Your side is not immune. It has been said all infants are "elect", therefore the same question can be turned back on you.
Calvinist assertions evaluated
Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Van, Apr 7, 2011.
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Iconoclast Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
Infants are unintentional sinners. Unintentional sin needs atonement. The atonement is Jesus Christ. God chooses & extends Grace unto these infants who die.
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it would be wrong as all died in adam
Not to put too fine a point on it, but Jesus referred to men who had "died in Adam" as innocents, Matthew 12:7. So referring to babies who died before they had done anything good or bad as innocents is not wrong.
Notice the quibbling over word usage, rather than a discussion of the thread. See a pattern? Calvinism is defended by evasion, shifting the subject and never putting the doctrines under the strong light of the Word. -
While I certainly think this is true it is going too far to make the statement as absolute as you have. There is simply not clear scripture to back it up. -
Not only is there no scriptural support for the idea, scripture actually precludes the view, because babies are "condemned already" because of unbelief. My view is consistent with all scripture, in my opinion.
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The big problem I have is when someone makes the statement in a dogmatic way. Then we have the problem with age and it carries so far that we would be better off not telling people about the gospel. I know people that teach that children are covered way up into the teen years and further which I totally disagree with. In fact I don't even include children, babies yes, children no, but neither do I put an exact cut off age on it. There is just not enough information. So I agree with you from a scriptural standpoint, but I also think there is room to at least hold that babies are covered somehow apart from faith. -
Perhaps you mean a site about the book, "The Reformed Doctrine of Predestination" by Loraine Boettner? -
All of those dying in infancy are among the elect.
David Google the above and up will pop lots of sites, including those that indicate Boettner made the statement on pages 148-149 of his book.
If you are curious about any of the Calvinist assertions in the opening post, just try Googling them. Enjoy! -
Calvinists simply tell the biblical truth. They put God before man.
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The Arminians and Non-Cals place God before man as well. Your descriptor precludes any possibility any another view does this, which in fact is nonfactual but an assumption. -
I disagree, Calvinism puts the cart before the horse. God is sovereign over man, but that does not mean God cannot allow man to exercise his will and make choices that alter the outcome of our lives, such as when God sets before us the choice of life or death and desires us to choose life.
Consider these verses:
James 2:5 says God chose the poor to the world. A Calvinist said this verse does not say God chose the poor while they were poor. This is not telling the biblical truth, this is rewriting scripture.
The redefine the meaning of words, choice includes the meaning Non-choice, etc, etc.
None of the TULI doctrines can be defended contextually. Not one. This is the biblical truth. -
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Iconoclast Well-Known MemberSite Supporter
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This quote comes from "11. Infant Salvation" on the Reformed Doctrine of Predestination site.you had written something like:
This quote comes from "11. Infant Salvation" from Boettner's book, The Reformed Doctrine of Predestination which can be read online here.Thanks again for your explanation.
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God knows all things He has chosen to know, and He could choose to know all things, but the bible says He chose not to know everything imaginable, such as the time of the Lord's return, and He forgives and remembers no more forever our sins. The Calvinist view is simply unbiblical.
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Also, seeing as how you insist that THE BIBLE SAYS that "He chose not to know everyting imaginable..." could you please offer a verse reference for that?
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