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Cessationism or Continuationism

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Mikey, Mar 31, 2019.

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  1. Cessationism

    15 vote(s)
    68.2%
  2. Continuationism

    7 vote(s)
    31.8%
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  1. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    All believers believe because they have the Holy Spirit. But the charismatic gifts ceased with the apostles.
     
  2. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Not according the 1 Corinthians 12 & 1 Corinthians 14. I am a professed Cessationist according to 1 Corithians 13:8-12 and Revelation 1:1 & Revelation 22:18. As I have explained in this thread. Have you read my posts?
     
  3. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Define what you mean by "third wave?" Or are you continuing with false accusations?
     
  4. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    3rd way not 3rd wave.
     
  5. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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  6. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    And what do you mean? Balance what? Means of distribution of what?

    I hold two speaking gifts where said to be "in part," 1 Corinthians 13:9. And those two as speaking gifts are side to be "done away," 1 Corinthians 13:8, 1 Corinthians 13:10.

    What is perfect, James 1:17; James 1:25.

    The two gifts "in part" would be done away by a perfect, 1 Corinthians 13:10. The Apostle Paul would be present with the Lord when this would take place, 1 Corinthians 13:12; 2 Corinthians 5:8. And the Revelation 1:1 of Jesus Christ (Revelation 19:10; Luke 24:44) would have a seal upon it not to add the hearing of it, Revelation 22:18.
     
  7. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    You are getting into areas that lead nowhere. If you realize the gifts came in only two ways, now extinct, it helps resolve these passages.
     
  8. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    So there is no way that God could supernaturally empower a missionary with the gifts of tongues, since there are no apostles around to lay hands on them. This is what I mean by limiting the sovereignty of God.

    Sent from my Pixel 2 XL
     
  9. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    Tongues were not what you seem to think they are.
     
  10. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    First off, the notion that all the gifts ended with the Apostles is an interpretation not an explicit teaching of the word of God. It is just not.

    Answer this, when is the following referring to? ". . . I will give you a mouth and wisdom, . . ." v.15, Luke 21:10-20. It explicitly states a promise of a word of wisdom.
     
  11. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Two things here. Tongues became inoperative when the two gifts were "done away." And God is not going to countermand His own word. 1 Corinthians 13:8-12; v.12, ". . . face to face . . . ." 2 Corinthians 5:8; ". . . perfect . . . ." James 1:17; Revelation 22:18, ". . . that heareth . . . ."
     
  12. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    This "wisdom" existed long before the gifts. You need to study the subject apart from the Pentecostal framework they force onto scripture. Nobody knows less about the gifts than the Pentecostals.
     
  13. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    That is an interpertation. And thank you, you answered part of what I was asking, but the "when" for that given word of wisdom was not clearly answered. This interpertation seems to be rooted in the interpertation that all or any of the New Covenant gifts of the Spirit are only possible through the laying on of hands of the Apostles. (Special Pleading.)

    In around 1968 dealt with Pentecostals. They are in error regarding the gifts of tougues and the working of the Holy Spirit. I did my first exhaustive study on the Holy Spirit at that time.
     
    #113 37818, Apr 6, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2019
  14. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    We can play around with interpretations to no avail. But only direct quotes from scripture prove a point. So far scripture says the gifts came through the two outpourings, or through an apostle's hands. No other means is accounted for.
     
  15. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    A special pleading in that you disallow an explicit exception cited Acts of the Apostles 10:43-46.
     
  16. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    This was one of two outpourings. First the Jewish. Then 7 years later the gentile outpouring. Beyond these two scripture only mentions an apostle as the means of distributing the gifts.
     
  17. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Still a special pleading, and not according to 1 Corinthians 12:11; Acts of the Apostles 10:43-46.
     
  18. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    You can make it say what you like, but you need to find direct quotes defining the means of distribution, which I have provided. Otherwise you are ripe for the picking.
     
  19. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    I gave a direct quote, 1 Corinthians 12:11.

    Cessationism and continuationism are matters of interpretation. There is what the word of God says and what it does not say. Interpretation being the who, what, when, where, how and why of it. Disagreement comes in what is being denied or added to what it actually says. Generalizations versus deductions, the generalization will be wrong of the two.
     
    #119 37818, Apr 6, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2019
  20. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    Re;

    11 But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.

    “Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John: Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost: (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.)” (Acts 8:14–17)

    “Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost. And when Simon saw that through laying on of the apostles’ hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money,” (Acts 8:17–18)

    “For I long to see you, that I may impart unto you some spiritual gift, to the end you may be established;” (Romans 1:11)
     
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