misunderstandings. One of the funnier ones:
"While many evolutionists proclaim that human DNA is 98% identical to chimpanzee DNA, few would lie by idly and allow themselves to receive a transplant using chimpanzee organs."
I doubt if any of them would be dumb enough to allow the vast majority of humans to donate organs to them, either. To make it work, the match has to be exact, or so close to it that one's immune system can't recognize the organ as foreign. Often, even a sibling isn't good enough. -
The article by Harrub and Thompson is not a very good one. They discussed chromosomes a little, and overlook important publications in regard to chromosomes. Their most recent reference on chromosomes was in 1968! They are not good scholars, those two.
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Let's go to something interesting in the July 10 Nature and take a look at the ramifications:
So not only are apes and humans a lot more different than was originally thought in the genes, but as it is turning out, the differences in the genes are secondary to the differences in the regulatory mechanisms -- only some of which may be in the chromosomes! -
Wow those some big jumps in assumptions Helen!
If only we could see the rest of the article and not have to rely on your bais "interpretations".
:D
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