Court Rules Mormon Church Outside Protestant Faith

[Marcia]

Yes! The Mormon Church is outside the Christian (article uses "Protestant") faith! This is a very significant victory for an appellate court to declare this. :thumbs:



Excerpt___In a remarkable decision an appellate court ruled that the Mormon Church is outside of the Protestant Faith.__
Source
http://wfiprestoncondra.blogspot.com/

 

[Revmitchell]

Is there an actual news article to this story?

 

[Marcia]

Is there an actual news article to this story?

I was having trouble copying part of the text to my post. I finally had to type out the first sentence. Maybe you were looking at it when nothing was showing up?

Here's the article link. What I had above was something posted on a blog.
ttp://www.nwanews.com/adg/News/239705/
Joel Rownak testified that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latterday Saints wasn’t a Protestant faith, and the court also considered evidence to that effect from the church’s Web site.
Lisa Rownak had objected to her ex-husband’s promoting Mormonism to their children.

 

[sag38]

Wow, a secular court recognizes what most Orthodox Christians already knew. Of course when the two guys with white shirts, ties, and riding bicycles visit you they will do everything they can to show you that they are Christians. In fact, the last time I was visited they lied right through their teeth about their doctrine. Finally I said to them, "If you believe just like me then you are at the wrong house. You need to be visiting my neighbor." Then the truth finally came out as one said, "Oh no, you don't understand. You have to be baptized into the Mormon church." Mormons are not Christians. A simple study of their origins and doctrine will prove this. They are a cult; no more and no less.

 

[bobbyd]

This is not really news since the Mormons will tell you the same thing. Those times i've had the opportunity to go one one one with LDS missionaries they were quick to inform me that they were neither catholic nor protestant and are a "restored" form of "christianity".

 

[Gold Dragon]

This is not really news since the Mormons will tell you the same thing. Those times i've had the opportunity to go one one one with LDS missionaries they were quick to inform me that they were neither catholic nor protestant and are a "restored" form of "christianity".

Agreed. Mormonism is historically part of the restorationist movement that considered Catholics and Protestants apostate and does not identify with the label of protestant anyway. I don't think this says anything about their classification as a Christian group.

 

[Marcia]

This is not really news since the Mormons will tell you the same thing. Those times i've had the opportunity to go one one one with LDS missionaries they were quick to inform me that they were neither catholic nor protestant and are a "restored" form of "christianity".

The news here is that a secular court recognized it. It's a significant victory, I would say - one that can be claimed in other courts because it's a precedent, and also can be used when speaking to those being recruited by Mormons, who are being led to believe otherwise.

 

[Gold Dragon]

Mormons, who are being led to believe otherwise.

Those Mormons do not know their own religion then.

LDS Newsroom: Who Are the Mormons
...
Values
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is a restoration of New Testament Christianity as taught by Jesus and His apostles. It is not Protestant, evangelical, Catholic or Orthodox
...

 

[Jon-Marc]

This is not really news since the Mormons will tell you the same thing. Those times i've had the opportunity to go one one one with LDS missionaries they were quick to inform me that they were neither catholic nor protestant and are a "restored" form of "christianity".

I personally knew a Mormon who claimed to believe the same as I do on everything I mentioned. Of course, it is possible that someone in any religion can be saved and still remain in that religion. I met a Catholic who assured me he was saved when someone came to his home and led him to the Lord. However, he said he liked the ritualism of the Catholic religion and chose to stay.

 

[Marcia]

LDS Newsroom: Who Are the Mormons
...
Values
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is a restoration of NewTestament Christianity as taught by Jesus and His apostles. It is not Protestant, evangelical, Catholic or Orthodox

Gold Dragon, the Mormons are good at double-speak. They are inconsistent all the time (like many cults). While this may be one of their official lines, the Mormon missionaries tell people they are trying to recruit that they are Christians and that Jesus Christ is their Savior. I know ex-Mormons who said they joined, thinking it was a Christian church.

A number of years ago, they changed the lettering of their name (the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints) so that the lettering "Jesus Christ" was bigger. They also changed other things in the Salt Lake City temple to appear more Christian. I heard about this from Christians who reach out to Mormons but it's on Wikipedia as well:

In 1995, the church announced a new logo design that emphasized the words "JESUS CHRIST" in large capital letters, and de-emphasized the words "The Church of" and "of Latter-day Saints". According to Bruce L. Olsen, director of public affairs for the church, "The logo re-emphasizes the official name of the church and the central position of the Savior in its theology. It stresses our allegiance to the Lord, Jesus Christ." __end quote

 

[Gold Dragon]

Gold Dragon, the Mormons are good at double-speak. They are inconsistent all the time (like many cults). While this may be one of their official lines, the Mormon missionaries tell people they are trying to recruit that they are Christians and that Jesus Christ is their Savior. I know ex-Mormons who said they joined, thinking it was a Christian church.

A number of years ago, they changed the lettering of their name (the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints) so that the lettering "Jesus Christ" was bigger. They also changed other things in the Salt Lake City temple to appear more Christian. I heard about this from Christians who reach out to Mormons but it's on Wikipedia as well:

In 1995, the church announced a new logo design that emphasized the words "JESUS CHRIST" in large capital letters, and de-emphasized the words "The Church of" and "of Latter-day Saints". According to Bruce L. Olsen, director of public affairs for the church, "The logo re-emphasizes the official name of the church and the central position of the Savior in its theology. It stresses our allegiance to the Lord, Jesus Christ." __end quote

It is not double speak to say you are Christian but not protestant. Many baptists say the same thing.

It is consistent with Mormon theology to say they believe they are Christians and that Jesus is their saviour.

Here is a quote from the same page I quoted above.

He sent His Son, Jesus Christ, to redeem mankind from their sins. Church members try to model their lives on the Savior’s teachings.

 

[Marcia]

It is not double speak to say you are Christian but not protestant. Many baptists say the same thing.

It is consistent with Mormon theology to say they believe they are Christians and that Jesus is their saviour.

Here is a quote from the same page I quoted above.

Well, I have to disagree because when Baptists say they are Christians, they are telling the truth. I see your point about being Christian but not being Protestant, however.

I know the Mormons say Jesus is their Savior but he is not the same Savior of the Bible or of Christianity. The Mormon Jesus is not part of a Trinity, he cannot save totally since works must be involved, he is a "child" of heavenly Father and heavenly Mother (as is Lucifer), and he is a spirit brother to us on earth, who are all (originally) spirit children begat in heaven by Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother.

The Mormon faith is more akin to Hinduism or mythology than to Christianity.

 

[Gold Dragon]

Well, I have to disagree because when Baptists say they are Christians, they are telling the truth. I see your point about being Christian but not being Protestant, however.

I know the Mormons say Jesus is their Savior but he is not the same Savior of the Bible or of Christianity. The Mormon Jesus is not part of a Trinity, he cannot save totally since works must be involved, he is a "child" of heavenly Father and heavenly Mother (as is Lucifer), and he is a spirit brother to us on earth, who are all (originally) spirit children begat in heaven by Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother.

I agree with you that Mormons have problems with their Christology. But they are telling the truth when they believe they are Christians and that Jesus is their saviour.

It is true that they do not conform with your definition of Christianity. But I also disagree if your definition is just protestants.

Combat Mormons for where they are wrong.

 

[Squire Robertsson]

One of the difficulties we have with the CJCLDS and other groupings is we both use the same vocabulary, but we use different dictionaries.

IOW, I say I believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God and my Mormon neighbor can truthfully make the same statement. However, on further examination and defining of terms, one can see that each statement has a different meaning.

 

[Gold Dragon]

One of the difficulties we have with the CJCLDS and other groupings is we both use the same vocabulary, but we use different dictionaries.

IOW, I say I believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God and my Mormon neighbor can truthfully make the same statement. However, on further examination and defining of terms, one can see that each statement has a different meaning.

Agreed. We should challenge Mormons on their incorrect Christology by examining why we have differences on what those words mean.

We should not make up accusations about them lying when they are not. All that does is weaken our position of being able to honestly address the issues.

 

[Squire Robertsson]

Agreed. We should challenge Mormons on their incorrect Christology by examining why we have differences on what those words mean.

We should not make up accusations about them lying when they are not. All that does is weaken our position of being able to honestly address the issues.

Let's be realistic but not soft on the topic. The Mormon position is unscriptural and thus heretical. So, yes, they are teaching and believing in a lie. But then, that's why the Word of God is spoken of as being sharper than a two edged sword able to divide asunder the soul and spirit and the joints and marrow. The Word leaves us no alternative but to label Mormon christology[1] as an error. There is no middle ground.

[1]The lower case "c" is not a typo. Their christ is not the same as the one whose title is spelled with a capitol letter.

 

[Marcia]

Agreed. We should challenge Mormons on their incorrect Christology by examining why we have differences on what those words mean.

We should not make up accusations about them lying when they are not. All that does is weaken our position of being able to honestly address the issues.

But the Mormon church often purposefully hides what they truly believe - and they have denied things they later admit. They are not straightforward at all. They also hide some of their past history - such as their teachings on blacks descending from the "evil" line of Ham. They used to not allow blacks certain positions and then changed so they could go into Africa, but they are not open about this past at all.

I do not use this as an apologetic; I only said this to answer you or explain other remarks made here. We are not talking about witnessing to Mormons but rather what the Mormon Church teaches and does.

I've dialogued and witnessed to several dozen Mormons who came to my apt. at my previous address. But that is not the topic here.