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Cash for clunkers: A mess. Typical.

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rbell

Active Member
SOURCE

And so, (as one would expect) the "cash for clunkers" program is a logistical mess.

Dealers are confused. The website that tells sellers what's available keeps crashing. Rendering the cars undriveable (a requirement of the plan) is wasteful and might create more environmental problems than simply letting the clunkers keep on driving.

Excerpts:

Barry Magnus, the general manager of DCH Paramus Honda, told us he was owed more than $80,000, and he wondered if he would ever see it. The government has said it would take 10 days to reimburse the dealers, but that was before the program apparently ran out of money and devolved into chaos Thursday night.
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(car dealer) Ms. Maggio said she generally makes her profit by reselling the engines, the most valuable parts of the cars she takes, but that’s not posible with the cars coming to her because of the cash for clunkers program, because they have been rendered unusable. That cuts down the salvage value of the cars — and the incentive for salvage yards and wreckers to take them — to almost nothing, considering the time and energy they must spend in going to the dealer, towing back the dead cars, removing the engines, crushing the bodies and shipping them to a metal scrap shredder and recycler.
And, of course, the process reduces the supply of used engines for people who can’t afford to buy a new car and come to the salvage yard looking to fix up old ones.
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******

OK, so that's the article. Below are my thoughts:



So, let's see what this "Stroke of genius" program is doing and will do:
  • We must keep in mind: this is taxpayer money. In other words, you and I are helping people buy a new car. This is simply wrong. I've bought ten cars in my life. My aunt helped me a little with one. The government, none. And, because I believe in self-sufficiency, and because it offends me personally to be buying cars for others with money I need...I refuse to participate. What a stupid use of our hard-earned dollars.
  • This program will hurt the poor. My father has been in this business for nearly fifty years, and so this point does come with a modicum of expertise. The priced of used/remanned engines will skyrocket. Laws of scarcity. Since it is mandated by Those Who Know Best For Us that these "clunker" engines must be destroyed...fewer engines are available to be reconditioned and sold. Thus, with supply scarce...up goes the price. And those who need this--the poor who can't buy a new car but could possibly afford a used one, or a "new" engine--are left high and dry.
  • Remember what happened with housing--the beginning of the crash? The banks lent to too many people who shouldn't have received a loan. Well...here we go again. Scores of people are getting cars who really can't afford it. How long until defaults begin to mess up GMAC and their fellow organizations?
  • Remember...this is a government program. Thus, it is proving to be slow in repayment, inefficient, and confusing (surprise, surprise). Dealers, with a razor-thin margin anyway, coming off a big recession, and with some now technically being arms of the government and unions (Government Motors, anyone)...they can't afford to wait the weeks and months for the "clunker" repayments. But guess what? It's government, so it's happening exactly that way. These dealerships can't afford a cash-flow problem...but that's what they're going to get.
Boy, socialism and entitlement-ism is lots of fun...until the details come out. Now THAT'S a clunker.
 
Bro. Curtis

Bro. Curtis

<img src =/curtis.gif>
Site Supporter
The programs initial investment was supposed to last until October. It lasted 4 days. And the answer, of course, is to invest twice as much money in it ?

These folks are idiots.

And also remember, this was something they stuck into a WAR FUNDING BILL!!!!

Let's put them in charge of Health Care.
 
T

targus

New Member
Robert Snow said:
Cash for clunkers is a success! What we need if to increase the funding for this program ten-fold!
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It remains to be seen if it is a success or not.

Dealers have not yet been paid - and many are concerned that they never will be.

The government administrators don't have any idea of how many cars have been sold under this program or what it has cost so far.

There is the legitimate concern over the required scrapping of the trade-ins which very well may result in higher repair costs down the road for older cars due to a lack of recycled parts.

There is a legitimate concern about the repayment of loans for the new vehicles being purchased since it is possible that the buyers may not be credit worthy.

We don't know the actual effect on the economy due to the program. Are we getting something for the taxpayer money being paid for the trade ins? What is the device for measuring the return on investment?

If it is a negative return, if dealers don't ever actually get paid, etc. - wouldn't it be a bit foolish to increase it ten-fold?

Wouldn't it be a bit foolish to increase it ten-fold without having answers to any of the above?
 
R

rbell

Active Member
Robert Snow said:
Cash for clunkers is a success! What we need if to increase the funding for this program ten-fold!
Click to expand...

Wow.

I offer specifics, Robert offers cheerleading.

I guess it's clear who has thought through this issue more thoroughly.

By the way, Robert:

How much money do you have a right to take from someone who earned it, and give it to someone else to buy a car...using money they did not earn?
 
M

Martin

Active Member
If this is what they do with cars, I just can't wait to see what they do with health insurance. :BangHead:
 
Aaron

Aaron

Member
Site Supporter
Cash for clunkers was about getting vehicles with the mythical large "carbon footprints" off the roads. It wasn't about helping the poor or the auto industry.

You think this was a fiasco, wait to Cap and Trade becomes a reality.

God help us.
 
Aaron

Aaron

Member
Site Supporter
rbell said:
Wow.

I offer specifics, Robert offers cheerleading.

I guess it's clear who has thought through this issue more thoroughly.
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Socialists are liars. You have to keep that firmly in mind if interacting with them isn't going to drive you insane. <edited-LE> knows it was a disaster, but no Socialist is going to allow anyone to shine the light on his evil deeds, regardless of the extremes to which he must stretch.

As soon as they're bold enough, Socialists will exchange ludicrous rhetoric for the point of gun.
 
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tinytim

<img src =/tim2.jpg>
Robert Snow said:
Cash for clunkers is a success! What we need if to increase the funding for this program ten-fold!
Click to expand...


How does the ignore function work?

For the first time in 6 yrs that I have been on BB... I want to use it.

Socialists that claim to follow the Bible disturbs me... and I am choosing to ignore their ignorant philosophy...
 
W

windcatcher

New Member
Aaron said:
Cash for clunkers was about getting vehicles with the mythical large "carbon footprints" off the roads. It wasn't about helping the poor or the auto industry.

You think this was a fiasco, wait to Cap and Trade becomes a reality.

God help us.
Click to expand...

Personally I think its about getting people out of cars altogether..... for those who 'qualify' but later default.

Also, practically all new cars come with GPS ....... many of the old 'clunkers' lack this.

I got a notice in the mail which suggested my car might be eligible...... It must be drivable when I bring it in but scars and dents don't matter....... and it must be less than 18mpg. Well..... my ford 98 gets between 22/24 mpg..... so that boots me out.

Bonus, in my estimation....... it doesn't have GPS. But they can find me any way.... if I have my cell phone with me.

Big Brother Government..... I don't need or want you!
 
L

LadyEagle

<b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>
Aaron said:
Socialists are liars. You have to keep that firmly in mind if interacting with them isn't going to drive you insane. Robert Snow-job knows it was a disaster, but no Socialist is going to allow anyone to shine the light on his evil deeds, regardless of the extremes to which he must stretch.

As soon as they're bold enough, Socialists will exchange ludicrous rhetoric for the point of gun.
Click to expand...

You got that right. :(
 
L

LadyEagle

<b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>
The plan is very obvious on the Cash for Clunkers plan. They are destroying the drive trains and engines, which must be done like within 24 hours or something, crush the vehicle and send it to China. All of this is designed to make replacement parts hard to get on vehicles so we will be forced to drive the "green" little nothings the government owned GM is going to churn out.

I wonder if they will have a cash for lightbulbs rebate when the law says we can't buy the regular ones anymore and are forced to buy those new energy ones made only in China and filled with mercury. In the meantime, we continue to stockpile everytime we go to Lowes. We will never replace our lightbulbs. You better start to stockpile light bulbs now before the idea catches on and there is a shortage, FWIW. I looked at the prices of those new bulbs the other day. I can buy a 4-pack of 60 watts for a buck, but the new ones were 2 in a package for $6-7 bucks.

Back on topic - socialism and free hand outs with our tax dollars.

I pity the poor dealers. First they had it stuck to them by the automakers and now it looks like the feds are going to stick it to them, too. The dealers are the ones who will suffer on this and be left in the hole.
 
Bro. Curtis

Bro. Curtis

<img src =/curtis.gif>
Site Supporter
Robert Snow said:
Cash for clunkers is a success! What we need if to increase the funding for this program ten-fold!
Click to expand...

At the current rate, they underestimated the project by a mere $15 Billion.

That's 15 fold. And that's giving them leeway they don't really deserve.

If you consider that a success, please don't ask me to become a business partner with you.
 
R

Robert Snow

New Member
tinytim said:
How does the ignore function work?

For the first time in 6 yrs that I have been on BB... I want to use it.

Socialists that claim to follow the Bible disturbs me... and I am choosing to ignore their ignorant philosophy...
Click to expand...

So, you think only Capitalists are Christians?
 
D

donnA

Active Member
we heard on the news the other night this prgram was broke, and dealer weren't getting reimbursed from the governement, and were going to be repoing some cars if the buyers didn't reimburse them. I guess their getting their $4500 from someone.

the only success from this program is that the governement is paying for cars for the rich, and at the same time taking good usable cars off the market that people who aren't rich have to drive. These cars aren't cars that don't work, one of the qualifications is the new car must get at least 4 miles per gallon more then the current car. Nothing wrong with 25 miles per gallon, I've seen commercials for new stuff that doesn't get the milage my old car gets.
 
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