Featured Confirmation in 2013 of Prophetic Messages

Did you quote something? "err... umm... NO"

Did you establish yourself as the medical genius of our day? "err... umm... NO"

Are we supposed to resort to you - on question about how heat and pressure affect the mind over time? "err... umm... NO"

Really? THAT is the basis of your doctrine? "err.. umm..... yes??"

Seriously??

While your methods are surprising at times - they are at least consistent - I grant you that.

And so once again - you have unwittingly raised a good question for thought.

Consider the state of Medicine in the mid 1800's. Now observe the claim in the link - that God came to a prophet in the 1860's and gave a message about health and establishing hospitals and Sanitariums on and entirely difference foundation than the corrupt state of Medicine in the 1860's.

http://amazingdiscoveries.org/S-prophecy-Ellen_White-true-predictions-Bible

What is "supposed" to be the result of such a claim? -- Hint look at the actual "details"

Hint: Seventh-day Adventists never claim to get their doctrine from Ellen White - but we always claim to have gotten our health message from no-other source but the messages God gave Ellen White - a woman with only a 3rd grade education.

Instead of telling us that you are a great medical genius that needs not quote anything or refer to any science - present a compelling case using actual "details".

The fact that you unwittingly point to the most verifiable evidence in favor of the ministry God gave Ellen White - cannot possibly be an accident.

 

In Targus never ending pursuit of "playbook" web searches to find material that can be posted without actually knowing anything about the subject - we have this.

What a perfect place for Targus to insert his own medical understanding of those conditioins in the 1800's - and prove from his vast wealth of science just what the impact on the brain was when engaged in those practices of the 1800's.

Did you do some medical experiment/study to discover the conditions in the 1800's for wigs and then a 20 year study to see if there is a statistical test for the idea? No? So you have nothing?

And this is your final Bible test?? Really?

If your claim is to have dissproven some unquoted claim - feel free to provide your tests, your data.

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And so once again - you have unwittingly raised a good question for thought.

Consider the state of Medicine in the mid 1800's. Now observe the claim in the link - that God came to a prophet in the 1860's and gave a message about health and establishing hospitals and Sanitariums on and entirely difference foundation than the corrupt state of Medicine in the 1860's.

http://amazingdiscoveries.org/S-prop...dictions-Bible

What is "supposed" to be the result of such a claim? -- Hint look at the actual "details"

Quote:
The Battle Creek Sanitarium in Battle Creek, Michigan, United States, was a health resort based on the health principles advocated by the Seventh-day Adventist Church,
...

The sanitarium became a destination for both prominent and middle-class American citizens. Celebrated American figures who visited the sanitarium (including Mary Todd Lincoln and Sojourner Truth) would influence and encourage enthusiasm for health and wellness among the general population. "Battle Creek Sanitarium was world renowned and became the 'in' place for the rich and famous to seek their lost health, to listen to health lectures and to learn and practice the principles of a healthy lifestyle".[8]
Hint: Seventh-day Adventists never claim to get their doctrine from Ellen White - but we always claim to have gotten our health message from no-other source but the messages God gave Ellen White - a woman with only a 3rd grade education.

in Christ,

Bob

 

What a perfect place for Targus to insert his own medical understanding of those conditioins in the 1800's - and prove from his vast wealth of science just what the impact on the brain was when engaged in those practices of the 1800's.

Always glad to get the benefit of Targus' research into the practices of the 1800's and his vast experience in conducting clinical trials to test this or that theory regarding mental health.

No need to use bible tests for this topic - after all - we have the all-knowing decision of Targus to guide.

Well I believe in free will - if there are others wiling to dscard reason and the Bible to use such methods as is suggested above - feel free to do it. I am not trying to dissuade you from your determined course.

My posting is more directed toward the objective unbiased readers - who actually pay attention "to details".

I think we can all see these last two points - no matter what view of this we take.

in Christ,

Bob

 

Targus -

So far all the trial balloons you have tried to float from your playbook website bashing SDAs have flopped.

Summary.

1. They rely on our gullibility - supposing that your knowledge of health, styles and practices of the 1800's is so profound that we should trust you as "the source" and authority for all issues related to health in the 1800's. Really - you think this is the one that the objective unbiased readers will fall for?? Be serious.

2. They rely on your ability to ignore the details in Jeremiah 18 regarding conditional prophecy and the perfect example of that that we have in the book of Jonah. Again - is this where the objective unbiased reader was supposed to fall for that practice of "pay less attention to Bible doctrine" that you are suggesting? Your playbook let you down on that one.

3. They rely on your ability to know the secret plans of various nations or the hidden agenda of the future even - future to our own time as "proof" that some contrary scenario is not in fact the one that will play out. Here again - your playbook has let you down.

AT the outset I said that ignoring all that fluff, smoke and mirrors was a better way to go. The testable features of this subject are in the area of Bible doctrine - Isaiah 8:20 "To the LAW and to the Testimony if they speak not according to THIS Word - there is no light in them".

Why not go with some avenue that you can possibly hope to make stand that appeals to "detail" and "actual fact"??

In the mean time - by following the course suggested to you by your playbook - you opened a door to one of the strongest proofs in favor of Ellen White's Ministry. The fact of the health message given to Ellen White - that launched an entire series of health Sanitariums world wide - that were well known for advancements in healing, admitting to the practices being given them by Ellen White.

Every time you think you have just the complaint you need - it turns out to be a win for the 1Cor 12 gift a prophecy and a loss for your playbook.

in Christ,

Bob

 

While "a few" appear to want to settle for acrimony and name-calling as the full "substance" of their posting here - I will take the high ground - of going back to "the details" they are so desperately ignoring in the OP

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Originally Posted by targus
How do you know that God has given prophetic messages through Ellen White?




1. The Bible tells us to accept the messages God gives to His prophets for the church (see 1Thess 5:19-20, Isaiah 8) and to "desire earnestly spiritual gifts especially that you may prophesy" 1Cor 14:1.

2. But God also tells us to "test the spirits" and to discern between true prophets and false prophets (1Johh 4:1-3). Notice that God does not say "the test is - the prophet has to be named the Apostle John" when giving this message to John in 1John 4:1 - as so many have imagined the test to be.

In 1John 4 a test - is that they have to teach and promote the fact that Jesus is the Son of God who came in the flesh in the incarnation.

In Isaiah 8:20 the test is that the prophet's message claimed to be from God must also be judged by and tested by the doctrines as stated in the Bible itself. (This is why I find it pointless to discuss the subject of a true or false prophet with someone before first discussing the subject of basic Bible doctrines.)

3. And another example is that the message must be found to be accurate and true in terms of events, past, present, future as it is claimed that God is making the statement - God is giving the message to a prophet.

Just a few examples of this can be found here -
Predictions Claims - fulfilled:
http://amazingdiscoveries.org/S-prophecy-Ellen_White-true-predictions-Bible



WSJ (Wall Street Journal) 2013 independent article
JAMA 2013 Article confirms health results.

(Since a number of quotes and predictions at that link involve health -- it is Interesting that the Journal of the American Medical Assoc came out with this study related to health and Seventh-day Adventists --
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB100...41042514.html?mod=WSJ_hpp_MIDDLE_Video_second)

4. And as far as doctrine goes - there is always the fact that she agrees with the Bible on the subject of the origin of the Sabbath - right where the Baptist Confession of Faith - ALSO agrees is the Bible origin for Sabbath -- and yet you differ.


I think you would agree that her view that the Bible origin for the 4th Commandment as given to all mankind - in Eden - is in perfect agreement with the Bible and the Baptist Confession of Faith - 1689 - -but you choose to differ.

(And so an answer was posted)

What is the expected objective response?

is it "I don't care to look at the details in your response to my question for you - I just want to stick with acrimony and name calling" ??

I leave that as an exercise for the reader.

in Christ,

Bob

 

In the October 1871 issue of The Health Reformer, [1] Ellen White wrote of "hurtful indulgences" that militate against the highest interests and happiness of women. Among these "indulgences" she included wigs that, "covering the base of the brain, heat and excite the spinal nerves centering in the brain." As a result of "following this deforming fashion," she said, "many have lost their reason, and become hopelessly insane."


In the context of today's comfortable wigs, critics tend to ridicule this statement. But Mrs. White was referring to an entirely different product. The wigs she described were "monstrous bunches of curled hair, cotton, seagrass, wool, Spanish moss, and other multitudinous abominations." [2] One woman said that her chignon generated "an unnatural degree of heat in the back part of the head" and produced "a distracting headache just as long as it was worn."


Another Health Reformer article (quoting from the Marshall Statesman and the Springfield Republican) described the perils of wearing "jute switches"--wigs made from dark, fibrous bark. Apparently these switches were often infested with "jute bugs," small insects that burrowed under the scalp. One woman reported that her head became raw, and her hair began to fall out. Her entire scalp "was perforated with the burrowing parasites." "The lady . . . is represented as nearly crazy from the terrible suffering, and from the prospect of the horrible death which physicians do not seem able to avert." [3]


With reports such as this in the public press, it is easy to understand why Ellen White would warn women against the possible dangers of wearing wigs and trying to "keep pace with changing fashion, merely to create a sensation." [4]

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And yet we may find some mental health experts totally in favor of " "The lady . . . is represented as nearly crazy from the terrible suffering, and from the prospect of the horrible death which physicians do not seem able to avert." [3]" as a great example of perfect health - and the ideal way to apply the Bible doctrine on prophecy.

Who knows - maybe we will find such a person.

in Christ,

Bob

 

If you have a picture of a wig - then I don't know about anyone else - but that is all I need to know.

Thanks for your research.