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Featured Christians and the Law

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Mikey, Jul 28, 2018.

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OT Moral Law still binding on Christians?

Poll closed Aug 25, 2018.
  1. Yes

    7 vote(s)
    50.0%
  2. No

    7 vote(s)
    50.0%
  1. Mikey

    Mikey Active Member

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    What relationship do Christians in the New Testament have with the Old Testament Laws? CT states that there is a Threefold division in the law Civil, Ceremonial and Moral - with only the Moral Law still binding to Christians. Dispensationalists, NCT and others believe the whole law is no longer binding ( that the divisions are imposed on the text) and are only under the laws in the New Testament - law of Christ.

    So what evidence is there for the Threefold division?
    What are the issues that develop when the OT law is no longer binding?
     
  2. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
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    The Law was never intended to save. It showed us what was wrong.

    The Law directs us to Christ for salvation and Christ directs us back to the Law for regulation.
     
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  3. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    New Covenant theolgy hold also with no more law upon us now, as we just are under "Law of Christ"
    We are still under the Moral aspects of the law, as we are indeed saved by Grace alone thru faith alone, but once saved, God expects us to be moral people!
     
  4. Mikey

    Mikey Active Member

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    The OT law or only the moral law? Should the Civil law be used by Christians?
     
  5. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    No, as the ceremonial/civil aspect of the law just was in use during the Old Covenant relationship between God and Israel!
     
  6. Mikey

    Mikey Active Member

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    Yes I looked into NCT, the main sticking point between them and CT is the issue of the Sabbath as both accept the other 9 of the 10 commandments (though from different avenues)
     
  7. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    They deny that we still have an obligation to keep a day unto the Lord, whether we chose topdo it Sat/Sun or whenever!
     
  8. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    We are NOT (normally) under the Law

    John 1:17 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

    Galatians 5:18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.

    This I can say from experience having wandered from the leading of the Spirit - I came back under the law and it was a 24/7 terror - read Psalm 88 (this was my daily bread).

    Yes He delivered me from what I deserved ... wonderfully ... but a wounded spirit who can bear?

    Keep this precious gift intact :

    2 Corinthians 4:7 But we have this treasure (the Spirit) in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.

    And you will never fear the curse of the Law.
     
  9. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    When whena re walking in the Spirit, we will be found then obeying the Law!
     
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  10. Mikey

    Mikey Active Member

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    My understanding is NCT still believes that they should have a particular day to worship, but reject the Sabbatarian elements of the day of worship. which some CT believe were transferred from the Sabbeth to the Lords day. eg no shopping, no use of public transport, no recreational activities. a day dedicated to the Lord.
     
  11. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    How would you see it?
     
  12. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Not every jot and tittle. Have a ham sandwich! :)
     
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  13. Dave G

    Dave G Well-Known Member

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    To me, that's actually a complicated question.

    Based on what I see in Scripture, the Law was meant as the schoolmaster to bring the believer to Christ ( Galatians 3:24 ). Also, we are to obey the ordinances of men ( 1 Peter 2:13-17 ) unless they conflict with God's commandments. Finally, we will be found to obey the Law when we as believers are walking in the Spirit ( Romans 8:4 ).

    "And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:" ( Mark 2:27 )

    " He that regardeth the day, regardeth [it] unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard [it]. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks." ( Romans 14:6 )

    As I see it, taking a day off was intended for man to rest from his work, just as God rested from His work in Creation. We are not bound to it, but are blessed by it.
     
  14. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    The TEN Commandments ARE the Old Covenant the New Covenant replaced them.

    In Exodus 34:28 we read: “And He (God) wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the Ten Commandments.”

    Deuteronomy 4:13: “And He declared unto you His covenant, which He commanded you to perform, even the Ten Commandments.”

    Deuteronomy 9:9: “When I was gone up into the mount to receive the tables of stone, even the tables of the covenant.

    Deuteronomy 9:15: “So I turned and came down from the mount . . . and the two tables of the covenant were in my two hands.”

    Deuteronomy 10:8: “At that time the LORD set apart the tribe of Levi to carry the ark of the LORD’s covenant, to stand before the LORD to serve him, and to formulate blessings in his name, as they do to this very day.”

    And Jeremiah and Hebrews say Christ replaced the Old Covenant with the New.

    ““Indeed, a time is coming,” says the Lord, “when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel and Judah. It will not be like the old covenant that I made with their ancestors when I delivered them from Egypt. For they violated that covenant, even though I was like a faithful husband to them,” says the Lord. “But I will make a new covenant with the whole nation of Israel after I plant them back in the land,” says the Lord. “I will put my law within them and write it on their hearts and minds. I will be their God and they will be my people.” (Jeremiah 31:31–33) (NET)


    “For if that first covenant had been faultless, no one would have looked for a second one. But showing its fault, God says to them, “Look, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will complete a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah. “It will not be like the covenant that I made with their fathers, on the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of Egypt, because they did not continue in my covenant and I had no regard for them, says the Lord. “For this is the covenant that I will establish with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord. I will put my laws in their minds and I will inscribe them on their hearts. And I will be their God and they will be my people. “And there will be no need at all for each one to teach his countryman or each one to teach his brother saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ since they will all know me, from the least to the greatest. “For I will be merciful toward their evil deeds, and their sins I will remember no longer.” When he speaks of a new covenant, he makes the first obsolete. Now what is growing obsolete and aging is about to disappear.” (Hebrews 8:7–13) (NET)

    Since Christ abolished the Old Covenant, we use the Ten Commandments for instruction and commentary in defining outward sin. But Before the Ten Commandments and during the time of the Old Covenant, believers like Abraham had the two great commandments written in their heart. Just as believers today. Indeed, Jesus said the Ten Commandments hung from the two great commandments.

    “Master, which is the great commandment in the law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.” (Matthew 22:36–40)

    The two great commandments work this way: They do the opposite of what the Ten Commandments forbade: If love motivates your thoughts and actions, you won't want to steal or murder. Instead of stealing you will want to give. Instead of murdering you will love your enemies and bless them instead. Instead of simply not lying about others, you will promote them as you do your own-self.....
     
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  15. Mikey

    Mikey Active Member

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    I do not hold that the rules governing the Sabbath have been moved to the Sunday ( eg No work, No Leisure activities). I believe that a day should be set aside where Christians are able to worship together(this is commanded). That everyday man is to read/dwell on scripture/God.

    In terms of the Moral law. As Christians we should attempt to do what pleases the law and not do what displeases him. the moral commands/right and wrong did not change when in the NT. Though in the NT the laws were expounded upon. (eg “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery. But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.)

    the issue I have with NCT is the use of only the Law of Christ (NT) for there are commands that a Christian should still obey that are not restated - eg avoiding Incest.

    But just obeying the law is not the priority, it is the two greatest commandments. “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart ... ‘Love your neighbour as yourself." that it is the motivation for keeping the commands that is important. That if you truly love God then by default you will obey.
     
  16. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    If we are born of the Spirit being indwelt and led by Him we won't need the law.

    1 Timothy 1:9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
     
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  17. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    Believers are not "under the law" as one is under the ruling of parents.

    Believers are not lawless, either.

    There are two great commandments that the Lord Jesus Christ gave, believers follow those two commandments.
     
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  18. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    1 Corinthians 13.
     
  19. Mikey

    Mikey Active Member

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    So how do you use the parts of Scripture that are about the Law?
     
  20. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Examples?

    The law definitely has its use in this age:

    Romans 3:19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.
     
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