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Featured Can anyone please explain this passage?

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by Torah1st, Jun 2, 2019.

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  1. Torah1st

    Torah1st New Member

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    Can anyone please explain this passage?:

    [Mat 7:21-23 KJV] 21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
     
  2. Alcott

    Alcott Well-Known Member
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    You need to be more specific. It is self-evident that many people who refer to Jesus as Lord do not really regard him as Lord. And many will claim to have done great things in his name, but their motives were other than glorifying him-- think televangelists, for one example.

    So what specifically are you asking about the passage?
     
  3. Torah1st

    Torah1st New Member

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    Thanks for responding.

    I guess the question is what is "iniquity" and how can people who obviously believe they "know the Lord" be so deceived?
     
  4. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    Torah first. What's in a name? Old Covenant takes precedent over the New? Are you Jewish?
     
  5. Rob_BW

    Rob_BW Well-Known Member
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    Iniquity = sin.
     
  6. Torah1st

    Torah1st New Member

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    Yes what is in a name, "kyredneck"?

    I doubt if I am Jewish outwardly but it doesn't matter "we are all one in Messiah" Gal 3:28

    I believe that Torah is eternal. Torah is the moral code we are to live by. Just like 2+2=4 it does not change or get abolished. Would the Creator abolish his condemnation of murder? Of course not.

    But the tutor of animal sacrifice for atonement of sin was replaced by the new testament Blood sacrifice of Messiah. A better covenant based on better promises. Our sins are forgiven not covered, they are separated from us as far as the east is from the west.

    That is all that changed, we keep the 10 commandments and 7 feasts.
     
  7. Torah1st

    Torah1st New Member

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    I think "iniquity" it is more than that.

    I see this verse as a warning. It is a prophesy. "...in that day" many will call my Name like they know Me, but I will say I never knew you. Then He says why He never knew you. It's because you worked/practiced "iniquity".

    So the logical thing to do is define "iniquity".

    STRONGS NT 458: ἀνομία
    ἀνομία, -ας, ἡ, (ἄνομος);
    1. properly, the condition of one without law — either because ignorant of it, or because violating it.
    2. contempt and violation of law, iniquity, wickedness:

    So Messiah never knew those who "do not practice the law/torah".

    Case and point:
    Matt 19:16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? 17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? [there is] none good but one, [that is], God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
     
  8. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    ...the context is whether the Lord knew them, as in: "Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?" Acts of the Apostles 9:4

    ...or:

    "Behold, an Israelite indeed, in whom is no guile!" John 1:47
     
  9. Torah1st

    Torah1st New Member

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    Context is not applicable, there is only the blunt Truth.

    Jhn 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

    (then you won't be deceived)

    What could be simpler?
     
  10. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    I will if you will answer these questions;

    1) Are you a Hebrew Roots (HR) follower?
    2) Are you a Trinitarian?
    3) Can you confess that Jesus Christ is Almighty God come in the flesh?
     
  11. Torah1st

    Torah1st New Member

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    1. No
    2. No (not sure what that is but there are 3 separate Beings)
    3. Sure, but I prefer Ahashua HaMashiach and He is coming back again
     
  12. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Very slim answers but as promised the explanation of the Matthew 7 passage:

    There are many who talk the talk but don't walk the walk.
     
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  13. Alcott

    Alcott Well-Known Member
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    Who is "we?" Those who kept them all before?
    I endeavor to keep 8 .1/2 of those commandments, as revealed in the NT. The sabbath is not required [Romans 14:5-6; Colossians 2:16], and in the second commandment, the command not to make any likeness of anything is not repeated, or it would rule out photography, engineering drawing, computer icons,... but certainly the command to not worship what we 'make' is there and is expounded. And one of the most prevalent sins in the USA is the worship of money and celebrity.

    As to feasts, Colossians 2:16 also covers them and new moons or special days. Our only command is to remember the the cup, representing the blood, and the bread, representing the body, of Christ and his sacrifice.
     
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  14. Torah1st

    Torah1st New Member

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    Amazing, you qualify me with a job interview then come back with the lamest of platitudes.

    So how does anyone know if they "walk the walk"?

    As you can probably guess I have a theory, but you don't have to wait until Judgment Day to find out.

    Read the Scriptures and discern what it plainly states:

    I see this verse as a warning. It is a prophesy. "...in that day" many will call my Name like they know Me, but I will say I never knew you. Then He says why He never knew you. It's because you worked/practiced "iniquity".

    So the logical thing to do is define "iniquity".

    STRONGS NT 458: ἀνομία
    ἀνομία, -ας, ἡ, (ἄνομος);
    1. properly, the condition of one without law — either because ignorant of it, or because violating it.
    2. contempt and violation of law, iniquity, wickedness:

    So Messiah never knew those who "do not practice the law/torah".

    Case and point:
    Matt 19:16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? 17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? [there is] none good but one, [that is], God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
     
  15. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    lol, well nothing to discuss here....
     
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  16. Torah1st

    Torah1st New Member

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    Good, I am glad to hear you are open to the concept that we are required to do something. You may be the least in the kingdom but if we do something we will be in the kingdom. (Matt 5:19)
     
  17. Torah1st

    Torah1st New Member

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    Let me restate the question:

    So Matt 19:16 when Messiah says "if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments."

    Is He lying?
     
  18. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    If you are saying that Jesus means the Torah, there are 613 commandments - mitzvoth - which comprise the Law.

    Judaism 101: A List of the 613 Mitzvot (Commandments)

    Break one, break them all.

    James 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.

    And incurs a curse:

    Galatians 3:10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
     
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  19. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    Which? [Matthew 19:18] (though not to you, context matters to me)
     
  20. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    No. while the theocracy of Israel was here maintained by the levitical priesthood, keeping the commandments kept one from being stoned to death (for instance).
     
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