calvinists - just this one thing

The bulb completes the path for the current to flow. With an empty socket, you have an open circuit and current does not flow in an open circuit. Man is essential to the salvation equation.

 

I urge you to lay aside your human pride, Yelsew. Your salvation or damnation, as well as mine, is totally in God's hands. He will do with you, and me, as He wills. Simply accept that fact. There is nothing you can do to stop God from working out His will. Quit kicking against the goads.

 

Actually, it is. We sinned with Adam as well as being in Adam's loins as well as Adam representing all mankind in his testing period to keep God's law. I would hope none of us would have the audacity to claim that "If I had been in Adam's place, I would not have sinned. I would have been successful."

Also, I am re-thinking my position on "double predestination". I started reading an article on Monday on the subject of redemption and, perhaps with your prodding, I am beginning to see some possible truth in the "double predestination" position.

 

Aki, Jesus said that condemnation comes from man's unbelief. Like Salvation, Condemnation is actually and finally executed by God. Condemnation was not imputed by God into man, it is the natural result of unbelief. God does not impute evil into man, but allows man to continue on his own until the judgement where God saves the believers while casting the unbelievers into the lake of fire.

 

When at once the judgement is upon all men, none shall be unbelievers.
Condemnation must then be deeper than your first thoughts upon it.
Bro. Dallas

 

It is not a matter of condemnation being imputed as it is simply a straight-out result of sin entering the world. But imputation is important as the only way to stand as righteous before God is for Christ Jesus' righteousness to be imputed to us as our sin was imputed to Him as He suffered the penalty for our sin on the cross.

 

Clever phraseology, but what you've said is trumped by what Jesus said.

 

again you are correct...
Jesus said none can come to him except the Father draw him, and he said all who come he would in no wise cast out, then I believe that all who come do so only because of the drawing of the father...then Jesus said ...him I shall raise up at the last day...then I believe that this eternal life is just what Jesus said it was eternal and cannot be altered, or lost by any means.

And I am right too, the Bible declares that every knee shall bow and every tongue shall confess, then if your belief is correct and all do bow the knee and confess with the mouth that Christ is Lord, then all shall be saved!!

Let's shut down the BB, all churches and just go home...then maybe we can all just get along, we can let immorality, murders,killings robberies, cheatings, rapings all like such go unmolested in this world, after all we each have the right to please ourselves, so why not, then at the last day when we are asked whether we believe or not, because this foolishness that is preached that we had no interest in hearing in this world, thus denying the Glory owed to our creator, all men will in unison declare I believe and having stated it upon the lips, all men, by the Scripture must be redeemed, thus hell and the lake of fire will freeze over and we all shall live happily ever after.

Yelsew,

The word of God is not Mother Goose; it contains a mixture of the Grimm brothers as well.

Bro. Dallas

 

It is not a matter of condemnation being imputed as it is simply a straight-out result of sin entering the world. But imputation is important as the only way to stand as righteous before God is for Christ Jesus' righteousness to be imputed to us as our sin was imputed to Him as He suffered the penalty for our sin on the cross. </font>[/QUOTE]The purpose of Jesus dying on the cross is so that sin is not a factor at the final judgment. That judgment will be on the basis of belief or lack of belief. Believer's saved, unbelievers cast into the lake of fire.

 

If sin is so accounted for why do we still die by the wages thereof? If it so accounted for then why is the Bible clear to say they are judged according to their works?

All falls into place by the doctrine of Sovereign Grace;

Bro. Dallas

 

I am sorry you have such a low view of Christ Jesus' substitionary atonement, Yelsew. I know we do not agree on this very important subject and that saddens me.

 

If that is what you believe, then you can throw the Book of Revelation out of your bible for even satan and his demons confess who Jesus is and will bow to His power.

Every knee bowing and every tongue confessing is not a salvation event, but rather an acknowledgement of the supreme power and majesty of Jesus. Some will bow in adoration of their savior, but most will bow in defeat before the victor, the Worthy Lamb of God slain from before the foundation of the world! Then the judgment where the unbelievers are cast into the lake of fire.

 

If sin were a factor at at the judgment throne of God, then why the atonement?

 

you are the one who said all that was necessary was belief, that all judgement was declared on belief, you are the one who beleives the atonement covered all sin, not me.

You said:

It was and is the covering for the sins of the elect, including unbelief, all sin is now atoned for among that heavenly host, now, past, future, wherever they are found to be, they are atoned for; to extend the atonement any further than these is unbiblical.

Bro. Dallas

 

I am sorry you have such a low view of Christ Jesus' substitionary atonement, Yelsew. I know we do not agree on this very important subject and that saddens me. </font>[/QUOTE]What are you talking about? Give me one good reason for the atonement if it is not to make all mankind stand before the Judgment throne of God with equal status with the only difference among them being their faith condition? Works have already been judged as if by fire, Sins have been atoned for, leaving only the faith condition of each person to be judged.

What is so difficult that you cannot understand the plain truth?

 

Talk about unbiblical, there is no scripture that supports your point of view.

 

What verse are you referring to that states that the demons will bow their knees and confess that Jesus is Lord as people will do?

 

What verse are you referring to that states that the demons will bow their knees and confess that Jesus is Lord as people will do? </font>[/QUOTE]Rev 20:10. "Then the devil, who led them astray, was hurled into the lake of fire and sulphur, where the beast and the false prophet are, and their torture will not come to an end, day or night, for ever and ever". I used bow to his power to indicate their fate, you know, the "last man standing" scenario. I did not say that Satan and his demons will call Jesus Lord. I did say the will bow to his power.