By faith or by choice

(Mat 15:26) And He answered and said, "It is not good to take the children's bread and throw it to the dogs."

 

Romans 4:20-21 He staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God; And being fully persuaded that, what he had promised, he was able also to perform.

This is a very good definition of faith--being fully persuaded that what God has promised he will do.
Abraham was a man of faith.

Often he was persuaded to make the right choice, and in faith did so.

 

Persuasion leads to a choice. Persusion always ends in a choice being made.

John

 

I dont' know if your theology is really illustrated by the comparisons you make, or if that's just "all you got".

Either way, your argument is weak.

John

 

The difference between me and Calvinists is that Calvinists think that man cannot resist that persuaion. I say he can else God would not tell over and over to choose to accept.

So if you really believe Calvinism then your statement here is wrong. Calvinism says that man cannot make a choice, but now you are saying he can. If salvation is forced on man, then there is no persuaion involved, nor is there a choice. It is what it is.

Your theology makes no sense

john

 

oooooooh, oooooooooh, oooooooooh, ooooooooh!!! I know the answer!!


Both!!

 

scripture please?

 

I agree with you in part here Brother. I do agree that faith is a gift of God. After He gives us faith, it is us who has to build upon that faith, by reading, praying, searching for His face, etc. It does state to add to your faith, knowledge, temperance, patience, brotherly kindness, etc.

Now, when I was lost, having a merry ole time, my faith was in me. I was self-sufficient, or so I thought. God came along, and showed me where my "merry ole life" was taking me. I truly came to the realization that without Him in my life, I was a goner. I then began to search for Him. I went to church, I read the word, I quit doing "things"(trying to save myself, IOW). It was in the end of my travail, I came to realize that I could do nothing to be saved. When I placed my trust/faith(given by Him), in Him, He saved me, gave me the wedding garment, a drink of that Living water that is a well in me springing up into eternal life, shoes for my feet, and His flesh to eat, and His blood to drink(spiritually speaking), and I gained eternal life right then and there!

 

Well, this is a deep subject, and I will try to be as concise as possible, without a bulk of words.

Definition of faith: The substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. (Heb. 11:1). By it(faith), the elders obtained a good report(verse 2).

Verse 6 in Hebrews 11 states that it is impossible to please God without faith. It also states that whosoever comes to God, must believe that He is a rewarder of them which diligently seek Him. So apparently, faith precedes salvation.

To single out faith, seems to lessen the salvation equation. Faith is but one part of salvation. You have to have santification, repentance, faith, justification, etc. Faith is a key in this equation, but its not the only thing.


Before someone is saved, they must have faith. Hebrews 11:1,2 sums that up correctly, I think. Look at the Pharisee and the Publican. One was "self-righteous", and had his faith in the Law. The Publican wouldn't even lift his head up, but wanted God to be merciful to a sinner. The Publican went away justified, because he placed his trust/faith in God(Luke 18).

I pray that this helps. If you need greater detail, or something else, please ask away, and I will do my best to answer you with scripture.

 

Remember, you can be persuaded to believe the wrong things, too. The Pharisee was persuaded that keeping the Law was sufficient. The rich youg ruler was also persuaded that keeping the Law would give him eternal life. Just because you have been persuaded one way or the other, doesn't guarantee that you correct. One can be persuaded to believe in UFO's and "little green men" from Mars, but that doesn't mean they exist. People are persuaded that in five billion years, the sun will burn itself out(I saw this on Discovery channel a while back, btw).


God showed me that He did exist, and I made light of it, and went on my "merry ole way". Thanks be to Him, He sought me ought, and He found me in a wastehowling wilderness, in a desertland, and kept me as the apple of His eye(Deut. 32:10).

 

If you will check you will see that I made no supernatural claims regarding the writings of Dr. Martyn Lloyd-Jones. As for the remainder of your comments feel free to take them up with Dr. Martyn Lloyd-Jones when you see him!

No! You are wrong Mr. DHK.

I am happy that you believe that your car, your wife, and your children are all worthy of your faith. However that faith, if you choose to call it that, has nothing to do with salvation. Salvation is not the intellectual assent to the facts of the incarnation, life, sacrificial death, and resurrection of Jesus Christ. Even the devils believe that:

James 2:19, KJV
19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

Matthew 8:29, KJV
29 And, behold, they cried out, saying, What have we to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before the time?

My apologies Mr.DHK, you did get one thing correct. Not intentionally since it demonstrates that all you have written above is false. Jesus Christ is indeed the Author of your faith.

Hebrews 12:2
Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.


Saving faith is not a natural attribute of mankind. Saving faith is the gift of God and that is according to the Bible!

 

That is the reason that "Saving Faith" is the gift of God.