Bushites Split As Gitmo Abuses Continue

This is war and Christians have the right of self-defense. Canadians chose not to help fight this war and now they are sitting on the sidelines rooting for the terrorists and the downfall of the USA. The great idea of Canadians is to legalize same-sex marriage and jail the preachers for saying that sodomy is a sin.

Canada is for the Arabs, but England and Australia are together with the USA to fight terror.

 

Torture and humiliation are NOT American values.

 

Wrong. The Canadian government decided not to send the military. Besides, even if Canadians DIDN'T want to support you in this war...what's it to you? Why should we? Look at all the insults you direct at us. Do you even NEED our help? If not, then shut up.

One question for ya dude...where were YOU guys the first few years of WW2? Huh? Answer that sufficiently please.

As for Christians having the right of self defense...that is absolutely incorrect! Did Jesus defend Himself when He went to the cross? We have NO rights as Christians and you had better get that into your head soon.

 

By the way cmg, since you missed this the first time:

 

You guys on the religious left are bombastic. All Canada is worried about is jailing preachers and left-wing socialism. The air is bad in Canada if you are used to freedom. It is England that Canada should have helped in this war imo, but who cares? After we execute the Taliban in Cuba, we'll send them to Hudson Bay for burial.

 

deriding Canadians is NOT
an American value.

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Thank you Ed Edwards! I don't even have to respond to it now. God bless you brother.

 

Hey, i live in Oklahoma, USofA which has TWO
CANADIAN RIVERS*. In fact, i've lived most
of my life in Oklahoma and the Panhandle
of Texas within 20 miles of one of the
Canadian Rivers. Latest change: A six mile
strech of the North Candian River in Oklahoma
City has been named the Oklahoma River.
The rest of the North Canadian River is stilled
called the 'North Canadian River'.

This is more Canadian Rivers than in Canada
for Canada has no 'Canadian River'

 

LOL yeah we may not have a Canadian River but we got some good bays and lakes and three oceans around us.

 

Jesus said a lot of things - all of which were relevant - and the Bible records God's word - all of it - which includes the right and duty of civil government to administer justice among men. Military action - war - is the final element of that justice when all else fails. Terrorists are the agents of Satan and both he and they deserve no quarter. God has judged all men and by that judgment found us all guilty but those chosen by God to receive the grace of Jesus Christ are secure in their final place of rest at His side solely through His atonement of sin. That - the destiny of one's soul - is something no man can judge but man must judge the acts of other men and administer civil justice for the sake of all while on this earth. We need to take that right and duty seriously, solemnly, and humbly but we need to act upon it with vigor and purpose.

 

Torture is not an American value. Stupid "sexual" pranks are not American values. Humiliation - properly defined - is an acceptable tool to bring our enemy - this type enemy - to their knees.

A criminal detained in prison is deprived of many of their normal rights, forced to share space with many others, denied privacy, forced to work at menial tasks, etc. and is certainly thereby humiliated.

A terrorist is far below a criminal and deserves even less and is not entitled to the same due process even as a criminal. These are very evil people who respect no law of warfare. They must be dealt with accordingly else they will prey upon us at every opportunity.

 

We have some good news today from yesterday's federal appeals court decision regarding military tribunals for the Gitmo terrorits!

From an American Forces Press Service report by Kathleen T. Rhem we're told:

Great! This is exactly what many of us have been hoping for! Let's get on with the tribunals!

 

I disagree, King James!

Jesus went to the cross to die and then to rise from that death victorious as the one and only sufficient atonement for our sins. In doing so He fulfilled the purpose for which He had been sent. He could have defended himself but He followed the Father's will.

Defending our nation, families, friends, and selves is not prohibited by the word of God nor by the teachings of Jesus. We are forbidden, as individuals, for seeking revenge for evil acts against us but are permitted to seek justice for them through those appointed for that purpose among us.

We, through our civil government, have a duty to defend our nation and to maintain order in our society through law that brings about justice. Our military is an agent of our civil government. Their task is to find, fix, and destroy our enemies when lessor means are not possible.

Our Lord Jesus did not condemn those He met who were justly engaged in these duties during the times He walked this earth as a man.

 

You disagree that we don't have rights? I was just preached at on another forum that I am to die daily and therefore have no right to enjoy any kind of entertainment.

I don't know about you but from what I believe and what I was taught while I was in the military was that a real soldier does his job. He doesn't need people back home "supporting the cause". He doesn't need to be a blood thirsty maniac who enjoys killing. He does his job and that's it. Soldiers don't fight for the "glory" or the slaps on the back.

You mention justice...that's fine. Are you in favour of pursuing justice ALL OVER THE WORLD...instead of only where it suits you? If not, THAT is NOT justice and don't sit there and try to tell me it is.

Yes the military and police are to handle things for us because we aren't to seek revenge personally. So why are there some people on here telling others to "support the cause" and go and fight? That's the military's job and nobody has the right to tell anyone to go and join the military. That is a PERSONAL thing.

Now...if you go back and read the part of my quote that you responded to...I am talking about Christians not having the right of self defense. I don't know how we got into the military, etc.

 

Before God Almighty we have no right to anything. Our only hope is the mercy of provided through the atonement for sin made by Jesus Christ for those He chose. Among men we have many rights and, with them, many responsibilities.

My Father, by his example, imparted a sense of duty to me. I felt it was my duty to serve and my fellow citizens, especially those before me who'd bought with blood what I already enjoyed, expected it from me. The military taught me how to be a warrior. The military did not teach me to be a murderer who enjoys killing. The nation required my service to the causes they deemed necessary and placed leaders over me in that service. They also set out standards of conduct for me to follow. I was motivated, in purpose, by a sense of duty and a belief in our just causes. I was further motivated, in practice, by the will to survive, to do my part for those with me, and by fearing the consequences of failure more than what faced me. I was further motivated, in action, by the training I received, my immediate leadership, and a host of other reasons. I was kept safe by the hand God and, most likely, the prayers of my Father and Mother, and later, my dear wife. A quest for "glory" never entered into the formula and I never found it. That's about as personal as I want to get with this subject.

Most persons in their right mind have no real desire to engage in battle especially after their first real taste of it. There has to be some very strong motivation for doing what needs to be done. For most, in the end, I believe that is an inherent sense of duty - obligation - to the nation with the full knowledge that it could me being wounded or killed. For troops to do that, and to be successfully lead in doing it, there is an absolute need that the nation support the cause to which the troops are committed. If not, those troops will begin to question why they are there, doubt the value of their service, challenge the orders of their leadership, avoid the fight because of the inherent risks, and, ultimately, their morale will be broken. This is why, friends, that supporting the cause is so critical to our success. To do otherwise helps the enemies cause.

America has to choose the course of action it takes based on the risks, the costs, and the potential outcomes. She has to do that with the best available information at hand based upon the situation at the time. America may choose to doing nothing in some cases, pursue endless diplomacy in others, or, when the situation merits it like Iraq, take on a military solution. There is nothing at all wrong with this. We're not obligated to solve every problem every where. We we do commit to a cause we are obligated to it and should but our best into it.

The military - those in the service of our nation - are the ones we send to fight on our behalf. That doesn't remove us from the responsibility for the war. We can not all go fight the war. There are many other things that must still be done at home. We should, for the reasons previously stated, support the cause for those we send.

The nation does, indeed, have the right to require its citizens to serve in the military if required. Right now, that requires Congressional approval but it isn't being solicited because it's not deemed necessary by those responsible. The military is not some kind of business opportunity that we can choose to support or not. We do, for now, have a choice to join or not join, but really should take up our responsibility to support the cause whether we serve or not. Even the county Sheriff can require your service on a posse, for example, if it were needed although these days its not used. The local Draft Board can require your military service as many young men have found out in years past. We are free to make some choices but some are made for us.

We got into the "military" topic because the subject of this thread was about how the military is handling the detainees at Guantanamo.

 

We are different nations but we do have some common goals and we are friendly neighbors. We must each choose what we deem best. We could always use the help, or support, of a good ally.

With respect to Iraq, I don't think it's as much that Americans are critical of Canadians for not committing to this war as it is Canadians being critical that Americans have. That, however, is just a perception and may not be completely accurate.

Canada, being affiliated with the British empire, was engaged in World War II earlier than the United States of America. We joined the fight not too long into the conflict and shed a whole lot of blood in it along with our great allies from the United Kingdom, Canada, and a host of others. Together we defeated the Germans in Europe. At the same time we also defeated the Japanese in Asia. That's what happens we good people work together with great resolve and give everything it takes.

On the other hand, for example, Canada did not join the war in Viet Nam and, in fact, provided safe harbor for many of our deserters. The lack of involvement was somewhat understandable despite the fact that Communism was a real threat to the free world including Canada. The harboring of deserters was something I don't understand. The announcement some time back of a monument being erected in a Canadian town to honor those deserters raised even more questions for me.

Now, the world faces the new threat of terrorism. Exactly where does Canada really stand in that matter? Are you with us, against us, don't care, or just watching? I'm not certain because I don't keep up with Canadian politics.

 

Hey brother, thank you for your excellent posts. I don't agree with everything you said but I appreciate them. I don't believe a nation has the right to force anyone to serve in the military. That seems a little communist-like to me.

Canadians for the most part are with you guys. I myself hope the war ends soon but I am kinda negative and realistic. The bible says terrorism will increase in the end times.

I would support you guys even more myself if I and my country were not subject to eneducated and misinformed "opinions" about us by those people who hate Canada.

You said: "America has to choose the course of action it takes based on the risks, the costs, and the potential outcomes. She has to do that with the best available information at hand based upon the situation at the time. America may choose to doing nothing in some cases, pursue endless diplomacy in others, or, when the situation merits it like Iraq, take on a military solution. There is nothing at all wrong with this. We're not obligated to solve every problem every where. We we do commit to a cause we are obligated to it and should but our best into it."
At least you are honest.

 

I am in full support of our military and their interrogation at Gitmo. Turning the A/C on and off and making the detainees stand barefoot on that cold floor may be torture to you but to me it is nothing. We have put directions on the bottom of their mattress's so they know which way is mecca when they do their prayers 5 times a day. I say we withhold their prayers until they give up useful intelligence. I know this is extreme, but believe me, if we don't do something it may be you or your child, or your grandchild that pays ultimately. You can't keep coddling the enemy folks.

 

"You can't keep coddling the enemy folks."

True. And the enemy probably feels the same way when they deal with you guys. Do all you want. Gas 'em (that would be a Hitler thing), chop em up in a meat grinder...go ahead. (just being facetious here folks...)

 

One big difference KJ.
We fight for our and others freedom.
They fight for domination.

You bringing up hitler does not surprise me either.